Tua will get offered 35-38 million per at best if Dolphins lose in KC | Page 17 | FinHeaven - Miami Dolphins Forums

Tua will get offered 35-38 million per at best if Dolphins lose in KC

Springveldt said:
I'd expect it to be a 5 year deal. Just looking at other deals out there that got done recently with their guaranteed money and injury guarantee.

Watson - 230M
Burrow - 219M
Herbert - 193M
Jackson - 185M
Hurts - 179M
Wilson - 165M
Murray - 160M

So I'd expect Tua to be in between Hurts and Murray if he's taking a "team friendly" deal.
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Not unrealistic.

I prefer letting him play out the 5th year before doing a new contract, but can certainly see it both ways. There are advantages/disadvantages either way.

As far as slotting him on that list, Watson, Murray, and Wilson are all terrible contracts (from the team's perspective). I throw those out in my reasoning if I'm a GM.
 
MARINO1384 said:
5 year 210 170-180 is my guess. Gives him top 10 average yearly and think 170-180 would be like 6th in guaranteed money. Would be fair on both sides while also giving Miami cap flexibility the next few years.
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Yeah, I wouldn't be surprised to see that at all. I was thinking it may end up being something like 5 years, 230M with $170-180M in guarantees. If Miami uses void years on the contract you can split the guarantees over a longer period and you might end up with his 2024 and 2025 cap hits being under $20M each year before it goes to over $30M in 2026.
 
Mach2 said:
Not unrealistic.

I prefer letting him play out the 5th year before doing a new contract, but can certainly see it both ways. There are advantages/disadvantages either way.

As far as slotting him on that list, Watson, Murray, and Wilson are all terrible contracts (from the team's perspective). I throw those out in my reasoning if I'm a GM.
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I honestly think he refuses to play the 5th year and sits out if that is the case. I know I'd do it in his position. He's done everything the team has asked of him and he's stayed healthy this year. There is no way I'd risk an injury in 2024 playing for $23M when a new deal will guarantee you 7 or 8 times that. I'd be telling the team that it's put up or shut up time.

Hindsight is a great thing but at the time those deals where mostly seen as a natural progressions for QB's. The only deal that made most people go "WTF?" is the Watson deal. In a few years time we may be looking at Hurts, Herbert and Burrow deals as being terrible as well but just now most people think "that's the going rate for a top QB".
 
Springveldt said:
What your expectation of "don't going well"?

What if next season Miami wins 11 games again, finishes 2nd in the division, makes the playoffs and gets bounced in the WC round while Tua yet again posts a passer rating over 100? Would you just let him walk, fire McDaniel and start all over again after 3 straight seasons of playoffs?

With Tua's passing efficiency in this system there is a good chance Miami wins nearly all games again against poor defences so I'd expect them to be playoff contenders at a minimum next season again.
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Not going well means more of doing the same as the last two years with late season collapses and not being able to beat good teams. Tua struggling in those games and McDaniel having the same bad playcalling.
 
Springveldt said:
I honestly think he refuses to play the 5th year and sits out if that is the case. I know I'd do it in his position. He's done everything the team has asked of him and he's stayed healthy this year. There is no way I'd risk an injury in 2024 playing for $23M when a new deal will guarantee you 7 or 8 times that. I'd be telling the team that it's put up or shut up time.

Hindsight is a great thing but at the time those deals where mostly seen as a natural progressions for QB's. The only deal that made most people go "WTF?" is the Watson deal. In a few years time we may be looking at Hurts, Herbert and Burrow deals as being terrible as well but just now most people think "that's the going rate for a top QB".
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I doubt he would refuse to play, but even if he did, he still isn't a FA because he chose to sit out. The organization would still hold his rights.

Then what? Tua sits out again losing another year in his prime as well as the $.

If I'm GM, no way I let myself be held hostage in that situation. He's under contract. I'm all for player's rights, for example I think the franchise tag is unfair to players, but the NFLPA negotiated the system. Honor the contract.

And please, I hope no one starts the "teams don't honor contracts" nonsense. Contracts are very specific and spelled out in detail. Teams would end up in court on the wrong side of judgements if they didn't honor the letter and legalities of contracts.
 
Ryan1973 said:
Ya the solution is to start winning those games!
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Ahhh.....the "I want to bitch about it, but I don't have a better solution stance" answer. Not sure that is such a good plan!

No offense Ryan, but you have been pretty active in your dislike for the QB situation, which is your choice but you may want to start thinking about what the path would be if you got your wish......

You get angry when people don't agree with you or counter your rants about Tua, but you offer no solutions other than to complain. I would work on that if I was you......
 
Bob512 said:
Ahhh.....the "I want to bitch about it, but I don't have a better solution stance" answer. Not sure that is such a good plan!

No offense Ryan, but you have been pretty active in your dislike for the QB situation, which is your choice but you may want to start thinking about what the path would be if you got your wish......

You get angry when people don't agree with you or counter your rants about Tua, but you offer no solutions other than to complain. I would work on that if I was you......
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I don’t care what you think! I never asked you to reply in the first place! This place is for everybody to give their own opinions. You have yours and I have mine. But Tua is not a franchise QB!
 
Ryan1973 said:
I don’t care what you think! I never asked you to reply in the first place! This place is for everybody to give their own opinions. You have yours and I have mine. But Tua is not a franchise QB!
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No problem....you were asked by another poster for your solution and you didn't answer him. I thought I would inquire as you spend a lot of time bashing the "tuanons" (your word) about their support of Tua and yet don't seem to ever have a solution for what you would do instead of Tua.

No need to get snippy. You keep doing you......for some of us, your response just gives more clarity to your posts.....
 
Springveldt said:
I'd expect it to be a 5 year deal. Just looking at other deals out there that got done recently with their guaranteed money and injury guarantee.

Watson - 230M
Burrow - 219M
Herbert - 193M
Jackson - 185M
Hurts - 179M
Wilson - 165M
Murray - 160M

So I'd expect Tua to be in between Hurts and Murray if he's taking a "team friendly" deal.
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Well thought out Sir!
 
Mach2 said:
I doubt he would refuse to play, but even if he did, he still isn't a FA because he chose to sit out. The organization would still hold his rights.

Then what? Tua sits out again losing another year in his prime as well as the $.

If I'm GM, no way I let myself be held hostage in that situation. He's under contract. I'm all for player's rights, for example I think the franchise tag is unfair to players, but the NFLPA negotiated the system. Honor the contract.

And please, I hope no one starts the "teams don't honor contracts" nonsense. Contracts are very specific and spelled out in detail. Teams would end up in court on the wrong side of judgements if they didn't honor the letter and legalities of contracts.
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I know the org would still hold his rights but this is a win now business and would Grier and McDaniel really want to play a full season without him?

I guess we will see but I'll be very surprised if he suits up week 1 without a new deal.
 
Springveldt said:
I know the org would still hold his rights but this is a win now business and would Grier and McDaniel really want to play a full season without him?

I guess we will see but I'll be very surprised if he suits up week 1 without a new deal.
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And if they were "winning" anything now your point would have more validity. Exactly what have they won? A playoff berth?

I know that's a positive step up the ladder, but let's not act like we are winning division titles and making deep playoff runs.
 
Ryan1973 said:
I don’t care what you think! I never asked you to reply in the first place! This place is for everybody to give their own opinions. You have yours and I have mine. But Tua is not a franchise QB!
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I really hope the 1973 in your name isn't your year of birth. Bc if so, I'm reading something from a 50-year old toddler.
 
Mach2 said:
I doubt he would refuse to play, but even if he did, he still isn't a FA because he chose to sit out. The organization would still hold his rights.

Then what? Tua sits out again losing another year in his prime as well as the $.

If I'm GM, no way I let myself be held hostage in that situation. He's under contract. I'm all for player's rights, for example I think the franchise tag is unfair to players, but the NFLPA negotiated the system. Honor the contract.

And please, I hope no one starts the "teams don't honor contracts" nonsense. Contracts are very specific and spelled out in detail. Teams would end up in court on the wrong side of judgements if they didn't honor the letter and legalities of contracts.
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I think Tua absolutely would refuse to play, as anyone in his position with a competent agent would do. Tua doesn't want to lose a year in his prime? Do the Dolphins want to lose a year with a stopgap QB?

Lamar Jackson called this bluff pretty effectively without even having an agent. Ravens basically told him to go out and get an offer from someone else, which he didn't get, and they STILL paid him huge money. Now in hindsight it looks like a good decision, but it was a bad look how they handled it and they could've saved themselves a lot of time and trouble to end up where they ended up anyways.
 
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