---- SI Team of Decade: Fins #17 | Page 3 | FinHeaven - Miami Dolphins Forums

---- SI Team of Decade: Fins #17

nyjunc said:
I don't think it's unfair at all, that D always folded in big moments and big games.

I ask again- what about the few years before he took over? What about '98 and '99?
Click to expand...


WHY did they "fold"? How about the games they won? We were unfair to them for feeling that way as fans when we should've had more disdain for the O. I'm speaking about Dolphin fans now because I know you are really only drawing assumptions from the small sample of games you actually watched (Jet-Phins, Playoffs, Monday nighters). This Defense, with the right person leading the offense and the right coaching staff, would've been more than enough to win a championship.

In terms of the years prior? JJ couldn't find Emmit smith or Larry Allen. He was too prideful to keep the ball in Marino's hands(in terms of actual games and draft strategy). He actually laid the fecal foundation for Wannstedt which was run the ball into the line, punt. It looked better with the Cowboys because of the personnel.
 
Dredd1050 said:
WHY did they "fold"? How about the games they won? We were unfair to them for feeling that way as fans when we should've had more disdain for the O. I'm speaking about Dolphin fans now because I know you are really only drawing assumptions from the small sample of games you actually watched (Jet-Phins, Playoffs, Monday nighters). This Defense, with the right person leading the offense and the right coaching staff, would've been more than enough to win a championship.

In terms of the years prior? JJ couldn't find Emmit smith or Larry Allen. He was too prideful to keep the ball in Marino's hands(in terms of actual games and draft strategy). He actually laid the fecal foundation for Wannstedt which was run the ball into the line, punt. It looked better with the Cowboys because of the personnel.
Click to expand...

You had Dan Marino still playing effectively and they got humiliated in back to back years. You can blame the o all yuo want but big time Ds at least keep their teams in games when the O is struggling.
 
nyjunc said:
You had Dan Marino still playing effectively and they got humiliated in back to back years. You can blame the o all yuo want but big time Ds at least keep their teams in games when the O is struggling.
Click to expand...

Tampa won a Super bowl with that philosophy.
 
Lappy said:
Tampa won a Super bowl with that philosophy.
Click to expand...

So did Baltimore. That O went about 5 games w/o a TD that year, the div playoff game they won at Ten the O scored 10 pts, at oak in the title game the O basically made 1 play and the D took care of the rest.
 
nyjunc said:
You had Dan Marino still playing effectively and they got humiliated in back to back years. You can blame the o all yuo want but big time Ds at least keep their teams in games when the O is struggling.
Click to expand...

Not struggling. Struggling is baltimore in 200 scoring FG instead of TDs. This offense, even some of Dan's last games and all the time with Fiedler, would give opposing defenses points. No defense could overcome those kinds of mistakes on a regular basis.

Marino wasn't effective in those games. The last playoff game he and the offense played well in was against Seattle.
 
nyjunc said:
So did Baltimore. That O went about 5 games w/o a TD that year, the div playoff game they won at Ten the O scored 10 pts, at oak in the title game the O basically made 1 play and the D took care of the rest.
Click to expand...

And, that same Baltimore Defense was NOT enough to win it all in 9 other years this decade....

So, is it NOT a SB-caliber defense because it failed 9 years out of 10???

Like I said, you need all the pieces working together. Offense, defense, coaching, and a little luck. It's the RARITY that a Defense carries everything on its own (ala 2000 Ravens). The NORM is that all pieces must work together, and a Top 5-6 defense is enough to be considered a SB-caliber defense in the NORM.
 
Dredd1050 said:
Not struggling. Struggling is baltimore in 200 scoring FG instead of TDs. This offense, even some of Dan's last games and all the time with Fiedler, would give opposing defenses points. No defense could overcome those kinds of mistakes on a regular basis.

Marino wasn't effective in those games. The last playoff game he and the offense played well in was against Seattle.
Click to expand...

But your D couldn't even keep your O in a game. That Den game was 21-3 at the half, the Jax game was 24-0 in the 1st qtr. That's not a big time defense. Look at baltimore, the Ravens had 4 TOs in the title game and that game was still w/in reach until late in the game. Big time D's make plays, they keep their teams in games. The Miami D never did that.
 
nyjunc said:
But your D couldn't even keep your O in a game. That Den game was 21-3 at the half, the Jax game was 24-0 in the 1st qtr. That's not a big time defense. Look at baltimore, the Ravens had 4 TOs in the title game and that game was still w/in reach until late in the game. Big time D's make plays, they keep their teams in games. The Miami D never did that.
Click to expand...

You have to go back and look at how those points were scored. I remember Miami turnovers leading to some of thos Jax scores and the same with Denver. Miami's D was SB calibur, 2000 Balt D top 3 of ALL TIME. You gotta give a little leeway on that one. I also realize that you are a jets fan and jaded that way, as I am a Phins fan and Jaded my way (the right way:d-day:) but my argument is that this team could've won a championship with better coaching and play from the offense, QB particularly. I think I have more who would agree than disagree from an NFL perspective as opposed tio just Phin fans. You even had Kirwin saying that Wannstedt wasted a good defense on Sirius. Kirwin knows a little bit about football, no?
 
Mile High Fin said:
And, that same Baltimore Defense was NOT enough to win it all in 9 other years this decade....

So, is it NOT a SB-caliber defense because it failed 9 years out of 10???

Like I said, you need all the pieces working together. Offense, defense, coaching, and a little luck. It's the RARITY that a Defense carries everything on its own (ala 2000 Ravens). The NORM is that all pieces must work together, and a Top 5-6 defense is enough to be considered a SB-caliber defense in the NORM.
Click to expand...

Did the Ravens ever get humiliated in postseason though? Miami did annually. bal made 3 more postseasons and lost by a total of 35 in those games which is 10 points less than Miami allowed in the jacksonville playoff game in '99.
 
Dredd1050 said:
You have to go back and look at how those points were scored. I remember Miami turnovers leading to some of thos Jax scores and the same with Denver. Miami's D was SB calibur, 2000 Balt D top 3 of ALL TIME. You gotta give a little leeway on that one. I also realize that you are a jets fan and jaded that way, as I am a Phins fan and Jaded my way (the right way:d-day:) but my argument is that this team could've won a championship with better coaching and play from the offense, QB particularly. I think I have more who would agree than disagree from an NFL perspective as opposed tio just Phin fans. You even had Kirwin saying that Wannstedt wasted a good defense on Sirius. Kirwin knows a little bit about football, no?
Click to expand...

Great D's make turn those TOs in FGs not TDs or even prevent the opponent from scoring at all. Obviously from time to time you will give up Tds but Miami's D consistently gave up TDs and games were over by halftime.

I wouldn't trust anything kirwin says, he ran our franchise into the ground.
 
Dolphins7273 said:
Because our offense sucked *** and the defense was on the field most of the time. By season's end, those guys were spent.
Click to expand...

How game Bal's D wasn't spent?

TOP:

Miami 1998: 32:19 OPP: 27:58
Miami 1999: 31:33 OPP: 28:26

Baltimore 2000: 26:26 OPP: 33:34


Do I need to go on?
 
nyjunc said:
Great D's make turn those TOs in FGs not TDs or even prevent the opponent from scoring at all. Obviously from time to time you will give up Tds but Miami's D consistently gave up TDs and games were over by halftime.

I wouldn't trust anything kirwin says, he ran our franchise into the ground.
Click to expand...

HAHAHA!! That he did, that he did. However, he does have a little credibility. All I'm saying is that Trent Green and a different HC instead of Jay Fiedler/Wanny would've won a Super Bowl with that personnel. Miami had the leading rusher in the NFL and the Sack leader and did not make the playoffs under that mo-mo.
 
nyjunc said:
How game Bal's D wasn't spent?

TOP:

Miami 1998: 32:19 OPP: 27:58
Miami 1999: 31:33 OPP: 28:26

Baltimore 2000: 26:26 OPP: 33:34


Do I need to go on?
Click to expand...

There are more variables involved than time of posession. The Dolphins ground game was over-utilized so they would have the ball for more time. But when you fumble and/or throw a pick at your own 20 yd line constantly, teams are going to score on you and score quick.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top Bottom