The Bottom Line Is That Huizenga Really Does Not Feel That Wale Is A Great Player....

[Muck]

I'd like to think that on passing downs the TE more often than not goes on a route or is replaced by a wide reciever.

There are far less passing downs in a game than non-passing downs. And it's still an additional man he has to account for and adjust his rush.

 

[Merman]

A player that wants to play for this team must demand a salary that fits inside our salary cap structure.

I must have missed that. Where does it say that??? Don't forget demanding and accepting are two different thoughts.

KGB is the top lineman on his team. The Packers wanted to get him signed to a long term deal the same way we were able to lockup JT (our top lineman). His value as the #1 DE on the team was set with the Eagles in pursuit. KGB didn't demand anything. He was willing to play for the 1.3 million tender.

Just what has that have to do with anything we are discussing??? Wasn't the point that Ogunleye doesn't deserve as much as KGB or wasn't as good???

Should Ogunleye demand to be paid better than Jason Taylor? I don't think so. Not if he wants to be a Dolphin.

Good opinion. Don't agree with it but good none the less.
BTW Taylor just received a $8.65 million bonus to extend his contract three years. So don't feel too bad for Jason.
2007 $7,000,000.00
2008 $7,500,000.00
2009 $8,000,000.00

Certainly this team is designed around the defense. And that is the clear priority. However, that imbalance must not continue to grow without limits. In fact, a major priority this off-season is to rebuild the offensive line and the cap has to reflect that bias.

Last I noticed the Dolphins are finished rebuilding the line and they are now trying to sign Ogunleye to an agreed amount.

Chambers is on the field working with the QB's and the new WR coordinator. He certainly has shown flashes of greatness. His opportunities have been limited because of the offensive design and rotisserie QB's. With Chambers now working out of the slot...he will have that opportunity to stake his claim to greatness. Spielman would love to get him signed to a long term deal now before his value goes up.

Randy McMichael has stated that he would like to get a new deal this year and there are multiple reports that Rosenhaus is trying to get that extention for him this year..."Yeah, I'm still one of the lowest-paid tight ends. I want my money, but I'm not going to let it consume me. I'm going to go out and let everything take care of itself. I do know one thing, this is going to be my over-the-hump year. This will be a big one for me."

Agreed.

I'm simply not convinced of Ogunleye's greatness. I think he is very good. But, I want to see him repeat what he did last year. Give him a 7 million dollar bonus, 6 year deal with incentives. If he performs...he get's more money.

The Dolphins can not afford to shell out big money when the market value does not demand it.

$7 million is not big money and $8 to 10 million is???

7/6=$1.167 per year.

10/6=$1.667 per year.

 

[ZOD]

Here is the NFLPA's history. Believe it if you want to or not.

http://www.nflpa.org/AboutUs/main.asp?subPage=History


As for what is fair, that is a judgement call. If you think obeying the agreed upon rules between ownership and employees is fair then both signing the required tender and not signing it are both honorable and fair. Both courses of action are allowed with not signing the required tender the harder road.

The second meaning of fairy tale is: 2. A fictitious, highly fanciful story or explanation. That is certainly the case when it is stated that the fair course of action is only one way when there are two according to the rules.

I know the meaning of fairy tale just as I know the meaning of fair.

I work under a contract. As in any contract there are different courses of action that the two parties may take. Collectively if one side chooses to take the "coarse" of actions in a contract you will find it doesn't endear one side to the other. It actually promotes distrust among the two parties.

Personally, I think the NFL has decided to leave the issue as a wedge or an arbitor between the two parties which forces the issue to be resolved. It remains the two parties responsibility to get it done.

I just call them as I see them. Then again, I have always been accused of understanding the employers side all too well. It's the main reason I don't throw my hat into the steward's arena. The conservative in me still recognizes the superiority of an employer as they are indeed providing for the many and I just a few.

BTW the history of the NFLPA is about as much of a fairy tale as anything.

The NFLPA has been the "lap dog" of New York since it's existence. They attempt to celebrate Radovich and McNeil but they won nothing in their suits. Their contract is about as fair as the hierarchy that existed in Moscow. If this indeed was a fair and honorable union one guy wouldn't make 200,000 playing beside another making 12 million. I laugh when I hear this organization refered to as a union. It's a tool.

 

[PhinstiGator]

I must have missed that. Where does it say that??? Don't forget demanding and accepting are two different thoughts.

I thought demanding was not accepting.

Just what has that have to do with anything we are discussing??? Wasn't the point that Ogunleye doesn't deserve as much as KGB or wasn't as good???

KGB was rewarded as the top DE on his team. IMO, that does not equate to Ogunleye.

Good opinion. Don't agree with it but good none the less.
BTW Taylor just received a $8.65 million bonus to extend his contract three years. So don't feel too bad for Jason.
2007 $7,000,000.00
2008 $7,500,000.00
2009 $8,000,000.00

That makes a terrific argument why we can NOT keep pouring money into the DE position. I'm glad that JT got the guaranteed money...but, those last three years are not set in stone (as we witnessed with Sam Madison's large contract). Jason may have to do a few more Neutrogena commerials to pay the bills.

It also shows that the Dolphins do reward players that perform. Ogunleye could easily upgrade his contract a couple years down the road if he continues to repeat last years performance.

Last I noticed the Dolphins are finished rebuilding the line and they are now trying to sign Ogunleye to an agreed amount.

Maybe...as long as everyone stays healthy. However, Spielman will continue to look to upgrade if any players become available. We have the room to add a player or two, sign the rookies, and try to extend any contracts to create cap room for next season.

$7 million is not big money and $8 to 10 million is???

7/6=$1.167 per year.

10/6=$1.667 per year.

The difference between 7 million and 10 million is 3 million. Obviously, if Ogunleye suffers an unfortunate circumstance...the Dolphins are the ones left bearing the cost. There is always a risk. The Dolphins have to decide where they want to place that risk.

If a 10 million bonus is only 1.667 million a year, then why not a 12 million dollar bonus? That's only 2 mill a year. If 2 million is no big deal, then why not a 15 million dollar bonus for 2.5 a year? We just made a tastey palletable move from 7 mill to 15 mill and the difference is less than 1.5 million per year. Yet the risk is huge, the Phins could get stuck with a supersized dead cap. Dead cap is bad. It must be minimized.

That being said...Ogunleye is set to make a ton of money if he stays with the Dolphins. The market has set his value lower than he would like this year. But, next year is a different story.

Just my unprofessional opinion...I think a 7 million dollar bonus is both fair and reasonable for a player that went undrafted and whom no other team was willing to give up a first round draft pick. And DE is a position of strength for the team with quality players that rotate playing time in both Jay Williams and David Bowens.

 

[inFINSible]

Merman, I can't tell you who plays on the other side from KGB, or Strahan, or Kearse....I can't tell you how much they make either....but, I'd be willing to bet that whoever they are, they don't make as much as the marquee guy on the other side.

 

[Merman]

Merman, I can't tell you who plays on the other side from KGB, or Strahan, or Kearse....I can't tell you how much they make either....but, I'd be willing to bet that whoever they are, they don't make as much as the marquee guy on the other side.

Good point but you forgot they don't play as well as them either. :)

BTW I have never said the Prince should make as much as Taylor at this point in his career. Taylor received a $9 million bonus back in 2001. Right now Wale is playing as well as Taylor when he got his big deal but he is still a RFA. So a bonus for $8 to $10 million now is less. At the time Taylor got the biggest contract ever now that bar is at $18 million for Kearse. The salary cap back then was $67.4 million.

http://espn.go.com/nfl/s/2001/0305/1130374.html

As a matter of fact the last big thread about what Wale's compensation should be I said: 6 years total $25 to $30 million with an $8 to $10 million signing bonus. I was told then that Rosenhaus would scoff at that. Now some think it's too much. :tongue:

How about the point I was making??? If Jason Taylor makes Adewale Ogunleye a great player how come these other great DEs don't have their own great counter part on the other side??? :idea:

Of course we all agree that Jason is the best DE though some might argue for Strahan. :argue:

 

[inFINSible]

I agree that Wale is talented, and deserves good money but, I don't think any team can afford to pay two "number 1" defensive ends. That's my main gripe. We have already commited big $$ to our top pass rusher........I think the role can be filled much cheaper than having to pay through the nose for another "number 1".

 

[Merman]

I agree that Wale is talented, and deserves good money but, I don't think any team can afford to pay two "number 1" defensive ends. That's my main gripe. We have already commited big $$ to our top pass rusher........I think the role can be filled much cheaper than having to pay through the nose for another "number 1".

Well you are certainly entitled to your opinion but it seems short sighted to me. The Dolphins may be able to wrap up a first team pro-bowl honored star DE for much less than he will get on the open market and many fans are crying about it???

They are worried about signing players in the future that are good players but have not yet shown the brilliance of Ogun. Flashes yes not one elite year and another great season performance like Wale. Ricky's not included here as he is a great player and is under paid. Yet he too will not get his money this year. Let's face it he doesn't want his increase this year with a 4 game fine looming. Why just give it up to the league??? Well maybe, don't they give it to charity???

Did you also say the Dolphins couldn't afford to pay two star CBs and a really good third down CB too???

Let the Dolphin's F.O. worry about the future salary cap that just went up $5 million this year. A salary cap friendly deal can and most likely will be hammered out.

They could follow the type deal that Bulger signed but with a smaller signing bonus. The deal is for 4 years and is meant to be restructured in 2 years. Of course then fans will be crying that we should have locked him up back in 2004.

Or they could fall back to the one year required tender with incentives amounting to a $3 million deal. No matter the no one year deal posturing as something is better than nothing.

The situation does not have to be painted so black. Rosenhaus does have a track record of getting deals done at the last minute. :)

 

[Superself]

I agree that Wale is talented, and deserves good money but, I don't think any team can afford to pay two "number 1" defensive ends. That's my main gripe. We have already commited big $$ to our top pass rusher........I think the role can be filled much cheaper than having to pay through the nose for another "number 1".

The role is to play at a pro bowl level. We have nobody on our roster who can do it as good as OGUN has. Our defense will suffer as a result.
Going the cheaper route brings our defense down a few notches.
If Miami expects to win a championship next season, we can't go into it half ****ed on that side of our line and expect it to be as productive.