Ryan Tannehill is the reason the Dolphins lost this game | Page 11 | FinHeaven - Miami Dolphins Forums

Ryan Tannehill is the reason the Dolphins lost this game

I mentioned this before the season but the Chris Perkins prediction of 8-8 had me very worried. I seem to see eye to eye with him a lot and he tends to articulate the same issues I had going back to last season to a tee. So I naturally seek out his opinions as my window into what is really going on at training camp. The cliff notes of what he saw:
-defense looked at least as good, maybe even better this year
-Lazor's offense looks legit. He really likes the coaching schemes on both offense and defense.
-big upgrade at o-line
-Moreno was looking good

But the reason he could only predict 8-8 despite liking Lazor's offense was he didn't feel like we had the "personnel" to run it effectively. If you read between the lines its pretty obvious "personnel" is pretty specific to Tannehill. So the guy that saw this offense almost daily through the summer still didn't like what he saw from Tannehill even though pretty much everybody else was pretty excited about it. What were they seeing that was so exciting? Clearly it had its moments but were those moments with Tannehill or Moore in there?
 
Its very possible that Sherman's offense was always vanilla because of RT. People would always blame Sherman, but maybe he knew what RT could and couldn't do and he tried to shield him as long as possible.

Now, in a more complex offense, he's struggling badly. Going beyond that though, I have never seen him really read and dissect defenses. I mean like really scan the D and adjust. There are times when he has the blitz coming and its as if he didn't even notice the guys right about to storm the line (2 seconds later he's sacked). It's like when you see a running back and you can tell he's got bad vision, RT just can't read defenses either much at all or not fast enough. I am not sure if it's coaching, lack of preparation (doesn't do film study like say Zach Thomas would), experience, a mix of it all or what...

At the end of the day it just makes RT more and more a decent backup QB, nothing more.
 
This is so well put. I couldn't have said better. There is your answer Hoops on why we cannot run a fast tempo offense, because our QB has the football smarts of a brick.

100%. Qb is a total bimbo
 
I've commented before that going into the season, I thought Tannehill was the 20th best quarterback in the league.

Last week in my review, I thought he could be a game manager caliber starter like Alex Smith. It's clear now he won't even be that.

Start Matt Moore. He will help you in the turnover margin, and give you more explosive plays. The 2 most important things aside from scoring points. But those obviously lead to points.

I never thought Tannehill was "the answer" but I thought he would be able to manage the game. He can't even do that.
 
Right now the only starters I would take Tannehill over are: Geno, EJ, Bridgewater, Glennon, Locker, Hoyer, Fitzpatrick, and Austin Davis. So that would make him #24.

As far as young QB's I would rather build my team around: Luck, Wilson, Newton, Foles, Kaepernick, RG3, Cousins, Dalton, Carr, and Bortles
 
We played at Buffalo against Fury of Anti Revenge and then followed that against a 2013 playoff team in desperation road mode at 0-2. Negative situational spots. Next week we get a rookie quarterback. I don't care to look at anything else in a game like that. Miami should out score a rookie quarterback. The London games never interest me from a betting standpoint because everything I do is based on home and road characteristics and situational/statistical trends. London doesn't fit anything. I bet maybe one or two games there, other than London Monarch games years ago. New England played Tampa Bay in an obvious mismatch game. That's the only one I remember betting.

Regarding Tannehill, the good news is to get back to his normal 6.7-7.2 yards per attempt from college and pro he'll have to put together a stretch of games significantly above that level. Almost impossible to remain at his current level. I don't mind adjusting upward when it's sensible.

There's no black mark in overestimating Tannehill or Weeden. I'll make the same point I did in those pre draft threads: When the resume is very unusual the tape doesn't mean as much. It can fool the heck out of you. I don't want to invest a lot in a guy who spent the early stages of a race going in the wrong direction. I'm in my 50s and have experienced similar examples decades ago...often fooled until I pieced together the telltale trends and wised up. Unusual resume guys are nice investments in the later rounds or free agency. Don't aim your wallet at them. I'm convinced the franchises need lessons in probability and not merely tape evaluation.

Our tackling in the secondary is abysmal and it's hardly limited to Jimmy Wilson. Grimes flails around and gives up chunks of extra yards every game. Don't let the ripped fumble distract from how poor he is when an open field tackle needs to be made.
 
Hire Dan Quinn, Trade for Kirk Cousins, Draft Todd Gurley or Melvin Gordon. This team is a perennial playoff contender.
 
It is a step in the wrong direction, but if Moore started a few games we could assess is it the team or Tannehill.

I still think you stick with RT and see what happens over October.
 
Its very possible that Sherman's offense was always vanilla because of RT. People would always blame Sherman, but maybe he knew what RT could and couldn't do and he tried to shield him as long as possible.

Now, in a more complex offense, he's struggling badly.
Going beyond that though, I have never seen him really read and dissect defenses. I mean like really scan the D and adjust. There are times when he has the blitz coming and its as if he didn't even notice the guys right about to storm the line (2 seconds later he's sacked). It's like when you see a running back and you can tell he's got bad vision, RT just can't read defenses either much at all or not fast enough. I am not sure if it's coaching, lack of preparation (doesn't do film study like say Zach Thomas would), experience, a mix of it all or what...

At the end of the day it just makes RT more and more a decent backup QB, nothing more.

I made this statement many times last year and got KILLED for it here on FH. I do not expect any apologies though.
 
The mismatches off of formation etc that we saw the first 2 games were not there today...he's relying on curl routes with Wallace against off coverage to move the ball down the field on chunk yardage...if they don't start playing faster as in much faster and allowing for miscommunication and blown assignments off personnel and tempo this offense will die a slow death...

You can't just eat on curl routes to Wallace especially when he plays with no real rac ability in them or physicality...this team must work down the seam either by play design or with tempo and blown coverages etc...

The league is catching up with bill Lazor right now

The qb won't see a blown coverage. Every play he predetermines his throw. he stares at that throw and takes a sack forces it, or completes it.
When his one read is open on an intermediate route and he has to step in to it and gun it, he looks great!

stared down hartline on back to back plays and forced a bad throw. One should have been picked.
Sorry Hoops your guy just doesn't have the mental capacity, awareness, accurace etc to do it for us
 
I don't feel like responding piecemeal in a dozen different threads about why Ryan Tannehill was the reason we lost today by fans blaming receivers, Lamar Miller, or Jarvis Landry. I'm gonna put it all in here in no particular order.

1. 21-43 on the day at least through the actual meaningful portion, I stopped watching to see if he added on garbage in the last two minutes. You can't win the in the NFL completing less than 50 percent of your passes unless you are getting some real chunk plays. We know he is not capable of that. He had 3 actual drops in this game, most early on. Those three don't even begin to help him to respectable numbers.

2. 4.7 yards per pass, and that doesn't even include passing plays where he took a sack. This on a day where his running back averaged 7.2 yet was somehow not fed.

3. 13 first half points through three games, one of those coming on a short field turnover. Tannehill has scarcely played four good quarters of football in any game of his career through 2+ seasons, but now he is giving us 1 good quarter with 3 bad ones. That won us one game so far this year, and that is all it should, because you can't go into the second half of every game having to double the opponent's amount of points while holding them off. Tannehill was horribly off in the first halves of the last two games, and our poor offensive efforts then could really be safely placed on him. Today, it wasn't as easy because the receivers disappointed early. This is still a reflection of Tannehill. Right now the offense has accepted mediocrity and made it a habit and the first one on the team to do that was the starting QB. As the starting QB goes, so does the rest of the team. It's up to Tannehill to set the tempo and to energize the team. Other Miami QB's have done it. Pennington did it coming off a one win season and turned Camarillo into a consistent force. Fiedler somehow managed to do it and that was clearly evident that one game in Washington where he lead a stunning comeback. Moore did it a couple of games after replacing Henne, though he started slow after 3-4 games he was getting better play from nearly everyone on the field than they had in years. He can probably do it again.

4. In his one fine moment of the game, he lead the team to points at the end of the half. But while he should be commended for the fine two minute drill (which is all he seems capable of doing) he also made a critical mistake that took away the opportunity to score a TD. With twelve seconds left he tucked and ran from over ten yards out when he had no chance of scoring. This wasted the rest of the clock. If the pass wasn't there he needed to throw it away and take one more shot which would have hopefully been there. We needed a TD there. This lack of awareness is not something knew, its a pattern for Tannehill, something he showed when he prematurely slid in the Jets game and failed to get a first down, bringing up a 4th and 1 we didn't convert.

5. After a great KO he failed to gain a single yard on two pass attempts from around the thirty. This was exceptionally deflating in the game.

6. With Lamar Miller showing dominant YPC today, Tannehill had the pressure eased off him of carrying the team, which has been something he has unfortunately been asked to do too often. In the second half, with Miller running rampant, he failed to assist the running game in any way by scarcely completing a pass until the desperation drives near the end of the game.

7. The key point of the game came on 2nd and one in Chief's territory after another Lamar Miller run. On second and one we took a deep shot which didn't work, but on third and one Tannehill lost the game in one play by not only failing to get the first down, but also by looking off two WIDE OPEN receivers running out to the left past the first down markers and looking downfield instead, where the receiver wasn't open and he took a sack. Even had he thrown an incompletion we could have tried on 4th down to make the first if Philbin had balls, but he took a sack which forced us to punt. Game over as the Chiefs took the punt to our territory and scored a TD.

Other thoughts
1. Every game Tannehill plays is a game in which his team plays at a disadvantage because even with a deep threat like Wallace a team can take the deep ball away by playing single coverage, leaving more guys to smash the middle of the field and the opponent more at liberty to blitz, which attacks our weak offensive line and exposes Tannehil's biggest weakness of pocket presence.

2. It is three years in and Tannehill still has an ability to throw a full route tree that is slightly better than Chad Henne. Tannehill can throw touch inside the ten, but anywhere else he primarily can throw bullet passes and that's about it. He throws them a lot better than Henne, with much better ability to hit the sideline, but its still a very limited route tree. I thought the point of a first round QB was that he could throw passes that other QB's couldn't, theoretically giving you a chance to win games others couldn't. Tannehill has a smaller route tree than his backup and that becomes painfully obvious without an OC who only calls plays he can do. This offense is a beautiful thing if you can throw accurately and force the opponent to cover the whole field. Matt Moore will probably still throw some passes over the middle that are more inaccurate than they should be, but he can still throw touch passes with anticipation and deep passes that Tannehill just can't touch. That will open up the entire offense.

3. This is a league where backup caliber QB's everywhere seem to be able to have success and be playmakers right away. Drew Stanton is 2-0. Austin Davis had three TD's and over 350 yards. Brian Hoyer was a career backup and even with a weak arm he has the awareness and touch to attack every part of the field, which is with one of the worst receiving corps in the league. Derek Anderson dominated in week one by completing some 80 percent of his passes. Tannehill's best career games are in line with what these backup QB's can do on short notice, and that is not good enough.
4. There is always some reason why Tannehill fails to lead his team to where they need to be. The facts of the matter are that his points per game are amongst the worst among starting QB's throughout his career, and while you can blame player X and player Y for why things didnt happen on a given week, the fact of the matter is that after 30 some starts you will have enough opportunity to even this out. No other good player is this mediocre for this long. You are what you are.

Yeah he missed some throws but why does everyone look past all the drops and big drops at that (all 3rd downs in or about to be in chiefs territory) thats 100% not on him if our wr would have made some play with balls that were placed perfectly then what can T-hill do??

Oh and by the way we lead the league in drops by a mile we have like 14-15 through 3 games (and most of those drops prob way more than half are in the opponents territory or to continue a nice drive ) thats unreal to say the least and as I said yes he has missed some throws but theres been way more "huge" drive killing drops and missed oppty when were in scoring position. So in turn probably not talking about T-Hill at all cause his numbers would look a hell of a lot better thats for sure and wed prob would have beat KC and Buff.

Everyone thinks he's stinks cause he can't finish drives or make a play well I got news for you guys need to make routine catches and that 100% not on Thill.

Hartline/sims both dropped perfectly thrown deep balls for Tds. Hartline drops every third down pass now same with gibson, clay and **** even are rookie who is known for his hands dropped a crucial third down yest as well.

People need to open their eyes and not just blame the QB he's actually having a pretty good year if we could catch the damn ball esp in the opponents territory on nice drives. Our wr just completely kill momentum every game.
 
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The qb won't see a blown coverage. Every play he predetermines his throw. he stares at that throw and takes a sack forces it, or completes it.
When his one read is open on an intermediate route and he has to step in to it and gun it, he looks great!

stared down hartline on back to back plays and forced a bad throw. One should have been picked.
Sorry Hoops your guy just doesn't have the mental capacity, awareness, accurace etc to do it for us

it's looking that way
 
We played at Buffalo against Fury of Anti Revenge and then followed that against a 2013 playoff team in desperation road mode at 0-2. Negative situational spots. Next week we get a rookie quarterback. I don't care to look at anything else in a game like that. Miami should out score a rookie quarterback. The London games never interest me from a betting standpoint because everything I do is based on home and road characteristics and situational/statistical trends. London doesn't fit anything. I bet maybe one or two games there, other than London Monarch games years ago. New England played Tampa Bay in an obvious mismatch game. That's the only one I remember betting.

Regarding Tannehill, the good news is to get back to his normal 6.7-7.2 yards per attempt from college and pro he'll have to put together a stretch of games significantly above that level. Almost impossible to remain at his current level. I don't mind adjusting upward when it's sensible.

There's no black mark in overestimating Tannehill or Weeden. I'll make the same point I did in those pre draft threads: When the resume is very unusual the tape doesn't mean as much. It can fool the heck out of you. I don't want to invest a lot in a guy who spent the early stages of a race going in the wrong direction. I'm in my 50s and have experienced similar examples decades ago...often fooled until I pieced together the telltale trends and wised up. Unusual resume guys are nice investments in the later rounds or free agency. Don't aim your wallet at them. I'm convinced the franchises need lessons in probability and not merely tape evaluation.

Our tackling in the secondary is abysmal and it's hardly limited to Jimmy Wilson. Grimes flails around and gives up chunks of extra yards every game. Don't let the ripped fumble distract from how poor he is when an open field tackle needs to be made.

I watched the Raiders game yesterday and I was surprised at how good David Carr looked, I think that he's the real deal. I expect him to outplay Tannehill next week. His stat line wasn't all that good, but he kept the Raiders in the game and I think that the offense flowed pretty well with him, he played a smart game and looked accurate with a live arm. Tannehill had the higher QBR this week, and in my eyes that's an example of stats lying- Carr was far supeiror yesterday imo, not even close.
 
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