Wannstedts' poor drafts killing us now | Page 3 | FinHeaven - Miami Dolphins Forums

Wannstedts' poor drafts killing us now

Originally posted by Saint Greg


Well....I watch every game....Jacox and Bentley started at guard. Folau and Holland came in on the last series.
Click to expand...

I watched the game, they said Holland was starting. You're a Saints fan so I'll go with your thoughts on that one.

As for having starters come out of your drafts, this team has way more talent than the Saints. There is no way that even half of those players that start for you would start for this team.

9 of 11 on defense are Pro Bowlers. You don't get very many of those from a draft. Who could we have replaced as a starter on our defense? One of the 2 is a guy we drafted and starts. The other was a FA pickup and plays near a Pro Bowl level in Chester.

Our offense of those 10 guys you mention maost wouldn't start either. I hate Aaron Brooks and don't think he'd start here. McAllister wouldn't start here. Stallworth is the only guy that starts out of those ten that I see starting here.

When you have a talented team it skews the numbers you're referring to. The Cardinals have something like 16 starters drafted from the previous three drafts. Have they drafted well? Looking at their record I'd have to say not really.

We have drafted fine with the picks we have.
 
The saints may have 10 starters and 4 backups from

Originally posted by Saint Greg


I have to disagree with you. If you only have 5-8 players on your roster after 3yrs of drafting, you have problems with talent evaluation.

If you look at the saints drafts between 2000-2002....we have 14 drafted players currently on our roster....10 starters, 4 backups....we also have players we drafted that are doing well for other teams...such as Marc Bulger and Chad Morton.

Now it's true that we had an extra 1st in 2002 because of ricky williams....but we lost 1st and 3rds in 2000 because of ricky, so i think it more than evens out.
Click to expand...

their past three drafts, however the saints aren't lighting up the football field this year, so keeping fodder on your roster doesn't justify great drafting either.
 
Re: The saints may have 10 starters and 4 backups from

Originally posted by rhadaddy


their past three drafts, however the saints aren't lighting up the football field this year, so keeping fodder on your roster doesn't justify great drafting either.
Click to expand...

Our defense isn't quite there yet. Going into the season i felt like we still needed at least one more offseason. Then the injuries made it worse. Give it time. Our team will improve as we continue to draft well. Your team will continue to go down as you continue to lose Jimmy Johnsons players. You'll get by for a few years plugging in an aging free agent here and a lucky draft pick there...but it iwill catch up with you at some point.
 
Originally posted by PhinsmissedFG


I watched the game, they said Holland was starting. You're a Saints fan so I'll go with your thoughts on that one.
Click to expand...


Don't take my word for it.....go to NFL.com and checkout the gamebook.

Originally posted by PhinsmissedFG

As for having starters come out of your drafts, this team has way more talent than the Saints. There is no way that even half of those players that start for you would start for this team.

9 of 11 on defense are Pro Bowlers. You don't get very many of those from a draft. Who could we have replaced as a starter on our defense? One of the 2 is a guy we drafted and starts. The other was a FA pickup and plays near a Pro Bowl level in Chester.

Our offense of those 10 guys you mention maost wouldn't start either. I hate Aaron Brooks and don't think he'd start here. McAllister wouldn't start here. Stallworth is the only guy that starts out of those ten that I see starting here.

When you have a talented team it skews the numbers you're referring to. The Cardinals have something like 16 starters drafted from the previous three drafts. Have they drafted well? Looking at their record I'd have to say not really.

We have drafted fine with the picks we have.
Click to expand...

It all depends on the team...Like you say none of our defensive starters we drafted would start for you....I can go with that...I think at least Charles Grant would have a shot.....But that's fine. But then you go over to offense. In the past 2 years We've drafted 3 Offensive lineman that could start for you right now....2 of them are backups for us....but they would start for you. It goes both ways....you starting LT....wouldn't have a prayer starting on our team.

As for the cardinals...i don't care about them...i'm talking about the saints and dolphins....same record last year.....we're 1 behind you this year....equal talent level.

I wasn't counting brooks as one of those players...we didn't draft him...green bay did...but we did trade a draft pick for him. He is a very good QB, if i were a dolphin fan, i'd want him. Dont' tell me you think Ricky is better than Deuce......look at the numbers my friend....it isn't even close.
 
we have pretty high profile teachers as far as taking a look at history and changing it to suit our needs. the FO thought mark dixon was going to play this year. the o-line did a nice job of run blocking last year, but it looks like nails hasn't recovered. the FO got the LT they wanted and they got a LB. would smith be playing any better if they had picked him at #49? watch some 49er games and see one of the turnstiles we were trying to trade up for. LT is a tough position to play as a rookie, and after gandy priced himself out of the market, the team was counting on dixon. yeah, it sucks, but we have the benefit of looking back. i was happy with the offseason coming into the year, and i think a lot of others here were happy as well. dixon's injury has changed the outlook, but there's nothing that can be changed now.
 
Originally posted by BSQX4
Look at who Dave has drafted and it's apparent that someone else should be doing the job. As years pass and players from the Jimmy era are replaced by Daves' picks the talent level drops. The facts:2000 Todd Wade, Arturo Freeman 2001 Jamar Fletcher, Chris Chambers( great pick) , Marlon Greenwood, Travis Minor 2002 Seth Mckinney??, Randy McMichael ( a gem in the 4th round) Omare Lowe?? Leonard Henry, Sam Simmons 2003 Eddie Moore( I guess we didn't really need a LT??????), Wade Smith( bad week to evaluate him) Donald Lee, Taylor Whitley, J.R. Tolver. Bottom line: Chambers and McMichael are budding stars and that's it for 4 years. Awful job, just terrible. There are some other starters but nobody that's going to any Pro Bowls IMO.
Click to expand...

Might wanna add Ricky Williams to that list since he cost us two #1's. Not a very fair evaluation without that addition.

Overall, I think Wanny and Co have drafted fine. Not alot of teams out there have done better.
 
I Agree and Disagree

Originally posted by fin-atic
I agree. I made a big deal on this board about our lack of off season productivity. And I caught grief left and right abut it. We missed big time. Specifically considering that after the end of the season in 2003 everyone knew we were at a desperate situation on the offensive line. We did nothing to get better. And we all got excited to get Seau and Knight, but what have they done? Are we any better on the books then when we had Rodgers and Freeman? Or are we enough better to justify not having Gandy or trading up higher to get a stud lineman?

The front office really dropped the ball on this area of need. And they are in trouble now because I don't think it can be sovled this year.
Click to expand...

It's easy to say "we missed" on players due to how people are playing right now, but the fact is there weren't alot of players out there at positions we needed to upgrade. Take OL for example....Kyle Turley was hands down the best available player out there and there is no way we could afford him......so of those guys that were priced right who would have improved us? The fact is there were not any players out there that we could afford any better than what we had...IMO
 
You know want to know what really hurt us?Drafting a OLB to play special team when we had Anquan Boldin on the phone.We have no production from Wr's other than Chambers.
 
I think there is actually some merit to the Fins record over the years causing low draft picks. Sure, you go 8-8 or 10-6 every year, but getting quality first rounders is hard in the 16-32 slots in the draft. You do find jems like Marino, Moss, and Kearse occasionally, but honestly you need hit on a top 5 pick every 5 years to get a stud. Look at the losing cycle the Colts went through and they ended up with Manning and James. Either the Fins need to tank a couple years or trade up. Anyone of the opinion that some NFL teams lose on purpose at the end of the season to get high draft picks?
 
Originally posted by minus
You know want to know what really hurt us?Drafting a OLB to play special team when we had Anquan Boldin on the phone.We have no production from Wr's other than Chambers.
Click to expand...

true. i think the staff was counting on thompson to be something he (so far) hasn't shown. if he continues to be a non-entity in the passing game, i'm looking for one of the young guys to get some p.t.
 
Originally posted by RikWriter
You said it man. Who DIDN'T know that we needed to address our O line this offseason? Apparently only Dave Wannstedt and Rick Spielman.
Click to expand...

This is right. But, we've needed OL help for years! Years! We should have gone after an OL when we drafted Fletcher!

DW is an idiot. He has scrapped together an OL - which is the foundation of an offense. Sorry but 3rd round draft picks - I don't care HOW many years you do that - will not get you a great OL - unless you are a lucky genius like Jimmy Johnson.

Johnson got Larry Allen and that other Behemoth (RT - # 79 - Williams?) in late rounds. But, since then, everyone goes after those giants - I think Wanny expects to get those guys every year by drafting them late. Its absurd. He blew it with this team several years ago in his 1st couple of drafts.

Too bad.
 
Originally posted by Da 'Fins


This is right. But, we've needed OL help for years! Years! We should have gone after an OL when we drafted Fletcher!

DW is an idiot. He has scrapped together an OL - which is the foundation of an offense. Sorry but 3rd round draft picks - I don't care HOW many years you do that - will not get you a great OL - unless you are a lucky genius like Jimmy Johnson.

Johnson got Larry Allen and that other Behemoth (RT - # 79 - Williams?) in late rounds. But, since then, everyone goes after those giants - I think Wanny expects to get those guys every year by drafting them late. Its absurd. He blew it with this team several years ago in his 1st couple of drafts.

Too bad.
Click to expand...

what OL were available in fletcher's spot? if we're going to rewrite, let's rewrite with all the facts in front of us. who were you looking at there?

isn't it generally accepted that tackles not picked in the top 10 are a crapshoot? kwame harris has been getting slapped around like smith in san francisco, but there were no idiots involved in his selection. he's a great o-lineman because of where he was chosen. c'mon, it takes all of them a while to learn the position. wade smith is still a bargain and still has all the potential he woke up with on sunday.
 
Deuce is not even in ricky's league. If you think otherwise you're in the minority. Aaron Brooks is terrible and I can find quite a few articles that says the front office thinks so too.

One of the players you have starting for you is a castaway in Jacox. Riley is decent but isn't as good as Wade. Gandy is good but in two years I think Wade Smith will be better. O-line is the only place you can go and say your team has as much talent, come on man the Phins are loaded. They just have no coach. It has nothing to do with drafts and everything to do with coaches.

I'll take drafts that net us one superstar every year over drafts that net three or four starters who are decent.

Chambers and McMike will be in several Pro bowls and neither cost a first. Ricky will be in several Pro Bowls and will do better than just about any first rounder in the next five years.

I'll take that production.

BTW, Montrae Holland was listed as starting against the Bucs by Fox yesterday. Might wanna set them straight there. My friend got the game on tape because my friend is a big Bucs fan.
 
ALL i can say is GOODBYE DAVE WE WONT MISS YOU!!!!!! We cant give him credit for Sammy Knight, Jr Seau, Buckley, Griese, or any of the free agents because they all FELL in his lap, were very lucky we got the FA we did. Also Ricky williams. Dave did a pisspoor job in the draft we passed up a ton of stars for some ****ty OT and lineman we cant even use.
 
Just because the players we have our developing slower than some other players doesn't mean they won't be superstars in a few years.

Rod smith was on a practice squad. Jimmy Smith as well. Donald Driver a 6th rd pick. Many other players (not to mention many on our damned team) have turned out to develop later on.

Anquan Boldin is playing well, but Wade Smith could be very good in a few years and it's a heck of a lot harder to find a LT than it is a WR.

I'm fine with our drafts, if we had a time machine I'd change some picks. Although if I were to change anything at the time I'd have taken Brees and he would have been a bust, among not drafting Chambers (thought he had no hands) so hey we all can go back and pick and choose who we should have taken where.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top Bottom