Why was he fired from NO | Page 3 | FinHeaven - Miami Dolphins Forums

Why was he fired from NO

Agua said:
but it's consistent with the uneasy impression I had of him.

I think that pretty much describes my impression of him and his "fit" with Saban.

I hope I'm wrong, but I'm not getting a nice warm fuzzy feeling about this recent "move".

It just doesn't make sense to hire a man with an obvious penchant for being opinionated and controlling to fill a position with less power than his previous job. I see head butting and power struggles developing.

And, no matter what others feel about the Ricky situation, his apparent past and public opinion of Ricky do not give much promise either. ANY TURMOIL within a team is BAD.

For the sake of the organization, Ricky needs to have a productive return. I wonder "how" productive that could be IF Mueller is here. I think we might have just lost some of Ricky's desire and trust with this move.

And, again, for the haters, remember just how much preaching Saban has done in the "Ricky has value" campaign. The Mueller decision does not seem to flow with that philosophy.

You don't try to derail a train you've worked so hard to get back on the track.

Put your opinions of Ricky to the side, weigh the merits of Saban's actions. I don't see the math. And, no matter how you believe, you must recognize Ricky MUST play with us for a year before ANY NFL team will touch him. And, in that year, he will need to "return" to old form. He can't do that if his eyes are watching the press box instead of the field.

jmo
 
RaptorBpW said:
I'll give you an example which may help explain why Mueller was fired.

Before the 2002 draft, when he decided to pursue Charles Grant with the first round pick we got from you all in the Ricky trade, he convinced Benson he needed one more trip up to Georgia to meet with Charles. Benson approved the trip, no questions asked, and of course everything was paid for with team money. Turns out Mueller attended Masters events in Augusta---on Benson's dime---without informing Benson.

That's one example...he did that sort of thing often. Another was his purchase---again with team money and without permission---of security monitors, which he placed in the coaches' meeting rooms, and which he used to "spy" on them. (I'm being entirely serious.)

Yet another incident was his insistence upon interviewing with our most hated rival, the Atlanta Falcons, multiple times. Benson gave permission, but Mueller continued to work with the Falcons beyond what Benson understood as their agreement.

When you add events like this to the simple fact that, after 2000, Randy Mueller's major free agency aquisitions were simply horrendous---then his firing is no mystery.

Want to know what those signings were?

2001
WR Albert Connell - Given a big contract to complement Joe Horn, he was beat out by journeyman Willie Jackson at receiver and was a major locker room problem, just as Mueller's NFL contacts had warned (warnings he brushed aside). He stole money from Deuce McAllister, and was a major factor in the team's utter collapse at the end of the season.

Other moves included trading 2000 fifth round pick Chad Morton, who led all rookie return men that year and caught 30 passes, for a sixth round pick who did not make the team, and a cornerback named Earthwind Moreland who also was cut after camp and dind't even merit a practice squad spot. Mueller replaced Morton with an undrafted free agent named James Fenderson, who is now out of the NFL.

2002
Before his firing, Mueller signed the following...

CB Dale Carter - Between injuries and suspensions, he hardly touched the field. Was nailed for gambling in the locker room with younger players.

TE David Sloan - Built up by Mueller to be the answers to all our tight end woes, Sloan dropped as many passes as he caught during his Saints tenure, got hurt, and was gone a year later.

RT Victor Riley - He spent the entire 2002 season on the bench, fat and lazy. He played a bit in 2003, and started throughout 2004, where he was a horrible liability on our offensive line, unable to pass block. It was not unusual to see Aaron Brooks roll immediately to his left after the snap to buy some more time, as he knew Riley's man would usually be coming very, very quickly. Beyond his pass blocking woes, Riley led the team in pre-snap penalties, and remained out of shape. We drafted right tackle Jammal Brown in the first round this year to replace him.

DT Grady Jackson - He started for much of 2002, played well through the first half of the season, and then was invisible. He was cut halfway through the 2003 season after missing many meetings and remaining so out of shape he couldn't play more than a couple dozen snaps a game.

Other assorted moves included trading all-pro, future Hall of Fame tackle Willie Roaf to the Chiefs for a second-day pick. In KC, Roaf has continued his HOF ways.

Mueller made some good moves---mainly in 2000, with the signing of Joe Horn and the trade for Aaron Brooks---and had a few decent draft picks, such as Darren Howard, LeCharles Bentley and Charles Grant. But his negatives FAR outweigh his positives, and unless he has undergone some sort of brain transplant, his domineering, micromanaging personality will conflict with Saban, who is a Type A micromanager himself.

BTW---
Benson does not want to move the team. I don't know where you got that from. National media, I suppose. At worst they'll be sold to out-of-town interests, but Benson himself wants to leave the team to his granddaughter, who is a current Executive (listed as a "Co-Owner" in the team guide) and keep them in New Orleans long term.

The governor is a megalomaniac, and Benson is an NFL owner ... but hopefully cooler heads will prevail. The negotiations which were called off simply mean the team will remain in New Orleans under the current deal.

THanks for your honest input. It definitely brings some balance to my perspective (warning flag). I honestly don't want to believe you because it's not what I want to hear but I want to give you the benefit of the doubt. He still made the right moves to acquire the guys that helped you get your first playoff win, not to mention those two first round picks for Ricky. I think that only time will tell how he will pan out.
 
RaptorBpW said:
I'll give you an example which may help explain why Mueller was fired.

Before the 2002 draft, when he decided to pursue Charles Grant with the first round pick we got from you all in the Ricky trade, he convinced Benson he needed one more trip up to Georgia to meet with Charles. Benson approved the trip, no questions asked, and of course everything was paid for with team money. Turns out Mueller attended Masters events in Augusta---on Benson's dime---without informing Benson.

That's one example...he did that sort of thing often. Another was his purchase---again with team money and without permission---of security monitors, which he placed in the coaches' meeting rooms, and which he used to "spy" on them. (I'm being entirely serious.)

Yet another incident was his insistence upon interviewing with our most hated rival, the Atlanta Falcons, multiple times. Benson gave permission, but Mueller continued to work with the Falcons beyond what Benson understood as their agreement.

When you add events like this to the simple fact that, after 2000, Randy Mueller's major free agency aquisitions were simply horrendous---then his firing is no mystery.

Want to know what those signings were?

2001
WR Albert Connell - Given a big contract to complement Joe Horn, he was beat out by journeyman Willie Jackson at receiver and was a major locker room problem, just as Mueller's NFL contacts had warned (warnings he brushed aside). He stole money from Deuce McAllister, and was a major factor in the team's utter collapse at the end of the season.

Other moves included trading 2000 fifth round pick Chad Morton, who led all rookie return men that year and caught 30 passes, for a sixth round pick who did not make the team, and a cornerback named Earthwind Moreland who also was cut after camp and dind't even merit a practice squad spot. Mueller replaced Morton with an undrafted free agent named James Fenderson, who is now out of the NFL.

2002
Before his firing, Mueller signed the following...

CB Dale Carter - Between injuries and suspensions, he hardly touched the field. Was nailed for gambling in the locker room with younger players.

TE David Sloan - Built up by Mueller to be the answers to all our tight end woes, Sloan dropped as many passes as he caught during his Saints tenure, got hurt, and was gone a year later.

RT Victor Riley - He spent the entire 2002 season on the bench, fat and lazy. He played a bit in 2003, and started throughout 2004, where he was a horrible liability on our offensive line, unable to pass block. It was not unusual to see Aaron Brooks roll immediately to his left after the snap to buy some more time, as he knew Riley's man would usually be coming very, very quickly. Beyond his pass blocking woes, Riley led the team in pre-snap penalties, and remained out of shape. We drafted right tackle Jammal Brown in the first round this year to replace him.

DT Grady Jackson - He started for much of 2002, played well through the first half of the season, and then was invisible. He was cut halfway through the 2003 season after missing many meetings and remaining so out of shape he couldn't play more than a couple dozen snaps a game.

Other assorted moves included trading all-pro, future Hall of Fame tackle Willie Roaf to the Chiefs for a second-day pick. In KC, Roaf has continued his HOF ways.

Mueller made some good moves---mainly in 2000, with the signing of Joe Horn and the trade for Aaron Brooks---and had a few decent draft picks, such as Darren Howard, LeCharles Bentley and Charles Grant. But his negatives FAR outweigh his positives, and unless he has undergone some sort of brain transplant, his domineering, micromanaging personality will conflict with Saban, who is a Type A micromanager himself.

BTW---
Benson does not want to move the team. I don't know where you got that from. National media, I suppose. At worst they'll be sold to out-of-town interests, but Benson himself wants to leave the team to his granddaughter, who is a current Executive (listed as a "Co-Owner" in the team guide) and keep them in New Orleans long term.

The governor is a megalomaniac, and Benson is an NFL owner ... but hopefully cooler heads will prevail. The negotiations which were called off simply mean the team will remain in New Orleans under the current deal.

Hey, Raptor. How's things?

Wow, you really did not like Mueller did you? LOL

I think you may have heard a few of the stories that have been "Embellished" a bit to say the least.

On the trip to Georgia, they did indeed meet with some Georgia players, but they also went to the Masters as you stated. They did end up paying for the side trip though.

On the security cameras, the coaches knew they were there. Mueller would often sit in on the different coaches meetings around the complex. The cameras might have have made the coaches uncomfortable but no moreso than when sat it on a meeeting in person.

Mueller made only 1 trip to Atlanta, with Mr. Benson's permission. If this was the cause for firing, why wait 4 months?

As to the free agents, Connell was indeed a bad move.

Chad Morton was as an OK player, but was not going to be a solid backup RB. He was OK as a return man. I think the Saints are much better off with Lewis. By the way, Morton is on the street after being with 3 different teams.

David Sloan was a solid TE with the Lions and came to the Saints at a reasonable price. Injuries were Sloan's downfall as a player.

Victor Riley was an underachiever with KC showing flashes of brilliance mixed with laziness. The Saints got him fairly cheap. they got two solid seasons out of him and he just quit last year.

Grady Jackson played well for the Saints until he got injured and twisted off with Haslett, which was after Mueller left. Since he was snapped up by Green Bay, he has played well when not injured.

Mueller had no choice but to trade Roaf after all of the locker room problems that Haslett failed to quell.

I'm not saying Mueller was the greatest GM ever in the NFL, but he certainly isn't the dismal image you have painted.
 
What do you guys think Sabans responce would be if Mueller asked to set up cameras to watch the coaches?
 
touborg said:
What do you guys think Sabans responce would be if Mueller asked to set up cameras to watch the coaches?

Saban's answer would be an emphatic "no". Saban is the head man in Miami and he will be the sole evaluator of the coaches, not the GM.
 
touborg said:
What do you guys think Sabans responce would be if Mueller asked to set up cameras to watch the coaches?

Wouldn't Saban have to give him permission to speak first?

:rofl3:
 
I was listening to Tim Brando on Sporting News radio (Tim probably knows more about sports in Louisiana then anyone else). He said he would not be shocked if the Saints franchise moves in the near future, possibly to LA. Benson is probably the 2nd or 3rd worst owner in the league after Bidwell in Arizona, and the Irsays in Indy.....they have no loyalty to anything other than $$$$. That is why they suck every year.
 
RaptorBpW said:
When you add events like this to the simple fact that, after 2000, Randy Mueller's major free agency aquisitions were simply horrendous---then his firing is no mystery.

Didn't he receive an award for the "best front office personell for 2000" or something to that affect?
 
phinphan11 said:
Didn't he receive an award for the "best front office personell for 2000" or something to that affect?

Yes he did. 2000 or 2001, don't remember which.
 
Obidan, your take on things contradicts what I've heard from both media and "inside" type sources. I've never heard anyone say before now that Mueller paid for his little Masters side trip, or that the coaches knew about the cameras. I HAVE heard that during the last few months, the situation became rather nasty ... the power struggle between Mueller and Fielkow, as an example.

But the bottom line is, no single reason explains why Mueller was fired. You have to look at the picture as a whole.

He still made the right moves to acquire the guys that helped you get your first playoff win, not to mention those two first round picks for Ricky. I think that only time will tell how he will pan out.

The key contributors to that 2000 playoff team were, in no particular order, guys like La'Roi Glover, Sammy Knight, Joe Johnson, Willie Roaf, Kyle Turley, Ricky Williams, Jerry Fontenot, Norman Hand, Darren Howard, Jeff Blake, Aaron Brooks and Joe Horn. Of those 13 players, five were Mueller aquisitions. In other words, the core of the team was already here. Mueller merely had to build around it.

When he tore apart that core, our team suffered. We haven't been back to the playoffs since.

Is Mueller dismal? After 2000, with a few exceptions the answer is yes. The Saints front office is better off under Mickey Loomis.

Hopefully, Randy will take his little brother with him now. Rick Mueller has been another thorn in our side, the leading proponent of picks like Chase Lyman and Adrian McPherson.
 
b_hjelmeland123 said:
still if he is a good gm y did it take 2 years to get another job.


If I'm not mistaken, I think we offered him the GM position last year when Wannstedt was still here, but he turned us down.
 
MarksBrothers85 said:
If I'm not mistaken, I think we offered him the GM position last year when Wannstedt was still here, but he turned us down.

You're thinking of Ron Wolf. Mule interviewed but wasn't hired.
 
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