I disagree with your evaluation base on what I've see.IMHO-Brocos offensive line is all around the one of the best oline behind KC offensive line.Griese held the ball too long and he makes Chad Pennington look like a speeding bullet(LOL!!).Griese behind Dolphins oline is asking for trouble.
whats makes you think griese is better then fiedler?
- Thread starter i2panzer
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I disagree with your evaluation base on what I've see.IMHO-Brocos offensive line is all around the one of the best oline behind KC offensive line.Griese held the ball too long and he makes Chad Pennington look like a speeding bullet(LOL!!).Griese behind Dolphins oline is asking for trouble.
I agree with original post.In my opinion Fiedler and Williams are basicly being setup to failed.We all know our offensive line is horrible but playcalling has been horrible.How are they being setup to failed?
1st down Run
2nd down un
3rd down Pass
Every knows the Dolphins will run at you first two down and force Fiedler to throw in third down.Even a seven year old can gameplan how to stop Dolphins offense.Stack the box the first two downs and drop people into coverage on third down.
1st down Run
2nd down un
3rd down Pass
Every knows the Dolphins will run at you first two down and force Fiedler to throw in third down.Even a seven year old can gameplan how to stop Dolphins offense.Stack the box the first two downs and drop people into coverage on third down.
FinsGoToGuy
Practice Squad
I agree that the playcalling has been predictable and that Fiedler can't do very much when everyone expect him to throw, but he has had a lot of opportunities to make big plays and he didn't. His throws are too high or too short. We miss too many TD right now and our defence will wear down the stretch against because we can't sustain some good drives. A lot of the points this year have been results of good field position.
DeDolfan
Practice Squad
I'm not exactly sure how all of this fits with the thread title but i agree with most of the problems you mention tho.
But to answer the title, nobody will know who the better one is til Griese gets an equal shot. My contention has been all along that we know what Fiedler offers this team and we have no clue what Griese brings. It's quite clear to me that Fiedler can not take us where we want to go, IMO anyway, and while it is true that Griese may not be either, then we've little to lose. At least we'll know which of the 2 to keep next yr, if any, when the big $$$ for both kick in. wanny (if still here then)needs to be able to make an informed decision on this and believe me, he needs all the help he can get. Right now, we can rest assured that we will not have Fiedler eating up all the cap space next year and it would be rather silly to restructure/cut Fiedler and keep Griese at big $$$ without having a clue as to what he brings. But one thing is certain and that is we need more from the QB postion and I'll support whoever the guy is, even Grandma Moses, as Fibby put it! But right now, I don't see how anyone can say that Griese is better, that would be foolish. But that doesn't mean that he shouldn't get a shot tho. Like I said, we already know what Fiedler brings and there is alot more involved here than just the remainer of this season.
DeDolfan
Practice Squad
i think you'd better sharpen your pencil a little bit. How do you figure he only has a THIRTY % chance? Even your %s you quoted by down doesn't figure out that. We have run a total of 360 plays so far this year with 167 (193 run) of them passes. If you divide the 167 into 360, you will come up with 46.38 %, a far cry from 30%. Almost half of our plays are passes. how much of an opportunity does one need to "beat" someone else?
DeDolfan
Practice Squad
So then, why is it just run, run, pass then?
DolphinVJ
Active Roster
May be there is a good reason why Fiedler is getting 30% or whatever low % of passes he is getting - Norv Turner knows if the pass is over 5 yards or so, Fiedler will do one of three things -
1. Interceptions
2. Almost Interceptions - into the defenders' hands
3. Incomplete - over or under thrown
It is not like Norv's offenses in Washington and Dallas did not pass a lot or that Norv has changed but when your QB is limited it is hard to open up.
i2panzer
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30% chance on first and second downs when the line of scrimmage is stacked. it's more like 35% though... either way.
he has a good QB rating on 1st and 2nd downs, yet we hardly throw, so when it's 3rd down everyone knows whats comming. thats how fiedler isn't giving a chance to beat you... when he's had the chances to do something.
stats
QB rating on 1st and 2nd down (the non passing downs) - mide 90's (88. 6 is a mistake, it's much higher. for the INT total i put 7 and he only has 4 on 1st and 2nd. it's around the mid 90's)
pretty nice huh? i wish it would translate to more pass atempts on 1st and 2nd down.
incase you would like to know how i figured it out go here http://www.coachbox.com/nfl/info/qb-rating-formula.htm
the #s for each one are
1. 1.9575
2. 2.16
3. .965
4. .2
i won't go into details about how i got this. but the forumula is there so you can see.
Attempts Run/pass
1st down out of 101 ricky runs (not overall only williams) and 49 passes by jay fiedler. 49/150= 32%
1st- 32% run (with williams in backfield, not running plays overall)
yada yada, i'm not going through them all... but you get the point.
none of these are even including the 20 attempts by fiedler..
p.s. the 3rd down average was mistaken. miami passes 80% on 3rd down (when williams is in the backfield).
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DeDolfan
Practice Squad
Waitaminit, don't spin things around. You said 30%, nothing about breaking it all down, but 30% is 30%. i showed where he has 46%, of the total plays. But of course, it doesn't factor in any 4th down attempts, tho.
lauderdale
Practice Squad
What do Kurt Warner, Priest Holmes, Marc Bulger, Kelly Holcomb, Quincy Carter, and Rod Smith have in common? They all worked their a$$es off to get a starting position even though some of them were not drafted or had failed teams in the past.
What would be so horrible in giving Griese the start on Monday and bringing Fiedler off the bench if he struggles? Use Fielder’s injury as an excuse and put all the questions to bed.
What would be so horrible in giving Griese the start on Monday and bringing Fiedler off the bench if he struggles? Use Fielder’s injury as an excuse and put all the questions to bed.
i2panzer
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Originally posted by DeDolfan
Waitaminit, don't spin things around. You said 30%, nothing about breaking it all down, but 30% is 30%. i showed where he has 46%, of the total plays. But of course, it doesn't factor in any 4th down attempts, tho.
ya but you're talking about something completley different. just because we pass almost equal to the run, doesn't mean it's being spread out on every down.
i2panzer
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because griese isn't even 80% healthy, and he doesn't know the offense. he's been taking reps for 3 weeks if that/ lets put a guy in the game who isn't sure of the offense. it's like putting zack thomas in at QB with 2 weeks of backup prep, and some 1st string reps...
lauderdale
Practice Squad
So pull Griese if he stuggles and put Fiedler in. No more questions about the starting QB postion the rest of the season.