ESPN James Walker: Fins have 3rd best defense........in the AFC East

Discussion in 'Miami Dolphins Forum' started by Crypt Keeper, May 21, 2012.

  1. Crypt Keeper

    Crypt Keeper FinHeaven VIP

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    http://espn.go.com/blog/afceast/post/_/id/42464/ranking-afc-east-defenses

    What a clown this Walker guy is. He says the Jets have the #1 defense and the Bills have the #2 defense. ESPN needs a new AFC East beat writer.
     
  2. nyjunc

    nyjunc A True Fan

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  3. Miamifinz

    Miamifinz Philbin is an idiot Donator

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    Who has been saying this defense is elite? I actually think our D will be top 10, but I actually do kind of agree with him. I think the Bills defense will be vastly improved this year.
     
  4. insomnia411

    insomnia411 The world is yours

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    Why is he a clown? Everything he said is true. The Bills got Mario Williams AND Mark Anderson to improve their d line a ton, the Jets defense is demonstratively better than our's, and our pass D still sucks.
     
  5. MadDog 88

    MadDog 88 TANNERECTION!!!! Donator

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    The Jets have the best D in the division, on paper Buffalo has improved greatly so I can understand to Walkers point. Although Walker is incorrect about Taylor being the leader, the Fins don't have a pass rush other then Wake, still don't have a proven answer at FS, need to fill Bells spot and only have one solid boundary corner. Add in that they will be changing systems and it's easy to be skeptical.
     
  6. Dsteve

    Dsteve Well-Known Member

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    news flash, the pats D is prob better than ours too.
     
  7. MadDog 88

    MadDog 88 TANNERECTION!!!! Donator

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    Not even close. The Pats D is one of the worst in the league.
     
  8. Gonzo

    Gonzo Widerstand Administrator Finheaven VIP

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    The day they realize they actually have to cover TEs is the day we can start talking about them being a good defense. Poor pass defense in a pass-oriented league certainly won't get you there.
     
  9. Nublar7

    Nublar7 Retired Finheaven VIP

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    Dolphins have a better defense than the Bills, even if they added Mario Williams.
     
  10. Gonzo

    Gonzo Widerstand Administrator Finheaven VIP

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    Can't argue with that. I'd put it

    1. jests
    sizeable gap
    2. Phins
    3. jills
    4 patsies
     
  11. vagrantprodigy

    vagrantprodigy A True Fan

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    I've never liked Walker. He doesn't seem overly bright.
     
  12. Vaark

    Vaark Nihil taurus crappus Finheaven VIP Donator

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    Walker has already distinguished himself as an il-informed slug; so there's really nothing to see here.

    However, even if we were to give him the benefit of the doubt as being as right as that proverbial broken clock... ranking #3rd in the AFCE certainly does not disqualify them from still being a league-wide Top 10 D.
     
  13. Nublar7

    Nublar7 Retired Finheaven VIP

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    that is my order also.
     
  14. 13ktownguy

    13ktownguy Well-Known Member

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    Well the Phins allowed the fewest points in the division,that should count for something!!
     
  15. Wildbill3

    Wildbill3 Misery Loves Company Administrator Finheaven VIP

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    lol why be offended? The pats with thier horrible D made the superbowl.
     
  16. Kinzua

    Kinzua A True Fan

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    "Vastly improved" could mean moving into the top half of the league's defenses, which IMO, would be great for the Bills considering they were in the high 20s, and almost as bad as the Pats in pass defense.

    On paper, I'd give the Jets the nod, but I think when they play the games, their statistically rankings will likely falter. I think that they may be pretty good against the run, but teams are going to gouge them in the passing game. Their safeties remain a big liability in the passing game, and there's no guarantee that they'll generate a better pass rush than they did last season. Coples is converting from a 4-3 DE to a 3-4 OLB as well as being a rookie.

    I'd say, as of today, it's:
    Jests
    Fins
    Bills
    Pats
     
  17. Spesh

    Spesh #freespesh

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    Instead of randomly screaming about how the author is horrible at his job, anyone want to address the 25th ranked pass defense? The holes at safety? Losing Mike Nolan? Switching systems to one our players arent best suited for? No?

    Ok, Walker sucks!

    The Bills already had the best safety duo in the division. They probably have one of the best defense tackle duo's in the league. They brought in a force of a defensive end. Even if they get even modest results from top 10 picked corner, and another highly drafted corner on the other side, they should have a tough defense. I see no sin by declaring us third.
    At the moment, we are NOT a more talented team than we were a year ago. People need to get used to that.
     
  18. AdamC13

    AdamC13 Awe "Tight End" my favorite position!

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    Until Miami is able to create more turnovers our defense can't be considered elite imo...

    Defensive Turnovers:

    Patriots: 34 (+17 in turnover differential)
    Jets: 31 (-3)
    Bills: 31 (+1)
    Dolphins: 19 (-6)
     
  19. wonderl33t

    wonderl33t FinHeaven VIP Finheaven VIP Donator

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    They are a bottom 10 defense, but they look worse than they should because the offenses they face get more chances than average (due to Pats offense scoring so much and so quickly).
     
  20. SnakeoilSeller

    SnakeoilSeller Scout Team

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    The next time James Walker writes something positive about the Fins, it will be the first.
     
  21. nyjunc

    nyjunc A True Fan

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    did Miami give him reasons to write anything really positive last year?
     
  22. Wildbill3

    Wildbill3 Misery Loves Company Administrator Finheaven VIP

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    mike nolan's d in the first 7 games was a major reason we went 0-7 and a major reason why our d was so bad statisically at the end of the season. for ****s and giggles, and I don't give a crap enough to bother, one should toss out those 7 games and see how we did over the final 9 games.
     
  23. Tunaphish429

    Tunaphish429 1st Ballot Hall of Famer Donator

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    On paper its hard to disagree...Miamis d is far from elite...we can never get a stop in crunch time and have been eatin alive by even good qbs
     
  24. Spesh

    Spesh #freespesh

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    Was there a single redeeming thing we did the first 7 weeks of last season? Even Reggie didnt start taking off until the Giants game.
    Blaming a single person(who wasnt even on the field) always amuses me. Especially in light of the fact that Mike Nolan is a superior defensive coach who has had success virtually everywhere he's gone since becoming the Ravens defensive coordinator. The majority of our team came into camp out of shape and unmotivated.
     
  25. Zounds

    Zounds A True Fan Donator

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    I dont think anyone can honestly say the Bills have a better defense than Miami, even if they added Mario Williams.

    One simple stat - Miami was 6th in points allowed, and Buffalo was 30th....and Buffalo had more takeaways.

    You can argue we lost Bell, Taylor, Langford, and Nolan....but to say we have slid past a team that was 30th in points allowed is just someone trying to stir the pot.
     
  26. Wildbill3

    Wildbill3 Misery Loves Company Administrator Finheaven VIP

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    must be reading comphrehension day. Maybe i'm misunderstanding you, are you saying I placed all the blame on mike nolan? Please show me where I "SOLELY" blamed mike Nolan for the dolphins losing the first 7 games.
     
  27. AdamC13

    AdamC13 Awe "Tight End" my favorite position!

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    First 7 games:

    380 yards per game...270 passing / 110 rushing...23.7 PPG

    Last 9 games:

    317 yards per game...233 passing / 84 rushing...16.3 PPG

    To me the big difference comes back to turnovers which puts an end to yards and scoring by opposing offense while setting up our own offense and momentum:

    First 7 games = 4 turnovers

    Last 9 games = 15 turnovers
     
    Last edited by a moderator: May 21, 2012
  28. Zounds

    Zounds A True Fan Donator

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    FYI John Clayton reported late last season that Mike Nolan lost his play calling duties and/or game planning halfway through the season to Todd Bowles. Not sure if its true but it does make sense.

    I also believe that Mike Nolan underachieved with the players we had on defense. Its not all his fault, but he needs to be held accountable.
     
  29. Spesh

    Spesh #freespesh

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    Never stated soley, but you specified "Mike Nolan's defense" as a major reason why we lost.

    I also suppose my point was more general as we always have threads pop up screaming "Karlos Dansby cost us the season!", "good thing Marshall is gone, he lost us countless games!", "we shouldnt resign Wake, he lost us games by not getting enough pressure!", "we should trade Long, elite LT's dont win games!", etc, etc, etc. You pointed out Nolan as a major reason, i pointed out our entire team sucked.
     
  30. Spesh

    Spesh #freespesh

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    Oh man, if thats true that is absolutely hilarious. Anyone remember the reason why we got Nolan in the first place? Because after starting out undefeated Josh McDaniels demanded that Nolan stop calling blitzes, so after their off week they "played it more safe". Directly related: they lost the next 8 out of 10 games. After the season they both decided it wasnt working.
     
  31. Wildbill3

    Wildbill3 Misery Loves Company Administrator Finheaven VIP

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    yep our entire team sucked. However if our d had played up to the numbers they posted over the last half of the season in the beginning of the season, we don't lose 7 in a row. It's undeniable.
     
  32. tay0365

    tay0365 FinHeaven VIP Finheaven VIP Donator

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    :rolleyes2: See Junc, this is why you continually get yourself in huge trouble. Nobody is offending your Jets, nobody is calling you out, and here you are talking trash about the Dolphins.
     
  33. Spesh

    Spesh #freespesh

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    O-kay. And if our players had come into camp in shape we would have won more games. If we drafted Andy Dalton we probably would have won games at the beginning of the season. If we didnt have a coaching staff and front office invested in Chad Henne LONG after it was apparent that he couldnt cut it, we would have won more games. If we hadnt signed Marc Colombo we would have won more games. If Tony Sparano could figure out how to manage a football game we probably would have won more games.

    I dare say those points are undeniable as well. Im not sure im understanding the point. Nolan deserves blame for the first few games of struggling but he also deserves credit for turning the unit around? I'll agree with that. But Mike Nolan is no longer here. I dont think its a gross insult for a writer to look at our team and go "well, they got older, they have more holes, they are switching to a system that the players arent really best suited for, they have a rookie coordinator and they couldnt stop the pass even when they had a proven defensive coordinator.....hmm, ill place them third".
     
  34. LikeUntoGod

    LikeUntoGod The Oracle

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    Stats like this is why I gave Matt Moore a pass on his first 3 games starting. As a team we took a long time to start playing decent football. Lack of work outs before the season plus adding a OC who did not seem to know what he wanted to do plus Thomas, Clay and Gates etc being hurt. The OL was poor. Daboll had little idea what to do with R Bush.

    Same thing on defense. Everyone was out of shape and I'm not sure if Nolan had everyone up to speed.

    I can agree with this writer. At least until the games begin. If you look at the draft and free agency, the Patriots, Jets and Bills all went defense. We went offense.

    We are switching to a 4-3 without having a great MLB. K Dansby is on his last season, two at most. We do not have 3 good solid corners and our safeties are suspect.

    IMO, this is one reason we ran the ball so much, to shorten games and keep the ball out of the other offense's hands.
     
  35. Jetsfan0099

    Jetsfan0099 Scout Team

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    The Jets defense has been top 5 the past 3 seasons since Rex became HC, Rex wasn't as hands on with the defense last season but he will be this season. And I don't see how teams are going to gouge us in the passing game... Last season with a mediocre pass rush and bad safeties we still had a top 5 pass defense. We have IMO the best CB tandem in the league. And our safeties should be better than last season, if Laron Landry is healthy hes a guy that can ran a 4.35 coming into the league and has the range to blow guys up over the middle. Bell is better than Eric Smith. Overall I like our depth better at safety than last season, we have guys that should be more active, a lot depends on if Landry can stay healthy and if our rookies can contribute. My biggest issue with the defense is the lack of depth at OLB, Coples is not converting to OLB, he will be playing with his hand in the dirt. Bryan Thomas is coming off of a significant surgery and is older, not much of a pass rusher to begin with. Then there is Pace who is solid but not much of a pass rusher. Aaron Maybin has to build off of last season. But for the most part, the Jets play team defense.
     
    nyjunc likes this.
  36. Pimento13

    Pimento13 Member

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    I am not sure how well are D will be with the new coaches in place. I think it will take a little bit to get everyone to gel together but i think we will be ook. i think a mid pack ranked D for the year.
     
  37. Wildbill3

    Wildbill3 Misery Loves Company Administrator Finheaven VIP

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    don't be obtuse. I'm working with the knowledge that A.) our defense cost us the a lot of game last season esp in the beginning. B.) nolan was the DC (which I don't know why the **** i'm explaining this, probably has something to do with a poster being obtuse. C.) the D failing is ultimately on mike nolan. Of course the team failing is ultimately on sparano. which is why those two both deserved to be fired. I have no problem with saying the phins have the 3rd place D going into the season. heck I have no problem wtih saying they have the fourth place D. You don't subtract things like coaches and players and expect to have people see those as pluses.

    btw if nolan didn't turn the unit around, then who did? who deserves the credit for making the D respectable by the end of the season? in this very thread someone said bowles deserves the credit. if so, I don't know how anyone could defend nolan based on last years 7 games of crap and 9 games of reduced authority. (waiting on confirmation of his "demotion".)

    ---------- Post added at 01:04 PM ---------- Previous post was at 01:03 PM ----------

    If rex is smart, he'll keep his hands off the d, and keep the ball out of sanchez's hands too.
     
  38. MiamiDolfan85

    MiamiDolfan85 DA M.I.A IS WHERE I STAY

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    have to agree....cant expect to have one of the best defenses when we arnet even sure how we're gonna use our pieces on defense yet



    we're a ? mark, at best right now.
     
  39. Statler Waldorf

    Statler Waldorf Bench Warmer

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    This ESPN analyst is a joke. Total Defense is the most deceptive stat in the NFL, it’s truly all about scoring defense; if you can’t score on a defense you can’t beat that team. The Dolphins were 6[SUP]th[/SUP] in scoring defense; the Jets were an embarrassing 20[SUP]th[/SUP]. The AFC East standings based on this crucial stat should be as follows…

    1. Miami
    2. New England
    3. New York
    4. Buffalo
     
  40. Nublar7

    Nublar7 Retired Finheaven VIP

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    I am pretty sure Philbin, Coyle and Ireland know exactly how they are going to use their pieces.
     
  41. drumzan

    drumzan Active Member

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    James Walker and the rest of the NFL media is ALWAYS going to be bias against the Dolphins.

    What he fails to talk about is that the Dolphins defense gave up a lot of their points off turnovers. The only knock I have on the Dolphins defense is making more plays (sacks, INT's, fumbles, tackles for loss, etc). With Coyles as the new DC, we're definitely going to be seeing more playmakers.

    Adding Mario Williams to a defense doesn't automatically make them better than other defenses. The Jets are overrated on all accounts. I would put the Dolphins as the top defense. And I think the Pats D will improve greatly .
     
  42. ReppinThe941

    ReppinThe941 Well-Known Member

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    We absolutely have the best defense in our division.....The Jets have zero pass rush and outside of Revis have a very difficult time covering anyone one-on-one for the 3 seconds they have too. They are also not as good at shutting down the run since Jenkins began his slew of injuries. Bart Scott is well past his prime and regularly gets stood up by FB and G's. Rex may be the most defensive minded coach in the division but his blitz schemes have lost much of there luster and the humorous part is that Sparano drafted the blue print to neutralize there multiple/free blitzer scheme.

    Miami by far has the most depth and is the most talented in the front 7. Yes the bills got Mario who played 4 games last year and Mark Anderson who the pass rush needy Pats let walk. The Bills also have a post steroid Merriman and a has been Nick Barnett headlining there LBing corps. Meaning there LBs suck. Dansby and Burnett trump any Lbs in our division maybe now being rivaled by Mayo and Hightower.

    Also the reason we were 25th against the pass is because we shut down the run and Nolan was deathly afraid to play aggressive in obvious passing situations. When all you do is play predictable coverage and your stud pass rusher gets mugged all day its gonna be tough to stop Terrific Tom.

    Best front 7, all kinds of talent and potential in the defensive secondary....if our guys can hold onto the ball this year our defense will be feared around the League.....

    NYJunc thinking the Jets defense is best in the division......dude wake up.....Jets had one stellar year on D and still lost to Peyton.....your window is closed and you have nothing at QB...head on back to gang green.
     
  43. nyjunc

    nyjunc A True Fan

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    so most of Miami's points allowed came off turnovers but the Jets are overrated? do you realize the Jets turned it over 34 times while Miami turned it over 25 times but the Jets D is overrated and Miami's D has the TO excuse.

    I do agree our D was not very good last year but it's going to be more '09 & '10 like than '11 like this year

    ---------- Post added at 02:32 PM ---------- Previous post was at 02:31 PM ----------

    how does the best D in the division help their team start 0-7? anything after 0-7 you can throw out b/c your season was over.

    It's funny how you guys tell me our D is overrated(a year ago I'd agree), our coach isn't very good and our QB stinks yet we seem to have success every year- how does that happen?
     
  44. NY8123

    NY8123 Sophisticated Redneck Administrator Finheaven VIP

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    The list is correct if you base it off from last season performace and moves up until this point in the season. The Jets have the best D in the division, they have proven it time and time again over the past few seasons. Miami is 2nd or 3rd until they prove themselves and if you are making a list off paper comparisons the Bills did more in the offseason on that side of the ball to warrant the leap frog of Miami to 2nd on the list.

    Like it or not Miami has a huge question mark at both safety positions, they have an overpaid ILB who should be an all pro but isn't and they need a pass rusher to complement Wake. The switch to the hybrid 43/34 will help out the unit but in the NFL you better be able to shut down the passing game and unless I missed something in football 101, the safety position and pass rush have major implications on pass coverage and how well it is executed.
     
  45. ReppinThe941

    ReppinThe941 Well-Known Member

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    Um its a team game there junc....There are 3 aspects to the game last time i checked and we weren't very good at the offensive part last year to open things up.....also the shortened offseason and our TERRIBLE coaching may have played a roll. its good though beacuse now Sparano is your problem...so be ready to watch Tebow wild cat it up all day while marky stuffs his face with wieners on the sideline. 8-8 is success? All that is is missing the playoffs and getting a terrible draft position. Its like the worst of both worlds.....now im not gonna say if your not gonna make the playoffs....losee every game, etc. but im just saying missing the playoffs in the nfl...not one person characterizes that year as a success.

    Oh yea we did start 0-7..so we didnt win like anything the first half of the year...and yet finish only two games behind you....including taggin that behind week 17 when we ended your season....i wont forget Marky fav target...Randy Starks...he threw more competitions to our 300+ lbs d-lineman that game than he did to his #1 wr Santonio.....dang...but your year was a success as you mentioned.
     
  46. Roman529

    Roman529 Moon Runner / The 3 AM Crew

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  47. NYPhin24

    NYPhin24 Scout Team

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    and you know that how?
     
  48. nyjunc

    nyjunc A True Fan

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    you beat us in a close game and we would have been eliminated either way and last I checked you still finished 2 games behind us despite beating us in week 17, right? You haven't been closer than 2 games behind us since 2008.
     
  49. nyjunc

    nyjunc A True Fan

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    I can't say I KNOW it, many things can happen but I expect it for many reasons.

    -Rex calling the D again- this is HUGE
    -Coples & Davis
    - slimmed down, motivated Bart Scott
    -bryan thomas back
    -Mo Wilkerson in year 2
    -improved safety play

    I expect somewhere btw 2009 & 2010 production.
     
  50. josekareh

    josekareh Finfansince75

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    Yes!!! and the best Qb too, not to mention the best WRs and the best OC... Superbowl Caliber team!!!!!
     

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