Full AFC East Grades (Plus NY Giants)

[Spesh]

I think you are letting your want of Mallett influence the grade on Thomas CK

I think you are letting your homerism influence your posts.

The past 2 days ive seen posts saying: "ha! Mallett is dropping, there is something we dont know!", then "Ha! He is still dropping, laughable that people wanted him at 15!". Then he finally ends up with the Patriots and its "Oh, well he sucks anyways." That sort of pure denial and blind homerism is mind boggling. You act as though any player that Ireland drafts is a home run and any player a division rival drafts is awful. And you have the audacity to declare others "influenced"?
The hypocrisy is especially amusing considering Chad Henne was a quarterback every team passed on(almost twice) yet we are now relying on. A player taken in the second round, a round which Ireland and others have admitted to making mistakes. Oh! Like Daniel Thomas. But hey, dont be influenced!

Ck stuck with the opinion he formed months ago. Its an opinion many of us shared because of research and projection. Many scouts and "experts" agreed with that opinion as they were very few on the field concerns about the prospect and many people starting talking complaining about things that had nothing to do with the quarterback position. I thought it was hilarious the "concern" that grew in the last 2 weeks that he didn't run fast enough to play quarterback.

Missing on a draft pick sure as hell influences your draft grade. But hey, if you want to talk purely about Daniel Thomas: why shouldnt he be a "D"? God forbid we grade someone badly who isnt fast, lacks burst, runs high, and fumbles the damn football. But wait! Ireland drafted him! He must be a stud! Because all of our second round picks have worked out so well in recent history. And i'm not being influenced at all!

Sometimes: you can dislike the selection and passing on a good player. It doesnt have to be one or the other. Ck posted a sentence "He did not impress me in 2009, but when I re-visited him in 2010 his pad level seemed to come down, and he looked a lot more instinctive, like a true tailback, rather than playing like an athlete." The fact that we continue to take projects for positions that shouldnt require it would make me give this entire draft a "F".

Every other team in the NFL manages to find running backs and interior linemen is later rounds with 0 problems. When Miami has to burn high draft picks to fill those same positions: you get a lower draft grade then other teams. Its a thing called value.

 

[Spesh]

i think that your piece on ryan mallett didn't get all the dirt on the kid...that there was more going on which was my thinking pretty much all along when i kept hearing 2nd round pick despite 1st round talent...that fact that he was on the board in round 3 pretty much solidified it to me... you praise the patriots for taking the chance but lets face it the pats have a gluttony of picks and can afford to have one outright fail if that was to happen...we don't have that luxury...we got to make sound decisions...we spent plenty of time with ryan mallett and in the end decided the character and other off field concerns were too much to invest in...like the rest of the league until late round 3...you've said so yourself if you think he's a franchise qb you take him in round 1 you don't wait around...we didn't take him no one did...that says a lot to me...

i know you did a piece on the guy and all but good grief you kept telling me during the bowl game againt ohio st how much you didn't like him...how he wasn't a guy you'd take with pick #15 then you do a complete 180 and now you come off as a jilted lover with these grades...

i agree with the pouncey assessment...i've said it since day 1 you don't take interior oline in the top 20 unless you are getting hutchinson at guard or nick mangold at center...it was bad value...no matter how you slice it

The highlighted i disagreed with. There isnt a coach on a hotter seat then Jack Del Rio. His owner publically and privately stated he needs to go to the playoffs or he will be fired. Even with that: they traded up(very reasonable trade) to go get Blaine Gabbert, and they already stated in a interview this year's starting quarterback would be David Garrard.
The coach certainly won't be around to see the value of that pick, and the GM might not either. But they pulled the trigger and made the trade because it was in the best interests of the team.

The Patriots felt Ryan Mallett's on the field production was worth a third round pick. For us? I'm seeing words like "luxury" or "time" or "might fail". Good teams take chances that have risks and rewards. This front office might not have the "luxury", but it would still have been in the best interest of the team. And thats why they should have pulled the trigger.

 

[RobertHorry]

Completely disagree with these grades. This is one of the only posts I have disagreed to such a large degree.

Pouncey is a B

Daniel Thomas is a B+.

Theres no way Thomas pick was a D-. Ever in one way shape or form. Thomas is a glider and has explosive hips. Able to skate and sink his hips and use them on a swivel when running. I LOVE the Thomas Pick. Heck, it might be my favorite pick since the Chris Clemons and Sean Smith picks.

Look, the Dolphins offense is going to be a mismatch offense a la Patriots. Find the mismatch and exploit it quickly. The Dan Henning offense was "Were going to beat you straight up and down the field." This offense is the mismatch offense.

Maybe they saw something with Mallet they didn't like when they tried to spot out mismatches at the LOS quickly as possible. Maybe Henne is exponentially increasing his ability to read the LOS and move in the pocket. You dont know the deal. But what this draft tells me so far is that they dont believe any of the quarterbacks will be as good as Henne.

 

[Spesh]

Maybe they saw something with Mallet they didn't like when they tried to spot out mismatches at the LOS quickly as possible. Maybe Henne is exponentially increasing his ability to read the LOS and move in the pocket. You dont know the deal. But what this draft tells me so far is that they dont believe any of the quarterbacks will be as good as Henne.

And we would know this because our coaching staff has been able to work closely with our players this offseason to make sure they are ready for this new offense...

Oh wait.

 

[DKphin]

He will be an excellent toy for Bill Cowher to play with

Is this sarcasm? I do not follow.

 

[ckparrothead]

I love how because of peoples' homerism, I'm supposed to release grades that totally contradict what I have been saying about all these players and philosophies for MONTHS. That's...special.

 

[Breed]

I'm not saying everybody should love Thomas, but I do remember you saying he is a guy we should target and he would fit, and as Hoops said up until recently you weren't exactly Mallet's biggest supporter and if I'm not mistaken did you not say in the past that this is a bad QB class?

All I'm saying is Thomas IMO is not a D-.

It's not Thomas that's getting the D- grade; it's passing up Mallett that warrants such a grade. Thomas, even if he reaches his upside, will give us around 5 solid years. Mallett could be a franchise QB for the next 10-15 years. In short, not only does Mallett probably have a higher floor than Thomas, but he also has a much, much higher ceiling. This could very well end up defining Ireland's legacy.

 

[vaneasy2338]

I love how because of peoples' homerism, I'm supposed to release grades that totally contradict what I have been saying about all these players and philosophies for MONTHS. That's...special.

I don't think anyone asked you to do that, ck. They might disargee with you, they might be anger with you, but I don't think anyone expected you to lie to us just to appease us. Any quick thoughts on Gates & Clay ck?

 

[Breed]

I love how because of peoples' homerism, I'm supposed to release grades that totally contradict what I have been saying about all these players and philosophies for MONTHS. That's...special.

I agree 100%. I can't believe there are so many fans that are ok with the Thomas selection. Even if Thomas manages to reach his perceived upside, if Mallett ever comes close to reaching his upside, the Thomas selection could end up being remembered as one of the worst draft picks in franchise history.

 

[lil tom digby]

I've been Dolphin fan for almost almost 40 years. I've watched the draft since 1989. For the last ten years, Qb is the position I've paid the most attention to. Two years ago I started watching Mallet and thought, man wouldn't it be nice if the Dolphins had a shot at this kid when he comes out. When they traded up I just knew Mallet was the pick. When they passed a second time I realized that what I look for in a QB and what this FO apparently looks for aren't the same thing. I like Daniel Thomas and hope he does awesome, but until proven otherwise I think passing on Mallet was a huge mistake. That he went to the Patriots only adds insult to injury. Well, I guess it's time to start studying next years QB class. Thanks for the write up CK.

 

[Breed]

I've been Dolphin fan for almost almost 40 years. I've watched the draft since 1989. For the last ten years, Qb is the position I've paid the most attention to. Two years ago I started watching Mallet and thought, man wouldn't it be nice if the Dolphins had a shot at this kid when he comes out. When they traded up I just knew Mallet was the pick. When they passed a second time I realized that what I look for in a QB and what this FO apparently looks for aren't the same thing. I like Daniel Thomas and hope he does awesome, but until proven otherwise I think passing on Mallet was a huge mistake. That he went to the Patriots only adds insult to injury. Well, I guess it's time to start studying next years QB class. Thanks for the write up CK.

Even with what should be a terrific QB draft class next year, I have zero confidence we'll find our franchise QB with the clowns we currently have in office. Here's to hoping the Dolphins finish with a bad enough record that we not only change regimes but also have a top 5 pick so we can land Luck/Barkley/Jones.

 

[ckparrothead]

I don't think anyone asked you to do that, ck. They might disargee with you, they might be anger with you, but I don't think anyone expected you to lie to us just to appease us. Any quick thoughts on Gates & Clay ck?

Edmond Gates is an "A" pick for the Dolphins. This is a guy I'd have been comfortable with in the 2nd round, probably the fastest wide receiver in the Draft (IMO), and he has what I personally believe is a really good amount of control on his own athleticism. He hits on a theme I love, which is a guy that switched sports or positions and then came a long way really quickly. He was a basketball guy when he got convinced by his cousin Bernard Scott and his best friend Johnny Knox to come with them to Abilene Christian. He did and I'm actually kind of impressed with some of the polish he's shown there. It's by no means a finished product and he needs to learn the route tree but I think it's going to come natural to him which is important. Another thing that is impressive is that he seems to be good tracking the ball in the air and hauling it in. Catches with his hands. Real good player IMO. Has a chance to be a bonafied starter, not just some speedy role player.

Charles Clay is not a guy that POPS for me on the field but I do like his pick because philosophically it jives for me, and I like what it means as far as what they're thinking about the #2 TE position, and having passing game weapons around our quarterback, rather than just guys to stay in and max protect while Brandon Marshall runs the only relevant route. The idea behind this pick is a familiar one. It's the same reason they tend to like guys from that Hawaii/June Jones system. If you want a pass catcher, who better to pick from than guys that...hold onto your hats...CAUGHT A LOT OF PASSES! Novel idea, I know. Seriously though, they're looking for a #2 TE, and they recognize he's sort of a tweener but he has the body to play H-Back and he's caught for like 2000+ yards and 21 TDs in his career. You're not going to find many genuine Tight End prospects that had that kind of production, that kind of experience being a big part of the passing game. Clay touched the ball a lot and so I expect they're going to use him to do just that, release on a lot of routes, not block very much, and catch the ball. On that basis, I like the pick, would give it something like a "B-" or "B".

I have no real opinions of Frank Kearse or Jimmy Wilson.

 

[phillyphinphan]

Im a lil shocked at the grades for our first two picks...I think both pouncey and thomas will see the field in year one and be pretty productive...Thats part of the goal when drafting in rounds one and two, at the spots where we selected...

 

[ckparrothead]

Im a lil shocked at the grades for our first two picks...I think both pouncey and thomas will see the field in year one and be pretty productive...Thats part of the goal when drafting in rounds one and two, at the spots where we selected...

Well, Daniel Thomas is definitely going to get some production. Miami only has Lex Hilliard on roster and Daniel was the only tailback drafted. Productive means yards, he'll get yards. But will he be doing really well? I think he could do alright, but long term I believe there were better ways to go. Miami laid a net, strikes me as thin, strikes me as very risky. EVERYTHING has to break the right way from here on out...or they could be in big trouble. And for THIS regime, after the Harbaugh fiasco, and with guys like Carl Peterson and Bill Cowher hanging around the periphery...they need things to break right to prevent getting cleaned out. I almost think getting cleaned out was inevitable for them. But, I do think that a young franchise QB that plays early (a little, not talking Day 1) and shows PROMISE would have bought them time.

Ask yourself this...with Daniel Thomas being "the" guy...what if he is not that good?

What if we can't get Carson Palmer? Does it even MATTER if Daniel Thomas and Mike Pouncey are good, if we don't have a QB?

What if the Defense actually, god forbid, suffers a little reversion to the mean? Some people aren't very convinced on Sean Smith, some more people aren't very convinced that Koa Misi gives us genuine pass rush. Cam Wake had a career year, what if he drops off? Joey Porter had a career year in 2008, dropped off something fierce in 2009. If that happens, does Koa Misi pick up the slack? I love Koa but I don't think he does.

A lot could go wrong but IMO if you get yourself a franchise QB that starts showing promise in your system...you place a BUFFER on yourselves...because as long as that guy looks good, and as long as YOU brought him in...you're a lot safer then you think.

 

[phintim]

Ck these guys have to win to save their jobs. We can kick the can around that they will have more time if they pick a rookie QB they will be given more time but who really knows. Logically their draft makes sense and follow their pattern in the past. They needed to beef up the OL, RB and a speedy WO to stretch the field the first 3 picks addressed that and from that point it is an A plus. They basically got the highest rated players for those needs BUT I do agree with you on the Sporano OL observation and hate us spending so much on a position that should already be beefed up at this point. I would argue with you that special teams cost us games early in the season, defense even folded a game or two and the last half of the season the offense went missing due to the running game, oline and Henne. I would argue that when we were playing the Jets the last half of the season Henne was connecting and Sanchez was not connecting with the broad side of the barn. In fact Sanchez had more than a couple of game like that but the Jets still won and they still love Sanchez. I would not argue how good of QB that Henne is with you because you really study the situation more than I but IMO Henne would be doing fine in NY if he were a Jet. Still the Jets won we did not and for that I blame Sporano. After watching years of drafting by the fins Ireland is at least the 2nd best we have behind JJ. I liked JJ which like Bill Belliceck collected draft picks. Maybe Bill learned that from him hum. Anyway I hate seeing us move up in the draft with so few picks. I think that Ireland reaches a bit but is pretty solid. I am not sold on Bill Cower either as our answer as they won but not all the time like they are now so I think more has to do with the front office at Pitt than Bill Cower. If we clean house unless the VP has a stellar draft track record I retain Jeff Ireland. Sporano had a say in this draft today it is the only straw he had and he played it the way he had to for a very remote chance to save his job that all.
Marsall would have taken over the team as coach if we had picked up Mallet and ran Tony S out of town now Marshall will have to play ball because Henne is his only option. I agree with Tony S logic here but he needs to worry about coaching and finding the right coaches like he did last year for the defense so far his offensive coaching hires leave much to be desired IMO. I see our DC taking over the team mid season. Anyway if the QB rookie is the answer like you insist he will be in a much better position to suceed next year than this year.