Cam Newton Projected to Fall | Page 8 | FinHeaven - Miami Dolphins Forums

Cam Newton Projected to Fall

Passing on a QB for a 2nd TE would be an even worse decision than when Dave Wannstedt overrode Spielman and took a 3rd CB over Drew Brees.

Absolutely. Although getting the franchise QB is always more important when you don't have one, regardless of what other positions are available, you always take the potential franchise guy. At least you can kind of understand the logic of needing a 3rd corner. I remember those days. Jerry Wilson was the nickel and got burned constantly, so there really was a need for a nickel corner.

That being said, even if Fletcher panned out, I'd still regret not addressing the QB position first, but a TE before the QB? That's disastrous.
 
hey CK, you think Cam Newton will do well at the NFL level? I honestly havent seen enough of him to be able to come to a conclusion of what i think of him as a prospect. If hes there at 15 you would definately take him?

Yes I do.

I agree with Slimm that what he does from an intangibles standpoint will be very important, but I think sometimes too much importance can be placed on that. When you have a guy that is as physically talented as Cam Newton, and I firmly believe that the only players in the league in recent memory that had his pure level of physical talent are Ben Rapistberger, Mike Vick and Daunte Culpepper, perhaps Jay Cutler, then the intangibles and the "want it" matter, but they don't matter as much for those guys as they do for, let's say, an Aaron Rodgers.

In this Super Bowl today we have the model of two DIFFERENT QBs. You have Rodgers, who has physical skills and talent, but his cup does not overflow with it. Then you have the Rapist, whose cup absolutely overflows with physical skills and talent. The Rapist does NOT have good intangibles. I think he's more committed than ever to the art of playing quarterback well, but that's in very large part a response to his beating a rape charge and being suspended, his name being mud with a nation of fans...he's motivated to "show them". Similarly, Vick has never been more motivated, and part of that is his getting out of prison and wanting to show everyone what they've been missing.

Commitment to learning is important, but these guys don't have the track record of being committed that other guys do. Before Vick went to prison, he didn't even study game tapes. He went to an NFC Championship Game, had a winning record as a QB, went to Pro Bowls and was considered one of the very best, and the guy would take game tapes from his coaches and leave them in the car all week never watching them before he played his next game. That's an admitted fact. Meanwhile, Ben Rapistberger has NEVER been regarded by his teammates as a hard worker, or a leader, and in fact I have a friend in the Draft space that spoke with a guy that helped coach him in Pittsburgh, and that coach literally used the word "uncoachable" to describe Ben Rapistberger. And he won two Super Bowls, went to Pro Bowls, had high QB ratings, etc.

My point is, we don't even know if Cam Newton is committed to working hard at the next level. We know he was committed to working hard at Auburn and at Blinn. We have evidence and testimonials to that extent. We know, ON THE FILM, that his learning curve this year as a passer was visually concrete and upward-sloped. You can't possibly look at his passing at the beginning of the year and then at the end of the year and say that he wasn't in the midst of actively learning and actively improving his passing skills. If you do say that, you're lying. But will he work that hard at the next level or was he doing it so that he could get good draft position? That's a good question, and I don't know the answer. Nobody does.

But what I'm saying is...he's got more margin for error on that front than a Blaine Gabbert, or even a Ryan Mallett. You could ask an HONEST teammate if he's a Chad Pennington in the locker room or film room, etc...and the answer could be "Hell no!"...and Cam Newton could still win Super Bowls (plural).

That's just a fact. A sad one, but a fact all the same.
 
Exactly.. Pat White was a 4 year starter in college, so he was automatically a candidate.

If they hold true to form, the first thing you can look at is starting experience. They want a guy with 4 years of starting experience, at the least 3 years.

You're looking at:

Jake Locker

Ricky Stanzi

Nathan Enderle

Pat Devlin

Colin Kaepernick

Andy Dalton

T.J. Yates

Ben Chappell

Tyrod Taylor



There might be one or two others who are very borderline, but you get the point. You can throw the 1 year wonders and 2 year enigmas out the window.

Next you probably have to look at things like durability, winning percentage, leadership, etc.

I agree with some of their "profiling" of quarterbacks...about 50% of it anyway.

Pat Devlin actually belongs among your "2 year enigmas" group. Not least of which because the only 2 years he's started in college came at Delaware.
 
Yes I do.

I agree with Slimm that what he does from an intangibles standpoint will be very important, but I think sometimes too much importance can be placed on that. When you have a guy that is as physically talented as Cam Newton, and I firmly believe that the only players in the league in recent memory that had his pure level of physical talent are Ben Rapistberger, Mike Vick and Daunte Culpepper, perhaps Jay Cutler, then the intangibles and the "want it" matter, but they don't matter as much for those guys as they do for, let's say, an Aaron Rodgers.

In this Super Bowl today we have the model of two DIFFERENT QBs. You have Rodgers, who has physical skills and talent, but his cup does not overflow with it. Then you have the Rapist, whose cup absolutely overflows with physical skills and talent. The Rapist does NOT have good intangibles. I think he's more committed than ever to the art of playing quarterback well, but that's in very large part a response to his beating a rape charge and being suspended, his name being mud with a nation of fans...he's motivated to "show them". Similarly, Vick has never been more motivated, and part of that is his getting out of prison and wanting to show everyone what they've been missing.

Commitment to learning is important, but these guys don't have the track record of being committed that other guys do. Before Vick went to prison, he didn't even study game tapes. He went to an NFC Championship Game, had a winning record as a QB, went to Pro Bowls and was considered one of the very best, and the guy would take game tapes from his coaches and leave them in the car all week never watching them before he played his next game. That's an admitted fact. Meanwhile, Ben Rapistberger has NEVER been regarded by his teammates as a hard worker, or a leader, and in fact I have a friend in the Draft space that spoke with a guy that helped coach him in Pittsburgh, and that coach literally used the word "uncoachable" to describe Ben Rapistberger. And he won two Super Bowls, went to Pro Bowls, had high QB ratings, etc.

My point is, we don't even know if Cam Newton is committed to working hard at the next level. We know he was committed to working hard at Auburn and at Blinn. We have evidence and testimonials to that extent. We know, ON THE FILM, that his learning curve this year as a passer was visually concrete and upward-sloped. You can't possibly look at his passing at the beginning of the year and then at the end of the year and say that he wasn't in the midst of actively learning and actively improving his passing skills. If you do say that, you're lying. But will he work that hard at the next level or was he doing it so that he could get good draft position? That's a good question, and I don't know the answer. Nobody does.

But what I'm saying is...he's got more margin for error on that front than a Blaine Gabbert, or even a Ryan Mallett. You could ask an HONEST teammate if he's a Chad Pennington in the locker room or film room, etc...and the answer could be "Hell no!"...and Cam Newton could still win Super Bowls (plural).

That's just a fact. A sad one, but a fact all the same.

Spot on.
 
I will say this... Cam Newton has proven that he can win with his arm... I've seen it live and in person.


The only defensive coordinator he's faced twice was Ellis Johnson when Auburn faced South Carolina again in the SEC Championship Game...

Cam Newton ran wild on the Game****s the first game... the adjustments Ellis Johnson made for the rematch in the SEC title game was playing more man coverage in an attempt to keep Newton from running for almost 200 yards again.. which was successful. Cam didn't have nearly the same success on the ground...

Problem was, Newton was able to beat them with his arm...


Cam Newton has everything he needs physically to eventually be a very good NFL quarterback.... the only question is the intangibles, mental preparation, dedication to film study, and work ethic.

How he committs himself in these aspects is what's going to determine his NFL career... nothing physically or mechanically is going to decide it.... it's all there.

I'm a little confused? In another thread you said Newton wasn't even worth all the attention he's getting basically, or worth spending so much time debating. And now you seem to be on board?

Where would you draft him? Or would you?
 
I'm a little confused? In another thread you said Newton wasn't even worth all the attention he's getting basically, or worth spending so much time debating. And now you seem to be on board?

Where would you draft him? Or would you?


There's a lot of guys who I don't think are worth squabbling over that I've done countless hours of film study on...it's not just Cam Newton.

Except I don't wait until Miami's season is over before I start getting familiar with college kids.. it's what I do year round every chance I get. I'm a college football guy...

I try to be as fair and balanced as I can with Cam Newton, same goes for all of these guys. If I don't think the knocks are legitimate, I'll try to point that out. If I think too much is being made of the kid as a prospect, I'll point that out as well...

The very first thread I made in this forum dedicated specifically to the quarterbacks in this class I made several months back, and I said then and there that I wouldn't take Cam Newton until after the first 50- 60 picks...

Through it all, I ended up right back where I started...
 
Back
Top Bottom