Zach Thomas versus Brian Urlacher | Page 3 | FinHeaven - Miami Dolphins Forums

Zach Thomas versus Brian Urlacher

1972forever said:
Thomas had more tackles in less games than both Urlacher and Junior Seau. The Dolphins made the same amount of playoff appearance with Jason Taylor as they did with Zach Thomas. So based on that criteria, I guess you don’t think Jason Taylor should be in the HOF either.

The bar for the HOF seems to be a lot more about where a player played when he was in the league and less about if he actually deserves to be in the HOF.

Since Thomas left the Dolphins, they haven’t had a single MLB play anywhere close to the level he played the position. As far as the defense not getting to the level you seem to think they needed to get to for Thomas to make the HOF is concerned. It certainly wasn’t the fault of Thomas or Taylor that the defense never got to that level.

It had everything to do with mediocre defensive coordinators and a defense that had a lot of average to below average talent surrounding Thomas and Taylor. They had Madison and Surtain who were excellent CB’s but otherwise there wasn’t a lot of talent on the defense during the years Thomas was on the Dolphins.

To me Thomas was a HOF player for the Dolphins. The fact a few individuals in the media control which former players are inducted each year just shows me that the election process is messed up. Yet that’s unfortunately the system at this time and Thomas will likely to continue to get screwed every year because these media voters don’t have a clue.
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The thing is in the grand scheme of things tackles don't jump off the page. Sacks do. ZT wasn't this, but mediocre players can compile tackles. Not sacks. That's the difference between JT and DT in terms of perception. JT also did great at making splash plays like fumble returns and INTs that weren't necessarily the norm for the 4-3 de that Taylor was the bulk of his career.
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The only reason why Urlacher is in and ZT isn’t is the Super Bowl.
 
BlueUndertow said:
Let's just put it this way, each team has a media representative for their city. Miami's rep for the Hall of Fame: "Armando Salguero".

The only players inducted into the Hall of Fame in the last 20 years that played most of their years in Miami are: Jason Taylor (inducted 2017) and Dan Marino (inducted 2005).... Well and Nick Buoniconti (inducted 2001).

In the same last 20 years, the Chicago Bears have had 6 inductees.
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And we knocked that undefeated smile off their faces
 
Sirspud said:
The thing is in the grand scheme of things tackles don't jump off the page. Sacks do. ZT wasn't this, but mediocre players can compile tackles. Not sacks. That's the difference between JT and DT in terms of perception. JT also did great at making splash plays like fumble returns and INTs that weren't necessarily the norm for the 4-3 de that Taylor was the bulk of his career.
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That is the one difference that jumps out between Thomas and Urlacher.
 
Urlacher on average had like 2 more sacks a season when you do the math.

Does that count for something? Sure. Is it balanced out by Zach having more FF and nearly double the assisted tackles? I'd say so. 2 sacks a year isn't much especially because Zach was never a pass rush blitz type LB.

I honestly thought there sack numbers would be wider apart.
 
Sirspud said:
The thing is in the grand scheme of things tackles don't jump off the page. Sacks do. ZT wasn't this, but mediocre players can compile tackles. Not sacks. That's the difference between JT and DT in terms of perception. JT also did great at making splash plays like fumble returns and INTs that weren't necessarily the norm for the 4-3 de that Taylor was the bulk of his career.
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I fully understand that Taylor has the sacks. Yet he played DE and outside lB and he was the primary rusher on the team throughout his career. Thomas on the other hand was the MLB and it was his job to make tackles and he wasn’t expected to get a lot of sacks since he rarely was used to rush the passer.

While Urlacher had more sacks than Thomas. Thomas had more tackles, forced more fumbles and scored more TD’s off turnovers than Urlacher over the course of their careers.

I believe Taylor certainly deserves to be in the HOF. Yet if Urlacher is worthy of being in the HOF based on his career stats. Thomas certainly has the stats to be in the HOF also. In fact based on their careers, I believe Thomas was a better MLB than Urlacher.
 
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1972forever said:
I fully understand that Taylor has the sacks. Yet he plays DE and outside lB and he was the primary rusher on the team throughout his career. Thomas on the other hand was the MLB and it was his job to make tackles and he wasn’t expected to get a lot of sacks since he rarely was used to rush the passer.

While Urlacher had more sacks than Thomas. Thomas had more tackles, forced more fumbles and scored more TD’s off turnovers than Urlacher over the corse of their careers.

I believe Taylor certainly deserves to be in the HOF. Yet if Urlacher is worthy of being in the HOF based on his career stats. Thomas certainly has the stats to be in the HOF also. In fact based on their careers, I believe Thomas was a better MLB than Urlacher.
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I thought Thomas was a better player than Urlacher, but I'm a Dolphins fan so may be a little biased!
 
1972forever said:
I fully understand that Taylor has the sacks. Yet he played DE and outside lB and he was the primary rusher on the team throughout his career. Thomas on the other hand was the MLB and it was his job to make tackles and he wasn’t expected to get a lot of sacks since he rarely was used to rush the passer.

While Urlacher had more sacks than Thomas. Thomas had more tackles, forced more fumbles and scored more TD’s off turnovers than Urlacher over the course of their careers.

I believe Taylor certainly deserves to be in the HOF. Yet if Urlacher is worthy of being in the HOF based on his career stats. Thomas certainly has the stats to be in the HOF also. In fact based on their careers, I believe Thomas was a better MLB than Urlacher.
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Urlacher was part of a defense that was the dominant in the league for a few years. They made a Super Bowl
 
It's disgusting how a linebacker like Sam Mills makes it in as a pity case because he died younger when Thomas was far more impressive for a longer period of time. Not only does he belong in the HOF but the team should consider retiring 54. Zach was an incredible player.
 
orpheus said:
It's disgusting how a linebacker like Sam Mills makes it in as a pity case because he died younger when Thomas was far more impressive for a longer period of time. Not only does he belong in the HOF but the team should consider retiring 54. Zach was an incredible player.
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Point taken, but I think ZT prefers not dying younger, even if it means not getting into the Hall. Just an assumption, but . . . .
 
The most you can say is that both players are Hall-worthy and the edge goes to Urlacher because he got to a SB, whereas Thomas’ teams were pulverized in the divisional round each time. Is it fair? No. Is it perfectly understandable? Yes.
 
Sirspud said:
Urlacher was part of a defense that was the dominant in the league for a few years. They made a Super Bowl
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Yes, he was merely a part of an excellent defense. There are many HOF inductees who never played in a SB. They were great players but just never played on a team with a dominant offense or defense and therefore they never made it to a SB.

That certainly doesn’t take away from the fact they were HOF caliber players, simply because the players around them weren’t good enough.
 
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