The Bottom Line Is That Huizenga Really Does Not Feel That Wale Is A Great Player.... | FinHeaven - Miami Dolphins Forums

The Bottom Line Is That Huizenga Really Does Not Feel That Wale Is A Great Player....

DIRTYCASHHOLDIN

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Hello to all the posters and fans around here. I just wanted to chime in here and get to the crux of the real problem on why Drew and Wale are so frustrated with this whole situation. And its right up there in my headline.... the Rosenhaus camp is simply perplexed and baffled that the DOlphins owner---really in his mind just is not convinced at all....that Ogunleye is a great player in this league, and should be paid....well....like a great player should be. Drew would like to have the chance to sit down with Mr. H and try to convince him why...with the film eveidence and a chart where WALE falls in relation to his peers in the league, production-wise. He is frustrated with the way WAYNE has come out publicly about WALE...as he stated that Jimmy Johnson once told him that "you pay a great player--a great salary....and you pay a good player....a good salary". Ask any of the Dolphin players privately...they all say WALE is indeed a great player....but then most will pause and say....."it does not matter what we think"...its really up to the man". And that man is Huizenga.....who many DOlphin players and of course....Drew and Jason now believe is the man who is pulling in the reigns...so to speak....and madating to both Bryan Weidmyer and Matt Thomas....to not give in on the demands that Drew is pounding his fist on...and that goes to the tune of a signing bonus in the neighborhood of 10 million dollars. That of course is the guaranteed money and this must be approved by Wayne himself. Weidmyer and Thomas cannot just say we are going to give you this amount....not without Wayne's approval...and right now the Dolphins are offering Drew half the amount that he is looking at...in the signing bonus...and that is that....talks are indeed going nowhere, and have ended without any signs of progressing....where its even worth talking about. This is going to be a nightmare for Drew...this is the most frustrated his close associates have ever seen him with regard to negotiations with the Dolphins....he has a great working relationship with Waynes front office....but this is the first time he has ever seen the Dolphins owner come out publicly with comments on regard to two of his clients....MARE and Ogunleye....and this has not made either player comfortable at all....but these actions by the owner....have put a very dark cloud over these negotiations....make no mistake about it. This is why recently Drew went to the media and stated why he likes DAN SNYDER so much....because he is the lead decision maker....and its so unlike the dolphins situation.....because he cannot get to Wayne....he cant convince him about Wale...he cant rebuttle the owners previous comments....he cant do a thing but deal with the middle men..a guy like Snyder is right there to tell Drew yes or no and a deal is either done right there or Drew leaves without a deal. In conclusion....this is a deal that will not get done....unless Wayne comes to the conclusion that Wale is a very, very valuable asset to the Dolphins...and gives his blessings to increase the signing bonus.....and two....Drew himself has to get a grip that Wale is not going to be the player that the dolphins break the bank for....not when he knows himself that he represents Randy Mcmichael....and along with him, Surtain, Chambers, and Ricky....they are all on the radar of guaranteed signing bonuses....what would be your pecking order of importance there, Drew....if you are the owner? That is a lot of money...that list. And the owner just thinks that out of all of them.....Wale is the least greatest of them all. How does this all play out.....I really don't see anything but a long battle here....and don't expect the Dolphins to trade Ogun anytime soon either. Lots of rumors....absolutely no substance. He cant be traded--unless he has a contract with the Dolphins. The Dolphins have never given Drew permission publicly to seek a trade....all Wanny has said....."if anyone is willing to give up a first and a third...we will listen"...and that was when the original high tender was on the table...now...of course...that tender stuff is all irrelevent....unless this goes on into the season. The Dolphins have done everything legal thus far....and have obeyed the CBA to the fullest degree...there is nothing Drew can do....but to keep poking away...pound his fists...and just keep posturing to get the Dolphins to increase that offer. This will go down as Drews toughest challenge....many people in the Dolphins inner circle are watching on how far Wayne will go with Wale.....the outcome of this stalemate will determine a statement line from the owner....one way or the other.
 
In order to be traded all O-Gun needs to do is sign the 1 yr tender offer

It's likely that $5 million represents the upfront bonus in 04 but Miami is probably offering a two-tiered signing bonus with an option payment in 2005 or 2006.

8 digit ($10 million + ) signing bonus upfront in 04 is reaching IMHO!

Just my $0.02
 
Clump....would You Give Ogun A 10 Million Dollar Signing Bonus...

Clump.....What did Jason Taylor get up front? What was his signing bonus? And my question is then....if you are the owner...you give Wale 10 million up front....then what is the signing bonus for a guy like Pat Surtain? what is Drew going to ask for when it comes to Mcmichael? And to extend Ricky with a bonus...11-12 million up front? You have to draw the line on Ogun if you are the owner, like Wayne is doing now.... but what is fair value? Does Wayne ignore the salaries of what comparable De's are getting throughout the league....that is not fair either. This is a very interesting player to rate.....ogunleye....because he really does see-saw back and forth on the border line of a great player.....I see personally.....JASON TAYLOR as a GREAT PLAYER for the DOLPHINS....I see WALE as a very, very good but not in that GREAT category...so I tend to agree more with Waynes philosophy here....although I would not be that stubborn enough to not compromise and negotiate a fair and just contract based on the comps for a player who has put up the stats that equals or is less than Wales achievements. Huizenga is misjudging what WALE means for that defense to be successful....Wale means a heck of a lot to the team concept...and that is an intangible that Wayne has to realize. The dropoff will be dualy noted if WALE is not in there...and this is why he has to come up and Drew has to come down...
 
I read that Drew wanted a signing bonus between KGB's ($11.6mill bonus) and Kearse's ($16mill bonus).

Is a $10mill bonus really all that Drew is asking for? I kinda find that hard to believe. Are the Fins only offering $5mill up front? They're really low-balling if that's the case.
 
I agree with ya DCH. I do NOT believe that O-Gun is in the same category as Jason Taylor, in fact, I believe he benefits greatly having JT on the opposite side, thus he's not the GREAT player but only a GOOD player. However, Miami has utilized two-tiered bonuses (Zach Thomas in 03) recently and I suspect they would be doing the same with O-Gun in a way to say, "show us you are a GREAT player". If for some reason he's not able to perform as in the past 2 seasons, then don't pay the second bonus and he becomes UFA, but the upfront money doesn't handcuff them with "dead cap".
Drew is shootin' for the moon on this deal.

Also, McMichael is also going to be just like O-Gun, looking for far too much $$. He's a GOOD TE not GREAT

Chambers will be a difficult situation because he truly deserves to be paid well. I classify him as VERY GOOD (in between GOOD and GREAT).

Surtain should be paid like Bailey, Nuff said
 
DIRTYCASHHOLDIN said:
JASON TAYLOR as a GREAT PLAYER for the DOLPHINS....I see WALE as a very, very good but not in that GREAT category......

I guess most of the NFL would agree with this assessment. No team was willing to give up 1st & 3rd picks to get him. Just a year earlier the Redskins gave up exactly that for L. Coles...so a precedent, no matter how unusual, has been set.
 
Here Is My List Of Great Players....

1. Ricky Williams 2. Jason Taylor 3. Patrick Surtain 4. Zach Thomas
 
Only 4 Great Players On This Team?

1. Ricky Williams 2. Jason Taylor 3. Patrick Surtain 4. Zach THOMAS CLOSE: TIM BOWENS, CHRIS CHAMBERS, DAVID BOSTON, JUNIOR SEAU (WAS) JENO JAMES, MCMICHAEL, OGUNLEYE...MADISON (WAS)
 
You do have to admit that while wanny's coaching is questionable, he has a knack for defense, and his instincts are telling him that Wally isnt as good as Drew thinks he is...

I actually trust wanny on this one....
 
Interesting thread, thanks for the insights DCH! I am slightly more comfortable with a 10M bonus (especially in a two - tiered proposal) than I am with the other rumors of 12-15 Million. But I agree that the team needs to look seriously at this -- I think Wale benefits from playing with Taylor as others have said.

-- Didn't Wayne come out about a month ago and say that this deal would get done?

-- I'm concerned somewhat about chemistry as well. You have JT saying earlier in the off-season that Wale needs to sign the tender and get back to work. You have Madison a week ago saying 'come to camp' over and over again. I wonder if the vets on this team that took the RFA tender and were rewarded are happy about this situation?
 
Pardon me for disagreeing in a way, however, didn't Wale lead the NFL in sacks last year? 15 to be exact? I think he is a necessity for this team and I'm not clear on why JT helped him attain all those sacks. Please clarify.
 
njfinfan said:
Pardon me for disagreeing in a way, however, didn't Wale lead the NFL in sacks last year? 15 to be exact? I think he is a necessity for this team and I'm not clear on why JT helped him attain all those sacks. Please clarify.

With Jason Taylor on the other side, Ogun doesn't have to face double teams. He gets matched up 1 on 1 every play and doesn't have to deal with the double and triple teams that JT faces. JT had 13 sacks last year with every team game planning against him. Wally does what he is suppose to do, he stops the run and can beat the opposing tackle. But if JT went down than I dont think Wally's production would remain up. He is still a very good player, but he isn't in JT's class yet.
 
First, let me say that I highly doubt that Wayne H. has stuck his nose into Bryan Weidemeyer's job. I highly doubt that Weidemeyer would stay with this team if the owner chose to do so. It has been widely reported that Weidemeyer's skills are second to none in the NFL.

With that said, Jason Taylor played out his 3 year 900,000 dollar contract after the draft. Then on August 24 of 2000 Jason Taylor signed his tender offer as an exclusive rights free agent. That's right, he played for four years for peanuts and then was slapped with the franchise tag in early 2001. Jason Taylor signed a 1 year, 5 million dollar contract on July 20, 2001. Three days after signing the one year deal he agreed to a six year 42 million dollar contract in 2001 with a 9 million dollar signing bonus.

The fact is that he dealt fairly with this team. He played out his original contract. He accepted the tender offer as an exclusive rights free agent. At the conclusion of that contract the Dolphins took no chances.

FRANCHISED!!!

Adewale Ogunleye has played out his original contract. He is an exclusive rights free agent. He chose not to sign his 1.8 million dollar tender offer. It does not take a math genius to figure out that someone is attempting to subvert the process. It is a process that a thousand other players have been through. Ogunleye (at the advice of his agent) has chosen his path. He will never see the contract that he could have seen next year at the conclusion his rights being owned by the original team. That's the path HE has chosen.

It's not what he has proven that is the issue. The issue is that there is an established process that an NFL player must endure. To subvert that process the player must acquiesce to a lessor value of his services. That value is somewhere near the Grant Wistrom contract.

That is just the way it is.
 
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