We Still Need Another Big DT!

[Awsi Dooger]

For at least 3 years I've been desperate for a young and extremely athletic upfield DT. IMO, that's always been the missing piece to put our D at Super Bowl caliber or close. A guy like that shortens the play and instantly makes other defenders better than they are. You won't have the late game defensive collapses if you've got a monster inside who disrupts plays and hassles the QB for 60 minutes.

The dilemma is where to find one. McFarland has some of those qualities when he's in shape and in the mood. No doubt too expensive and among 32 teams we're a huge longshot. As a USC alum I've seen plenty of Manny Wright. He's more of a combo guy who happens to play inside for us than a pure DT. Usually his best plays have come on stunts. As a Cane fan I don't think Wright is anywhere close to the caliber of a Jerome Brown, Cortez Kennedy, Russell Maryland or Warren Sapp, the guys who made me realize how vital an inside beast could be.

 

[bright-light]

It looks like Timbo is done. Larry Chester is having trouble with his rehab and we cannot count on him.

Signing Traylor was a must, but we need ANOTHER Traylor type. Right now we have Carter starting at DT. We need another run stuffer to free Carter up a little bit and as insurance against Traylor getting hurt. We all know what happens when you put all of your eggs in one basket. We need to assume that Bowens and Chester are done and we need that big tough run stuffing DT to rotate in with Traylor in a pinch. That's what we should be combing the transaction wire for.

If you can't stop the run, you're doomed as a defense. Agreed all?

Yes, I agree although there may not be any better DT's available.

 

[FINs4LIFE]

Was I the only one that saw what happened when the Fins had to rotate with smaller than Bowens and Chester players what happened to our run D. The fact of the matter is if we can pick up another traylor type we need to Zgonia he is just to small. I watched every play of every game and Zgonia was getting pushed off the line of scrimmage. I honestly am more worried about this position than any other on the team.

 

[TARHEEL38]

For at least 3 years I've been desperate for a young and extremely athletic upfield DT. IMO, that's always been the missing piece to put our D at Super Bowl caliber or close. A guy like that shortens the play and instantly makes other defenders better than they are. You won't have the late game defensive collapses if you've got a monster inside who disrupts plays and hassles the QB for 60 minutes.

The dilemma is where to find one. McFarland has some of those qualities when he's in shape and in the mood. No doubt too expensive and among 32 teams we're a huge longshot. As a USC alum I've seen plenty of Manny Wright. He's more of a combo guy who happens to play inside for us than a pure DT. Usually his best plays have come on stunts. As a Cane fan I don't think Wright is anywhere close to the caliber of a Jerome Brown, Cortez Kennedy, Russell Maryland or Warren Sapp, the guys who made me realize how vital an inside beast could be.

I think you will see more of that now that Saban is taking over the D. You have to understand, it was not that Timbo couldn't attack the OLine like your talking about, but in the 2 gap schme we were running under Bates, that was not his job. He was there almost like a blocker for the LBs. It was the DTs job to hold up blockers so they couldn't get to the Backers. I always have thought one gap systems causes more disruption for the offense and thus gets more turnovers, but it also allows for bigger plays to be giving up, and is harder to stop the run, if someone misses a gap responsbility.

Two gap systems like the one we were running put up great numbers, but tend to become too easy to read later in the season. By playoff time everyone knows what they are gonna see and have answers. I am excited about the new schmes and can't wait to see what we are like in a few years when Saban has all his guys in here.

 

[Disgustipate]

We're not going to have two run stuffers on the field normally like we have in the past. Under Jim Bates, the Dolphins used to have Tim Bowens and Larry Chester playing two-gap over Guard most of the time. That means Chester and Bowens would line up directly over the head of the Guard, and be responsible for keeping the runningback from going through the gaps between Center/Guard(A Gap), and Guard/Tackle(B Gap). Their job was to tie up the middle. Jason Taylor and whoever else was playing End lined up outside of the shoulder of the Tackle, or sometimes even upfield and were responsible for attacking the edges.

Now, the vast majority of the time in both the 4-3 and 3-4 the Dolphins will have three players inside of the Tackles instead of two. They will have a big, 2-gap player, but the majority of the time only one will be on the field, lined up over the Center and responsible for the gap on either side, the Nose Tackle role. The other two interior players will be one of the Carter/Vickerson/Holliday crew, who will be generally be responsible for only one gap, between Guard and Tackle. Jason Taylor will be lined up outside of the Tackle on either side, and depending on the scheme will be on the line with his hand down, or off the line standing up.

If Chester is able to play, then between him and Traylor we will have adequate depth. Most teams only have two Nose Tackle type players. There are teams out there who use a run stuffer over Center in worse positions then us...Look at the Jets or Cowboys.

 

[MarksBrothers85]

If Booger McFarland gets cut by Tampa Bay, I would seriously consider releasing David Bowens and have McFarland sign a deal. He's young and as good a defensive tackle as anyone in the league.

 

[fear-the-d]

zegonia will play as a no 3 but will be in constant rotation with carter and traylor to reduce injuries

 

[ckparrothead]

With Traylor being as old as he is and Chester being an injury question mark, I would still prefer having another square body capable of playing nose tackle. I don't think Romero, Carter, Zgonina, or Vickerson fit that bill.

Until the day we release Tim Bowens (which could be very soon), I like where we are right now, having Chester recovering and still in rehab, hopefully able to play by the preseason, and Traylor here and working in a system he knows, and the outside shot that Tim Bowens makes it back for a few games. With Bowens dressing out, that's a healthy run-stuffing rotation. With TimBo still having a chance, you've added up enough chances to cover yourself. When TimBo leaves, that is when you're thin.

 

[Awsi Dooger]

I think you will see more of that now that Saban is taking over the D. You have to understand, it was not that Timbo couldn't attack the OLine like your talking about, but in the 2 gap schme we were running under Bates, that was not his job. He was there almost like a blocker for the LBs. It was the DTs job to hold up blockers so they couldn't get to the Backers. I always have thought one gap systems causes more disruption for the offense and thus gets more turnovers, but it also allows for bigger plays to be giving up, and is harder to stop the run, if someone misses a gap responsbility.

Two gap systems like the one we were running put up great numbers, but tend to become too easy to read later in the season. By playoff time everyone knows what they are gonna see and have answers. I am excited about the new schmes and can't wait to see what we are like in a few years when Saban has all his guys in here.

I think the style we adopted was due to the personnel, not the other way around. Timbo doesn't have the upfield burst of his healthy prime and after Gardener was replaced by Chester you obviously had to 2-gap with a stationary blob like Chester. Plus with a smallish MLB, in fact small LBs in general, it's a natural tendency to devise a scheme to keep the offensive linemen away from them. Frankly, I think we overdid it.

I completely agree with your turnover/big play assessment of the 1-gap. My Canes are a perfect example at the college level. They annually lead the nation in big play turnovers and non-offensive TDs, but there will also be long stretches where the D is gashed by quick trap plays up the middle, or QBs who elude the upfield DTs then escape on big running plays up our gut.

 

[Dol-Fan Dupree]

I think the style we adopted was due to the personnel, not the other way around. Timbo doesn't have the upfield burst of his healthy prime and after Gardener was replaced by Chester you obviously had to 2-gap with a stationary blob like Chester. Plus with a smallish MLB, in fact small LBs in general, it's a natural tendency to devise a scheme to keep the offensive linemen away from them. Frankly, I think we overdid it.

I completely agree with your turnover/big play assessment of the 1-gap. My Canes are a perfect example at the college level. They annually lead the nation in big play turnovers and non-offensive TDs, but there will also be long stretches where the D is gashed by quick trap plays up the middle, or QBs who elude the upfield DTs then escape on big running plays up our gut.

that is false. The style was adopted because that was the scheme brought over by JJ and then utilized by wanny.

 

[SF Dolphin Fan]

I agree, although don't expect a lot of talent to emerge in free agency. I think the team should take a serious look at the kid from USC, Wright, who is in the supplemental draft. He might be worth a 3rd rounder based on talent alone. What I don't know about him if he's a legit 290 guy, or a pumped up 245 type player. That makes a difference because maybe he can grow into a 325 pounder without much difficulty if his 290 is legit.

 

[T tes]

If saban doesn't sign any other DT, that's cause he trusts Chester's health and will keep Zgonia

:yes:

 

[Whitedolphin54]

Amnesia anyone??.. why do we need a young guy w/ upside when we just drafted Vickerson. Starters are Traylor and Chester. If chester is bad we rotate in romero and zgonina. if there are injuries we put in vickerson and Carter. Thats pretty good depth right there. Especially since chester should be good at least by mid-season. And dont forget that about 15% of the time we will be in the 3-4 hybrid.

I agree, i am more worried about our coorners right now

 

[Awsi Dooger]

that is false. The style was adopted because that was the scheme brought over by JJ and then utilized by wanny.

I would like to wager big cash Larry Chester would never have been brought in by Jimmy Johnson, let alone start for him. He has absolutely no history of playing motionless DTs like that. In fact, he was the guy who recruited the likes of Cortez Kennedy and Russell Maryland for the Canes. He had a lean and smallish pass rush type like Jimmy Jones playing DT for him at Miami. He drafted Russell Maryland first overall. He played an angular pass rush specialist like Leon Lett at DT during the Cowboy glory years.

True, he favored smallish LBs but everything else about JJ's defenses was based on attacking, including up the middle. When he drafted Daryl Gardener almost everyone projected him to DE out of Baylor but JJ insisted he could be an aggressive playmaking DT. I have tapes of our games with Bowens and Gardener at DT and the schemes are noticeably different than recent seasons. We ran many more loops, for one thing, and the defensive interior was far less restrained overall.

 

[Dol-Fan Dupree]

I would like to wager big cash Larry Chester would never have been brought in by Jimmy Johnson, let alone start for him. He has absolutely no history of playing motionless DTs like that. In fact, he was the guy who recruited the likes of Cortez Kennedy and Russell Maryland for the Canes. He had a lean and smallish pass rush type like Jimmy Jones playing DT for him at Miami. He drafted Russell Maryland first overall. He played an angular pass rush specialist like Leon Lett at DT during the Cowboy glory years.

True, he favored smallish LBs but everything else about JJ's defenses was based on attacking, including up the middle. When he drafted Daryl Gardener almost everyone projected him to DE out of Baylor but JJ insisted he could be an aggressive playmaking DT. I have tapes of our games with Bowens and Gardener at DT and the schemes are noticeably different than recent seasons. We ran many more loops, for one thing, and the defensive interior was far less restrained overall.

And recently Miami had Wansteadt as the defensive coordinator who has proven to be even more conservitive than JJ.

He built Miami's defense from the ground up. The only player he kept was Tim Bowens. If JJ didn't want big two gap defensive tackles, he had plenty of chances to get non big two gap defensive tackles.

Look at the defense last year, Robinson and Zgonia and Romerio are not big linemen. They are more than capable of running stunts. Something they did not do often till Bates took over.