Brady Poppinga: Gase might have lost the team | Page 20 | FinHeaven - Miami Dolphins Forums

Brady Poppinga: Gase might have lost the team

Mrmeeseeks said:
Yeah, probably. All I'm saying is the window isn't closed in terms of convincing players his way is the best way.
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That window is ALWAYS open -- just have a couple of bad seasons, throw in some press "hot seat talk", and less than unequivocal ownership and you are there. Gase didn't loss the locker room and those last two games make it clear it wasn't even close. Coaches who have lost the team don't deliver back to back *** whoopings doing exactly what they have been coaching the past two seasons.

This was a team that lost their starting QB before game 1, replaced him with someone who can't string together 4 good quarters let alone 2 good games, has a backup QB that the locker room loves almost as much as apposing defensive coaches, doesn't have enough talent to survive how hard they got hit hard with all the other injuries, and had a couple of players who thought they knew better than anyone else.
 
fin415 said:
That window is ALWAYS open -- just have a couple of bad seasons, throw in some press "hot seat talk", and less than unequivocal ownership and you are there.
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I don't know what you mean by unequivocal ownership, but good coaches have their players' ear even when losing or having a couple of bad years. A coach can be fired and never lose the lockerroom.

John Harbaugh has at times not faired well but his players, even when not talented, play hard. Marvin Lewis, John Fox, Jack Del Rio...heck even Dan Campbell got blown out but you knew he never lost them. They always played hard.
Adam Gase teams, though? They look no more ready or energized or PREPARED than any Philbin team or any number of lockerrooms that were lost to a coach that didn't seem to get it. Tell me you haven't questioned this team's desire with Gase.

When I watch John Fox teams, even when not talented, they always come to play. I can't say that for Gase. So, until he shows that his teams can be consistently prepared and play hard (like not going 3 quarters without a point, or giving up 3 consecutive touchdown drives, or starting a game down by 2 or 3 scores), then I'll just have to assume that he's one more disappointment away from total upheaval.
 
Mrmeeseeks said:
I don't know what you mean by unequivocal ownership, but good coaches have their players' ear even when losing or having a couple of bad years. A coach can be fired and never lose the lockerroom.

John Harbaugh has at times not faired well but his players, even when not talented, play hard. Marvin Lewis, John Fox, Jack Del Rio...heck even Dan Campbell got blown out but you knew he never lost them. They always played hard.
Adam Gase teams, though? They look no more ready or energized or PREPARED than any Philbin team or any number of lockerrooms that were lost to a coach that didn't seem to get it. Tell me you haven't questioned this team's desire with Gase.

When I watch John Fox teams, even when not talented, they always come to play. I can't say that for Gase. So, until he shows that his teams can be consistently prepared and play hard (like not going 3 quarters without a point, or giving up 3 consecutive touchdown drives, or starting a game down by 2 or 3 scores), then I'll just have to assume that he's one more disappointment away from total upheaval.
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Couple of things. One, Gase has been more aggressive and creative. Apparently he DID 'clean up his mistakes. Second, evidence of an actual game plan with actual use of mismatches. Gase may have lost SOME on the team, but Winning changes everything. Now the dangerous part . . . Will Miami play down to the lesser opponent?
 
fin415 said:
That window is ALWAYS open -- just have a couple of bad seasons, throw in some press "hot seat talk", and less than unequivocal ownership and you are there. Gase didn't loss the locker room and those last two games make it clear it wasn't even close. Coaches who have lost the team don't deliver back to back *** whoopings doing exactly what they have been coaching the past two seasons.

This was a team that lost their starting QB before game 1, replaced him with someone who can't string together 4 good quarters let alone 2 good games, has a backup QB that the locker room loves almost as much as apposing defensive coaches, doesn't have enough talent to survive how hard they got hit hard with all the other injuries, and had a couple of players who thought they knew better than anyone else.
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Great post, only things I'd had are the hurricane and an OL coach snorting blow before going into meetings with one of the least producing units on the team.
 
Mrmeeseeks said:
I don't know what you mean by unequivocal ownership, but good coaches have their players' ear even when losing or having a couple of bad years. A coach can be fired and never lose the lockerroom.

John Harbaugh has at times not faired well but his players, even when not talented, play hard. Marvin Lewis, John Fox, Jack Del Rio...heck even Dan Campbell got blown out but you knew he never lost them. They always played hard.
Adam Gase teams, though? They look no more ready or energized or PREPARED than any Philbin team or any number of lockerrooms that were lost to a coach that didn't seem to get it. Tell me you haven't questioned this team's desire with Gase.

When I watch John Fox teams, even when not talented, they always come to play. I can't say that for Gase. So, until he shows that his teams can be consistently prepared and play hard (like not going 3 quarters without a point, or giving up 3 consecutive touchdown drives, or starting a game down by 2 or 3 scores), then I'll just have to assume that he's one more disappointment away from total upheaval.
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Dog with a bone.

What part of the last two games gives you any indication that more than a problem player or two was tuning the coach out? There is NO way in hell that a coach who was on the outs with even a small minority of the team could have pulled off the last two games. Period.

You are confusing the issues of a new head coach, dealing with the loss of his most important player, trying to work with a different QB who has a significantly different set of strengths and who didn't have time to build chemistry his wide outs, and more than a couple of key injuries. On top of that, he had a 'me first' player who didn't have a problem with letting the locker room know that *he* wasn't happy. Even Brady doesn't pull that kind of crap, and when he has a 'moment', he's out on national TV apologizing.

So, yes, we had to strip down the playbook, adjust strategies that we're planned for 1 1/2 years around RT, and try to rebuild around JC and AA. It took time and was disruptive. Maybe a coach with more time as a head coach would have been able to get things under control faster. Maybe not. But what I saw over the last two weeks proves, without any doubt, while some players might have had doubts, they were ALL still giving their all.

Most of your examples of the coaches you listed above all had pretty long runs with their teams and a coaching staff around them that they had long working relationships with. In another year or two, Gase will have the experience and cohesive coaching staff build around the way he wants to run his team. If he can't pull off full seasons of good play, then we can talk about if he's HC material.
 
fin415 said:
Most of your examples of the coaches you listed above all had pretty long runs with their teams and a coaching staff around them that they had long working relationships with.
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Are you suggesting that the coaches I listed were never rookie head coaches and somehow were head coaches with long runs with a team right from birth?
 
fin415 said:
There is NO way in hell that a coach who was on the outs with even a small minority of the team could have pulled off the last two games. Period.
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So Philbin had full control and leadership of his teams, then.
And Josh McDaniels was a fiery, great hire for the Broncos when he traded away all the outscasts for his guys, beat New England, smashed the Chargers and started 6-0. Got it.
 
Mrmeeseeks said:
I don't know what you mean by unequivocal ownership, but good coaches have their players' ear even when losing or having a couple of bad years. A coach can be fired and never lose the lockerroom.

John Harbaugh has at times not faired well but his players, even when not talented, play hard. Marvin Lewis, John Fox, Jack Del Rio...heck even Dan Campbell got blown out but you knew he never lost them. They always played hard.
Adam Gase teams, though? They look no more ready or energized or PREPARED than any Philbin team or any number of lockerrooms that were lost to a coach that didn't seem to get it. Tell me you haven't questioned this team's desire with Gase.

When I watch John Fox teams, even when not talented, they always come to play. I can't say that for Gase. So, until he shows that his teams can be consistently prepared and play hard (like not going 3 quarters without a point, or giving up 3 consecutive touchdown drives, or starting a game down by 2 or 3 scores), then I'll just have to assume that he's one more disappointment away from total upheaval.
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grasping-at-straws-gif-3.gif
 
Mrmeeseeks said:
So Philbin had full control and leadership of his teams, then.
And Josh McDaniels was a fiery, great hire for the Broncos when he traded away all the outscasts for his guys, beat New England, smashed the Chargers and started 6-0. Got it.
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So...what you're saying is you don't like Adam Gase. Okay.

Many people here disagree.
 
Phinatic8u said:
Tunsil has actually been pretty good for awhile..

Parker is having a tough stretch but he was open for big plays on Monday night that Cutler didnt connect with.
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Tunsil has def been playing at a high level. I pay close attention to him every week. He's going to be the Dolphins LT for a very long time. The hype is real. He stifles DEs that try to run through him. He has great feet and packs a powerful punch. He's had his ups and downs but he's def trending up and quickly..Tunsil, Howard, and Drake could be the best first 3 picks we've drafted in decades. We've got 2 of the most important positions locked down (LT, CB) and an all around up and coming stud RB. 2016 could turn out to be the draft that we'll look back on and thank Gase and company for.
 
Mrmeeseeks said:
So Philbin had full control and leadership of his teams, then.
And Josh McDaniels was a fiery, great hire for the Broncos when he traded away all the outscasts for his guys, beat New England, smashed the Chargers and started 6-0. Got it.
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You've only been a member here for about 3 weeks, and most of your posts have been anti-Gase. Makes one think that you only created the account to bash him.
 
The Goat said:
So...what you're saying is you don't like Adam Gase. Okay.

Many people here disagree.
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No, I'm making an argument that there is no evidence to suggest Gase is any better than any of his predecessors, or that the last 2 wins are hard proof that most players on the team would run through a wall for him. It's a better sign than getting beat up, but as I've mentioned several times, plenty of coaches have done this and been complete failures.
 
Mrmeeseeks said:
No, I'm making an argument that there is no evidence to suggest Gase is any better than any of his predecessors, or that the last 2 wins are hard proof that most players on the team would run through a wall for him. It's a better sign than getting beat up, but as I've mentioned several times, plenty of coaches have done this and been complete failures.
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No evidence? His direct predecessor took us to the playoffs 0 times. Gase, already once. That's pretty simple evidence.
 
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