Dolphins Pass Rush at #4

Discussion in 'Miami Dolphins Forum' started by So Be, Nov 28, 2013.

  1. So Be

    So Be A True Fan

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    https://www.profootballfocus.com/blog/2013/11/27/pass-rushing-productivity-team-defenses/

    PFF put up it's pass rushing productivity for this year. Phins DL is #4, LB's at #10, and DB's at #8 of the 4-3 D's. Overall we are #4.

    Agree or disagree?

    Individually

    DL- Wake #3, Jordan #19, OV #18 (4-3 only). Odrick #5, Starks #7, Soliai #16 (all DT's and NT's).

    LB- Wheeler #3, Misi #30 (4-3), Ellerbe #20 (all).

    DB- Jones #7, Clemons #51 . Carroll #63, Grimes #85 (all).
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Nov 28, 2013
  2. j0hnny63

    j0hnny63 bon jon bovi

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    I have seen nothing yet to disprove my hypothesis that Southbeach 2 is some sort of robot designed for the sole purpose of spitting out PFF stats... :chuckle:
     
  3. Hayden Fox

    Hayden Fox Love Creating Turnovers Donator

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    Good pass rush. Not an issue with me.
     
  4. So Be

    So Be A True Fan

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    Does not compute. :)
     
  5. vere76

    vere76 Rookie

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    Wheeler is #3?
     
  6. DisturbedShifty

    DisturbedShifty Wort-wort-wort!!! Administrator Finheaven VIP

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    Better than the other stats guy. At least Southbeach just posts it and leaves. Instead of trying to use it to prove a player he dislikes is a bad player.
     
  7. So Be

    So Be A True Fan

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    Yeah, rushing the QB is the only thing he has done well this year.
     
  8. FSU Truth

    FSU Truth inside my DNA Finheaven VIP

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    Too bad the tackling part of the pass rush is too advance for him....
     
  9. hoops

    hoops exited stage left

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    Jordan needs more run if not on the edge at end some damn where...but I doubt we see it

    pass rush is not an issue...lb play vs the run is the major problem
     
  10. So Be

    So Be A True Fan

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    True, he has 1 sack, 4 hits, and 17 hurries. Wonder how many hurries should have been sacks? It's still good as there are few 4-3 OLB who bring much of any pressure.
     
  11. hoops

    hoops exited stage left

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    Yeah but our scheme is lb blitz heavy so those numbers are gonna be inflated...

    Curious what barkevious Mingos numbers and ranking are
     
  12. So Be

    So Be A True Fan

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    Agreed. Shelby has been good vs the run but, has rushed the QB 152 times for 3 sacks, 2 hits and 5 hurries. Jordan has rushed 144 times for 2 sacks, 3 hits, and 15 hurries. At least, he can take some snaps from Shelby.
     
  13. Ruckus45

    Ruckus45 FinHeaven VIP Finheaven VIP

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    Sounds right. Our D is playing balls out and keeping us in games.
     
  14. kellyh3034

    kellyh3034 Scout Team

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    They are a good defense just not consistent. Consistent defenses don't let teams beat them at the end of the game. Miami seems to let let crazy things happen to them like that last 4th and 10. No excuse to let that happen. They close out sometimes like the Bengals game which by the way was a great defensive play call by stunting Wake on the inside. They(the Bengals) nor I was expecting such a call. I wish they would get more creative like that.
     
  15. So Be

    So Be A True Fan

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    Mingo has 4 sack, 5 hits, and 13 hurries but, is ranked #37of the 3-4 OLB's on the rush. Looks like PFF's eyeballs don't see him taking advantage of his opportunities.
     
  16. WVDolphan

    WVDolphan A True Fan

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    This is without an offense that ever gives us a big lead and the ability to really turn the pass rush loose. I imagine if Tannehill werent so bad at playing QB, this would be the top ranked pass rush. IMHO, it is the best pass rush, just not statistically.
     
  17. CO-Gator

    CO-Gator They all float down here.

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    Jesus Christ give it a rest already.
     
  18. hoops

    hoops exited stage left

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    He's learning to play lb but it would behoove them to let him rush with a hand in the dirt...all I have seen regular season wise is 2 point stance
     
  19. So Be

    So Be A True Fan

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    I believe the reason we're not #1 in pass rush is the inability to stop the run as in past years. If the opposing O's had to throw, as we do, the pressure would be something special to see.
     
  20. AquaInferno

    AquaInferno Pro Bowler Donator

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    :lol: Sure you're right....

    Sent from my SCH-I545 using Tapatalk
     
  21. Phinatic8u

    Phinatic8u Adam ****ing Gase

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    I, for the life of me, can't understand why Jordan isn't in the Von Miller role, rushing from a 4-3 OLB position..

    Put Wheeler on the bench and put Jordan on the field.
     
  22. Phinatic8u

    Phinatic8u Adam ****ing Gase

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    It would be different if what he was saying was actually truth, like with Henne.

    But he's bashing a 2nd year qb, who is right there with his peers, (besides Wilson). Blows my mind.
     
  23. So Be

    So Be A True Fan

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    Jordan did get 30 snaps last week, up from his norm of 20, and 10 were in coverage. He was not thrown at once. I've been saying he is easily the best cover we have for a TE. He has done nothing to disprove that in his limited play. With his speed, height, long arms, and athleticism, you could not design a better player to cover today's TE's. Yet, he sits and TE's kill us.

    This is addition to what he has shown us as a pass rusher. He should be in somewhere on every obvious pass play.
     
  24. MiamiDolphin618

    MiamiDolphin618 A True Fan

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    Jordan should be playing every single down. He should be playing WOLB when he isnt rushing with his hand in the dirt.

    Coaches say they dont want to exploit him against running teams basically....have they seen Wheeler play? He is useless against the run...hes soft..cant fill the hole..can get off a block..and cant tackle. Im no expert but thats typically not a great combination.
     
  25. dlockz

    dlockz Hall Of Famer

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    doesnt matter if we agree or or not but these numbers mean little because we dont have that great of a pass rush.
     
  26. JTC111

    JTC111 Viva la resistance!!!

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    I don't understand what this kind of statistical cherry-picking is supposed to mean. The only measure of a good team is it's W-L record. Whether we're a good pass rushing team or a bad pass rushing team, we're still 5-6 and there's just nothing to cheer about in that.
     
  27. So Be

    So Be A True Fan

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    OK, I'll bite. Define a "great pass rush."
     
  28. So Be

    So Be A True Fan

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    Imagine, if you will, a forum which talked about nothing but the teams won lost record. You would have few, if any, to post to.

    You're welcome. :)
     
  29. JTC111

    JTC111 Viva la resistance!!!

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    So basically you're posting to avoid boredom?
     
  30. So Be

    So Be A True Fan

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    Not at all, I enjoy discussing these things. On the other hand, you say you do not but, still post to them. Now, who is bored? :)
     
  31. JTC111

    JTC111 Viva la resistance!!!

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    I am. Of these kinds of threads which is why I usually don't engage in them. Single aspects don't define good teams; the whole package is what does it.
    But carry on. Happy Thanksgiving!
     
  32. dlockz

    dlockz Hall Of Famer

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    we are not among the top 4 pass rushing teams would have been a better way to phrase it. There are more than 3 teams with better pass rushes. This includes sacks, hurries that create turnovers and such.
    Buffalo is one of those teams, as is Seattle, St Louis. New Orleans, KC. Hell seeing Phillip Wheeler ranked that high shows how flawed the thier system is.
     
  33. cullenbigcstill

    cullenbigcstill FinHeaven VIP

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    Our defense also has been on the field so much because the offense cannot sustain drives. This will inflate our defensive stats which isn't a true measure of our defense. If they were so good then we would produce more 3 and outs from our defense, but we rarely see 3 and outs from our defense.

    With this defense on the field so much they wear down and they struggle to stop game winning offensive drives simply because they get worn out by being on the field so dam long!
     
  34. Phins89

    Phins89 Well-Known Member

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    I keep hearing how great we are on PFF in a bunch of categories but then I look at the product on the field and it doesn't match.
     
  35. So Be

    So Be A True Fan

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    It does not define the team but, it does the players, and I have interest in how Dolphin players are playing regardless of what the record is. It also does define strengths and weaknesses, and where we need to upgrade to get better.

    Have a Great Thanksgiving.
     
  36. So Be

    So Be A True Fan

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    The article is about the pass rush only, and not creating turnover and such. Which 4-3 OLB do you see as better on the pass rush, aside from Von Miller?
     
  37. cullenbigcstill

    cullenbigcstill FinHeaven VIP

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    I'd much rather have Misi out there instead of Wheeler. Misi has been held out a lot even though he's our best tackler and is getting solid in coverage.

    Kiwanuka is pretty good at OLB rushing the passer like Von Miller.
     
  38. So Be

    So Be A True Fan

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    If you read the article, you would see that the team rankings are based on averages and not just numbers. It also does support your point in that our DL rushed 40 times more than the average of the 15 4-3 D's, the LB's 33 more than average, and DB's 19 more than the average of all D's. Over 11 games it's not a big difference but, it is still a difference which could matter.
     
  39. So Be

    So Be A True Fan

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    PFF is a VG indicator of individual play and rank compared to others but, often that in itself does not translate to the play of the team.
     
  40. dlockz

    dlockz Hall Of Famer

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    Than Wheeler hell Im sure u could name plenty. Hell the guy he replaced is a better pass rusher than him
     
  41. dlockz

    dlockz Hall Of Famer

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    so much
    Well Wheeler is not a stength in this area or maybe any area. I liked him as a low budget signing not so much at his money.He is an ok player good at times but neither he or Ellerbee are worth what they get paid
     
  42. Atila

    Atila Atila - the freshmaker. Finheaven VIP

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    Neither of the LB's we got were a good value, not by a stretch. With that said, our defense has been pretty good this year and has put us in position to win many games. If our offense was running at even average capacity we'd have 7+ wins already.
     
  43. roy_miami

    roy_miami 2020 cant get here soon enough Donator

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    Vernon is leading the team in sacks now.
     
  44. NorthernFin

    NorthernFin Scout Team

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    Our pass rush would be even better if we had a healthy Patterson playing corner.
     
  45. roy_miami

    roy_miami 2020 cant get here soon enough Donator

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    Healthy and Patterson should not be used in the same sentence.
     
  46. So Be

    So Be A True Fan

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    I cannot and Burnett is not. Miller is easily #1. This year, Bruce Irvin is #2, Lavente David is tied for #3 with Wheeler, and Akeem Ayers is #5. Then there is a drop off to Lance Briggs, Chad Greenway, and Malcolm Smith. Burnett is #12.

    Last year, it was Miller at #1. Wheeler was #2 and better with 3 sacks, 14 hits, 13 hurries, and a grade twice as good as this year. Ayers was #3, and Burnett was #8.
     
  47. So Be

    So Be A True Fan

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    Yeah, OV is much improved on the pass rush from a year ago but has dropped off vs the run in taking Odrick's place.
     
  48. So Be

    So Be A True Fan

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    Wake being healthy would not hurt either. He is way off from the FANTASTIC year he had last season.
     
  49. NorthernFin

    NorthernFin Scout Team

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    I agree, he is playing well, but could turn it up a notch. Plus the more plays Dion gets will only help the pass rush. IMO, the D has not peaked yet. They will get better.
     
  50. dlockz

    dlockz Hall Of Famer

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    Thats PFF rating doesnt mean Wheeler is a better pass rusher. In fact that was Wheeler's only good year as a pass rusher. I dont care about PFF's rating becaause as I said they think a hurry and a sack re equal and they are not
     

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