Hey Fiedler Huggers...a doable Qb Upgrade

Discussion in 'Miami Dolphins Forum' started by fin-atic, Jan 15, 2003.

  1. fin-atic

    fin-atic Are you a VIP? Finheaven VIP Donator

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    By the way this is my new name for the Jay supporters who like to refer to us realist as "Fiedler Bashers".

    I keep seeing "Show me a doable QB Upgrade?"

    Here it is. Plain and simple.

    How do we get a better QB? That's not so hard. You rework veterans contracts, you cut the dead weight (Rodgers, Ruddy, etc) and free the money up. You trade for or sign Griese. He isn't wanted he will come cheap from Denver. The cap experts agree that when the dust settles Miami will have the $$ to sign one or two high profile free agents.

    You also draft a young QB. Maybe a Dorsey or Kingsbury. You throw them in and groom them for the future.

    When the season starts I like the thoughts of having Griese starting and a talented rookie learning the system for the future.

    We will be in better cap shape than last year. We managed to sign Ricky didn't we? There is a way.

    I would also take any of these QBs out there instead of Griese:

    Plummer
    Couch
    Holcomb
    Bulger
    Warner

    Of course I know that many of those will not be available, but I would take any of them that would be. Couch or Holcomb may be a possibility as could be Warner or Bulger. Not enough balls to go around for all those guys.

    Now here is my counter question...how do you Fiedler Huggers justify Jays pathetic performance the last two games with the season on the line? If you don't have the stats look at my posts or go to NFL.Com and click schedules then go to the games and click on them for game stats.

    He threw for terrible yardage and terrible completion ratio. What good does the first five games do you if you can not step up when the team needs you ?

    Final point. When Miami signed Carter, Ricky said on his site that he was glad because they "have no leaders on offense". What does that tell you aout your QB?

    Sorry but:

    JAY MUST GO!
     
  2. Baz

    Baz Ephemeral

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    Interesting. So you have solved our QB problem(at least you think you have). Now what about the rest of the team? We need OL, WR help, OLB, nickel and dime backs, a KR/PR, and probably a new punter. With the decent contract that your savior QB is going to want and have to get, where are you going to get the space to get those upgrades? If things were that easy, we'd all be GMs......
     
  3. iceblizzard69

    iceblizzard69 A True Fan

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    That shows what you know about QBs. You want Kingsbury, a guy who can throw 5 yards? Or Dorsey (a guy who I actually like and said we should draft but then I got some sense) who can't throw the ball well either and all he has is a football mind but not a QB arm. Saying we should draft one of those two guys wipes out what I think of your evaluation of QBs.
     
  4. Migs182005

    Migs182005 Finheaven.com Staff Writer

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    I don't think we have to draft a QB for the future because i think Rosenfels is it, but if the talent is there for the picking, you don't just let it slip. i would love an upgrade over Fiedler, but I just don't think it's the most important spot on this team.
     
  5. iceblizzard69

    iceblizzard69 A True Fan

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    I can't say I have ever seen Rosenfels play a full game because I haven't, the only time I saw him was a preseason game in Japan (in which he did well), but I really don't think he is our QB of the future. I don't think its because he was traded for a 7th round pick, because I know that Washington had too many QBs so the deal made sense for Washington because they would have had to release him. However, I wouldn't call a guy who threw 8 TDs and 12 INTs in his senior year of college a QB for the future. I think he can be a good backup, but I don't think he is a NFL starter. Then again, I can't say this is because I have seen him play multiple times, I am just basing this on stats.
     
  6. Prime Time

    Prime Time Screw You Guys..Im Goin Home!!!

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    If Rosenfels is our future....I hope we have some studs at WR to make him look good.
     
  7. Migs182005

    Migs182005 Finheaven.com Staff Writer

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    lol, I know the numbers don't back it up, but i've seen him perform and he's looked good. Chances are i'm wrong about him being our future, but it's not out of the question. I like him, but he needs more playing time.
     
  8. fin-atic

    fin-atic Are you a VIP? Finheaven VIP Donator

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    Our defense was ranked fourth. Our RB tops in the league.

    O line and LB upgrade can be had with free agents and the draft. There are not any high dollar players at those positions in free agency. The ones that are there can be had at a price that will fit.

    I bet when you CUT (yes I said cut)Jay, and Rodgers and Ruddy. Rework other deals you will find the money you need.

    Also on Oline youu only really need a LT. Lets take lets say. Flozell Adams for conversation sakes. That gi9ves you a line of:

    Adams, Dixon, McKinney, Nails, and then Wade.

    I think we can live with that line, don't you?

    At linebacker, there really isn't alot out there. I agree it's a need, a big need. What is out there will not be too costly.

    You guys act like everything is etched in stone and can;t be negotiated. Hell for years, teams like San Francisco, Dallas, Tampa Bay, and recently Washington, have found ways to renegotiate, use incentives, etc. to constantly trade up in the draft, get veteran help etc.

    We can do it too. Cap is not as big a problem as you guys keep thinking it is.

    The same balls lacking on the field is also lacking in our front office.
     
  9. Dolfan984

    Dolfan984 A True Fan

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    Cut Jay? Like that will happen.

    Jay Fiedler is better than Brian Griese, Jake Plummer, or any other loser QB in the FA department that wouldn't cost TONS of money to get. Jay is not our problem. You are not a realist, you are just a Fiedler basher.
     
  10. fin-atic

    fin-atic Are you a VIP? Finheaven VIP Donator

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    Re: Re: Hey Fiedler Huggers...a doable Qb Upgrade

    Okay "Mr QB" wiseguy:

    What logic do you have against these two guys in the face of their glaring statisitcs? C'mon Mel Kiper jr. lets hear what you briong to the table that is supported by facts.

    Worse case scenario is they don't pan out and you look at the draft next year. Hell I am looking at athletes I think will be available not who I want. Is Palmer, or Grossman going to be there at #50? I don't think so.

    I would rather have one of them who MAY pan out then Rosenfels. Hell even keep Jay as #2 and place the rookie at #3.

    So why don't you bring something to the table dealing with facts and theories rather than be a smart as-s.
     
  11. fin-atic

    fin-atic Are you a VIP? Finheaven VIP Donator

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    Give me some data some facts to suppor this. You can't, no one can. Why? Because its not real.

    FOIedler Hugger! Fiedler Hugger!
     
  12. Baz

    Baz Ephemeral

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    29-13..........
     
  13. Dolfan984

    Dolfan984 A True Fan

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    Alright first off, before my next post, I have to do this...

    "FOIedler Hugger"


    :)
     
  14. fin-atic

    fin-atic Are you a VIP? Finheaven VIP Donator

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    Hey Great BMarion!!

    I bet the other 23 plus players who played each game would love to know Jay won all those games!!

    I bet our defense had nothing to do wiht it did it? Or Ricky?

    We won inspite of Jay, not because of Jay. Show me one game he has thrown for over 400 yards in? How many over three hundred?

    Please don't insult my intelligence with that win record crap. He is lucky to have been carried by our defense and running game for three years.
     
  15. Baz

    Baz Ephemeral

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    LMAO, you're in trouble now fin-atic. 984 is busting out the big guns. Let him have it......
     
  16. fin-atic

    fin-atic Are you a VIP? Finheaven VIP Donator

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    Its easy to be a proof reader when that's all you have to bring to the table.

    In case you struggled with it let me correct it for you:

    Fiedler Hugger! Fiedler Hugger! Fiedler Hugger! Fiedler Hugger!
     
  17. Baz

    Baz Ephemeral

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    I get it, when we win it is in spite of Jay Fiedler, but when we lose, its because of him, right? How about the Raiders game where he ran it in on the last play of the game? I'm not saying he is a top 5, or even top 10 QB. I'm saying he is sufficient enough to win. Personally, I think he is a very good QB, but I'm not going to argue my personal opinion here. The FACT is, he wins. You can skew those facts however you want, but his record is 29-13, best among active QBs.......
     
  18. fin-atic

    fin-atic Are you a VIP? Finheaven VIP Donator

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    I happen to agree. He is not even a top 10 and that has been my point all along. If we are not okay with Derrick Rodgers because he is mediocre or with McNight who is mediocre, why are we willing toi settle for medicore for arguably the most important position on the field?? IF there is any place you need a playmaker, its at QB.

    I don't want sufficient. I want a QB who can scare the opposition.
     
  19. VanDolPhan

    VanDolPhan A True Fan

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    OMG. I've lost what little respect I've had for your opinion. Your judgement is clouded by your hatred of Jay. Yah cut Jay and ADD to our salary cap? Yah that's bright......cut a guy after the first year of a decently sized contract. Add a couple million to our salary cap.

    You think you can get your QB (cake) and eat it to? Any of those QB's (and if you think Bulger/Holcomb are playing at that wage next year you can fuggetaboutit!) will eat up what LITTLE cap room we have. Adams/Konrad alone would eat up most of our cap space. Once we add in your line of Dixon and Nails the cap space IS gone (they are FA's remember).

    Either way the cap space isn't there "KB21 Fielder bashing luver". Your bordering on obsessive compulsive man.
     
  20. fin-atic

    fin-atic Are you a VIP? Finheaven VIP Donator

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    Gee Van. I will cry myself to sleep without your "respect".

    So with your great cap brain tell me what will be our cap postion after we cut Rodgers and Ruddy? What will it be after we re-work Zach's contract Which has already been approached?
    What about reworking Madison's?

    You have no credibility when you don't realize that exisitng contracts can be re-worked, that the cap is going up. We are projected to be in good cap shape with the ability sign at least two free agents. that's straight from the Sun Sentinal not me.

    You talk like what ever we have now is all we are going to have. You need to do your research before you attack someone elses credibility.

    Take your "respect" and go jump in a lake. Give Fielder a hug before you leap.
     
  21. dolfan06

    dolfan06 FinHeaven Elite

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    i'd like to see any of those QB's you mentioned, play with a broken thumb. not only did fiedler play, be was the major reason for the comeback! GET REAL!:yell:
     
  22. fin-atic

    fin-atic Are you a VIP? Finheaven VIP Donator

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    And his excuse for not ranking on the top 15 his other two years????

    What comeback? Denver? PLEASE! He hurt his thumb the next to the last series of the game. He didn't do it while hurt.
    The pass he threw to put us in FG position went through the defender's hand. Should have been picked off. Luck.

    Fiedler Hugger
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Jan 15, 2003
  23. dolfan06

    dolfan06 FinHeaven Elite

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    i suppose it was fiedlers fault the jets scored 30 points on us in the 4th quarter against the jets in 2000?:rolleyes:
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Jan 15, 2003
  24. dolfan06

    dolfan06 FinHeaven Elite

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    you score 37 points and you'd better damn well win the game! your trying to flag down the super chief with a candle son, go peddle your wares on another board!:yell:
     
  25. fin-atic

    fin-atic Are you a VIP? Finheaven VIP Donator

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    Hey I never said he was the only need we had. But he is like Rodgers, and Ruddy and a few others. We need to upgrade the positon.

    You guys always try and twist this into us saying he " is the only reason". Thats BS. He is one of a few problems. I don't give a free pass to him because he is the QB.
     
  26. MOULDSROCKS

    MOULDSROCKS A True Fan

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    Kordell Stewart?
     
  27. fin-atic

    fin-atic Are you a VIP? Finheaven VIP Donator

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    How's this an answer to my question? The reason he can't break the top 15 is?

    I am talking about his stats. No one can lose that for him.

    Bring something to the table or get out.
     
  28. dolfan06

    dolfan06 FinHeaven Elite

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    there are very few QB's in this league that can boast about being a field general of a team that has won an average of 10 games a year!;)
     
  29. dolfan06

    dolfan06 FinHeaven Elite

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    ONE, is that your answer, ONE! read my post, i said not many. now go back under your bed!:rolleyes:
     
  30. dolfan06

    dolfan06 FinHeaven Elite

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    lets see, i'm member #3 and you're #714 and you're telling me to get out. lets not forget moderator and i can wipe the floor with your posts. you are pretty stupid huh?
     
  31. Ducken

    Ducken FinHeaven VIP

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    UMMM, excuse me Mr. Natic, but I belive once apon a time we had a QB that never put up great #'s , but seemed to just win, had a great RB, well make that 3. All in all I really don't see a whole lot of difference in the way Bob's team was made up and the way the team of 2002 was made up, other than the fact that Bob's team came to win and shove the ball up places you don't want a football shoved.
     
  32. Baz

    Baz Ephemeral

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    LMAO. You tell him 06. I don't think he knew you were a mod though......
     
  33. Baz

    Baz Ephemeral

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    On a side note, I just noticed I have over 1,000 posts. Do I get a special award or something? Maybe a star next to my name? I guess now I'm just part of the elite 1,000 post club......
     
  34. iceblizzard69

    iceblizzard69 A True Fan

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    Re: Re: Re: Hey Fiedler Huggers...a doable Qb Upgrade

    Well for starters I have watched Kingsbury and Dorsey play. Kingsbury plays in a system where they throw short passes and the WR does the rest. Kingsbury has no arm strength, he is projected to be a third round pick. As for Dorsey, have you seen his throws? His passes are weak, he can't put a tight spirrel on a football, and has below average arm strength. All he has is the mindset. I can GUARANTEE that neither of them will be quality QBs in the NFL, and both will be BACKUPS, while Jay had an 84 QB rating this year, and went 7-3!!!!!! His career record is 29-13, and although you can't put every win (or every loss, but I am sure you would blame every loss on him because you just use him as the scapegoat) on him, he has done a solid job and his record is one of the best in NFL HISTORY for the first 30 games started or something like that. All you can say against him are things like "he makes bad decisions" or "his arm strength sucks" or "he is unaccurate" but the stats say different, the film says different, and the team STRUGGLES with out him. Remember that Ray Lucas went 2-4 this year. Jay must be doing something right. I watched every single game this year. In the games he lost, he didn't have great games but they weren't games that he completely blew. He did throw 4 interceptions against KC, but 3 of those were in the last 8 minutes playing catchup. Or you can say he only went 11-25 against NE, but did you watch that game? Did you see the playcalling? No way you can blame that on Jay. So you can start talking and making fun of Jay or whatever, but the truth is that he will be starting here next year, and that he is a QB who is above average, and better then any FA QB or guys who will be released.
     
  35. iceblizzard69

    iceblizzard69 A True Fan

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    And moderators have "ban" power.
     
  36. fin-atic

    fin-atic Are you a VIP? Finheaven VIP Donator

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    I guess early doesn't mean bright. Your number six means nothing to me. Wipe the floor with me? In your dreams. You better ask the moderators for help. You certainly can't do it on your own.

    My "get out" reference means brinsg some facts to the argument. You Fielder Huggers are all the same. Once you are required to bring some stats to the table you have nothing. That lame winning record. And then you are silly enough to say "not many field generals can boast 10 win seasons."

    Hello? anyone home? For the same token none of them can boast our defense or our running game. Coincidence? I don't think so.

    So accoring to you:

    Jay is th reason we have won an average of ten games each of his three years.
    The running game and defense are lucky to be along for the ride? Is that what you are saying?

    If not then what rank do you put Jay at in the league? 1 or maybe 2?

    Explain to me all of this and exactly how good Jay is. Show me why I should not feel we would be better off with a top 10 QB?

    Bring something to this would you. You bore me with your threats of banishment and what number you are. You keep living in Disney World while we go home disappointed every year. I for one want change, I am sick of the losing crap, and I want a Super Bowl. You keep waving your banners and being King of the Homers. If the world goes the way you idiots want we will still be watching next year while other fans laugh at our "December collapse" and "Get blown out in the playoffs" habit.

    Jesus people the Pats built a team and won it right on top of our fallen corspe. How embarrasing. And we haven't even come close.

    Keep hugging.
     
  37. dolfan06

    dolfan06 FinHeaven Elite

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    who said anything about #6, and i didn't say anything about wiping the floor with you. your posts are a little suspect though!:rolleyes:
     
  38. Aqua

    Aqua Well-Known Member

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    Tiresome

    Your almost as pompous as you are tiresome. Take a break and go kick your dog for awhile Fiedler bashing teenager.

    Why don't you tell us how much money we'll save by cutting Rodgers and Ruddy.

    Why don't you tell us how much we'll save by extending, not re-working Thomas' contract. Hint all published reports are wrong.

    Explain to us why YOU have no credibility when you think it's possible to again restructure Sam Madison's contract. I'm 100% positive you can't answer this question? How smart is it to be outstanding almost $13M in bonuses on a overpaid underachieving CB? Remember you can pay now or you can pay later.

    Finally straight from the Sun-Sentinel or Miami Herald doesn't ensure it's true. Published cap numbers from both papers are
    usually wrong.

    Take a deep breath and give it a rest Mr. Know-it-All.
     
  39. dolfan06

    dolfan06 FinHeaven Elite

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    Re: Tiresome

    OMG, guess when it comes to slapping the little kid around, i take a back seat!;) VERY GOOD!:D
     
  40. fin-atic

    fin-atic Are you a VIP? Finheaven VIP Donator

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    So nice to know that a bunch of pot-bellied beer guzzling fans know so much more than the papers and writers who are on the team beat and cover them week to week and also know the principals. I love the part that says "all published reports are wrong" unless you are Wayne Huezinga or Rick Speilman than shut the hell up. You are the epitomy of arrogance to propose you know more than the team media. Thats a laugh!! " All published reports are wrong?" are you sure, I mean all of them?
    *snicker* come on tell me some more how friggin smart you are. I am now finally getting some good laughs out of you amatuers.

    You and Dolfan06 can go find Fiedler and have a nice big group hug.
     
  41. fin-atic

    fin-atic Are you a VIP? Finheaven VIP Donator

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    Typical, typical Fielder Hugger. I challenge you to make your arguments for Fiedler and this is how you respond?? Thats your big shot in the arm for his support?

    My you are such a knowledgable fan! How do you do it?
    *snicker*giggle*
    Let me put it this way. If he was accused of murder and you were his attorney? He would fry!

    Please give me more material. This is priceless. I showed your post to a couple people and they laughed almost as hard as I did.

    Got anymore?

    PS
    Fiedler Hugging...is it like therapy?? If so its not working for you.
     
  42. Dajesus

    Dajesus A True Fan

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    Honestly they are all wrong. Not saying that any fan knows more, but it has been said several times that all contract info is pure speculation, and there are only a hand full of people in the world that know the true details. Those would include the agent, client, Dave, Rick, a lawyer here and there, and about 5 guys at the league office. Next time you read an article about the new contract Joe Superstar just signed watch all the buzz worlds. You will see rumor, around, in the ball park, and many phrases just like it. They do have a much more educated opinion, but then again if they are wrong no one from the league would correct them.
     
  43. ckparrothead

    ckparrothead Premium Member

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    We're fully capable of winning with Fiedler, and fully capable of winning without him. Ray Lucas was a special case, it took the team a while to switch gears and get use to him. Also, he was just plain terrible at times, no way around that at all.

    Its time to stop worrying about the possibilities of what might happen with a different quarterback in the game, and time to start looking at the cold hard facts.

    The first fact is, NO MATTER WHAT, Fiedler and his current contract are not here after the 2003 season. His base salary escalates to ridiculous levels and he's due a $2m roster bonus. He simply can't be here in 2004.

    The other fact is, even without Fiedler at the helm all we need is competant QB play to win. Lucas despite his shortcomings, showed us that. The players aren't willing to buy the coaches' reasoning that we failed to make the playoffs because we went 2-4 under Lucas.

    Nonetheless for me, I would use the unofficial feelers to determine the availability of Couch, Holcombe, and Bulger. I would not go for Warner, as I really think he's just finally lost it and his injury problems are going to stick.

    I would not outright replace Fiedler with anyone short of Couch or Bulger, of the 4 QBs you mentioned. Holcombe would have to COMPETE for the job, because he could very well be a one-hit-wonder. And besides, if Couch isn't available on the block then I doubt Holcombe would be, since the Browns could easily just go another season with Holcombe behind Couch...pushing Couch to be better, and giving Holcombe more time to up his trade value.

    It is also my firm belief that Bulger is staying a St Louis Ram. If the coaches don't put Warner up for trade, I doubt they'd put Bulger up either. Martz would just go with the hotter hand. But if they do anything, it would be getting rid of WARNER, not Bulger.

    So that leaves kid Griese. He'll be available after June 1st, when the market and the money will be dried up. He'd have a tough time finding a starting gig after June 1st, but not an impossible task really. Not to mention he may want to sit the season out rather than play a season as a backup under a one year contract. Money is not a problem for him. Motivation is. He may also have issues coming to Miami and playing under the shadow of Bob Griese and Dan Marino.

    I would not, absolutely would not, sign Jake Plummer because he's going to be offered a starter's market, and I'm not willing to pay him starters money and hand him a starters job.

    So yes, our eyes should be peeled for QB upgrades, basically just like that have been peeled all along. The only QB move which we could have or should have done in retrospect might have been Brad Johnson, but who can say if BJ is really that good or if its Keyshawn and Keenan, along with Gruden thats turning him good. And besides, the chance to get BJ was I think BEFORE Norv arrived...back when we were running Gailey's system and BJ just wouldn't have fit. I mean sure we could have tried to get Bledsoe, but with what first round pick? Would you have given up on Ricky to get Bledsoe? Not me.

    I don't care HOW much you hate Fiedler you have to be very smart when talking about replacing your starting QB who has won games for you. Its very political.

    My answer is Mark Brunell. For some reason rumor has it that he's leaving Jacksonville, and I would most DEFINITELY like to have him in Miami and any person who says they wouldn't like him is just being insecure about having a QB that hasn't already played and won for us.
     
  44. VanDolPhan

    VanDolPhan A True Fan

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    Any clown who at least reads the Sun Sentinel or Miami Herald knows roughly how much room we have. Or how about you read my posts from like say ohhhhhhh say YESTERDAY in clumpeds salary cap thread where I stated we save $2.85 million cutting Ruddy and Rodgers.

    There is little room to manipulate contracts this time around as we've done a lot of that the past couple of years and there is little to save with Surtain, Madison, Taylor's contracts without seriously screwing over next year. If were lucky the new NFL Sunday ticket deal will increase the cap to roughly $76 million which would have us break even. The best cuts we can make is Ruddy/Rodgers $2.85 million savings and if we extend Zach we 'could' save up to $3 million this year. We could get some savings by tweaking Bowens/Marions deals but that would just make their hits bigger when they are cut at their march 1st bonus dates again for minimal ($500k) gain now. Even McKnight at best will save us $800k.

    Our salary cap situation is not good at all. We could afford probably one contract close to what we offered Olin last year but after that it's incredibly slim pickings as we cut most of the fat last year. Last year it was easier because it was like picking off meat from Rosanne......however this year it's like picking meat off of Leann Rimes.

    So before you talk about credibility you better check out peoples prior posts and your own since your talking about cutting Jay when that would actually ADD to our cap.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Jan 16, 2003
  45. Dajesus

    Dajesus A True Fan

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    Fin-atic I am not trying to pile on, but you have to realize a few things. You mentioned cutting this guy, and that guy to free up millions of dollars, but in realality those dollars don't exsist. I am sure you are familliar with the phrase "signing bonus." Excuse me if I sound insulting, but it doesn't sound like you know what this means. What it means is that we are going to give you X amount of money for signing your contract. It is given in a lump sum when the contract is signed, but what the players association faught hard for when they realized a salary cap was nessacary, the NFL let the teams spread said signing bonus out over the term of the contract. It basicly lets teams give the athlete huge money with out getting thrusted in to cap hell. Every player includeing undrafted rookie free agents get a signing bonus. the better the player the better the bonus. Here is the hook though. If you cut a player that is the term of the contract; thus, the rest of the signing bonus counts against the cap that year. The bonuses are also set up so they are easy to manage at the beginning of the contract, but inflate every year to give the player protection from being cut.

    You said we should cut Jay, ok fine you don't like him, but it seriously wouldn't be wise from an economical standpoint. Jay has a very low base salary this year, and 1 mill roster bonus as of march 1st, so we would save say 1.75 mill if we cut him against the cap, right? No very wrong. He has a singing bonus in the range of 5 mill to 6.5 mill. Last year we payed about 500,000 of that, so that would leave Miami with at best 4.5 mill that would count against the cap this season. After you take away the 1.75 mill we would save we would be paying 2.75 mill against the cap this year for a guy that isn't on our roster.(note I know these numbers aren't perfect as i said in my last post, but for this lesson they work.) The same would be true for Rodgers who just singed his deal 2 years ago, and it would even be true to some degre for Ruddy.

    You also said we should restructure all these contracts. Do you know what that means? Basicly you would be postponing paying this years cap "bonus" money by adding more money to future years. So yes we may get some cap releaf this year, but that money will count against the cap later on. Please see the Cowboys and 49ers a couple years ago who had over 20 mill against the cap for players that no longer played for them on Sunday. I know everyone would trade a SB win for a 3-13 season 3 years from now, but what if you end up like the Redskins who gambled and lost with that same princable and had to deal with the losing seasons, but never go the super bowl ring.
     
  46. Dajesus

    Dajesus A True Fan

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    Com At Yar C% Y/P At LG TD Int SA Rat
    Jay Feidler
    CAREER 720 1200 8413 60.0 7.01 74 50 45 70 79.6

    Greise
    CAREER 1044 1678 11763 62.2 7.01 88 71 53 116 84.1

    Stewart
    CAREER 1190 2107 13328 56.5 6.33 90 70 72 145 72.3

    Plummer
    CAREER 1540 2754 17622 55.9 6.40 80 90 114 215 69.0


    You wanted facts, so here are few. Only Greise has better stats than Jay has put up. He is less than 5 rating points better than Jay, but he has also had a 1000 yard rusher every year as a starter. He has played with 2 rbs that had pro bowl years while he was starting. He has played with 1 ROY RB winner. He has played with arguable the best TE in the history of the game his first season. Also in 3 of his seasons he has had at least 1 WR elected to the pro bowl. Jay has played with 1 pro bowl RB, end of story. To boot Jay has the highest winning % of any active QB.

    Those are all facts. As far as facts go it would be a wash who you piced as your QB between Jay and Brian, but as far as paying for them Jay would be much cheaper.
     
  47. dolfan06

    dolfan06 FinHeaven Elite

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    i can't ban somebody just because i disagree with what he says. besides, you have to warn a person first! if you don't have a good reason for doing so, AJ gets the feed back!
     
  48. dolfan06

    dolfan06 FinHeaven Elite

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    what on earth are you talking about? you' gotta be mentally challenged to keep raking this over the coals.
    go over to the herald board or someplace like that, maybe you won't stir up as much sh!t!:rolleyes:
     
  49. Coral Reefer

    Coral Reefer Help save our Reefs ~ www.ReefCheck.org

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    Griese was extremely efficient and was even allowed to call his own plays at times. Wanny has even said in an interview that Jay's choices of where to throw the ball after reading a defenses coverage at times has been highly questionable. He misses many open routes and dosen't hold a candle to the precision with which Griese could read and take advantage of a defense. In my opinion you are insulting a hall of fame QB by using this analogy!
    One thing I think we can all agree on is that Jay won't be riding into the Hall of Fame anytime in the future! :rolleyes:
     
  50. T-ROCK

    T-ROCK Antagonist...

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    Our Defense was ranked 4th but aided in costing us a win at Minnesota and New England...

    Win either of those 2 games and we're AFC East Champs...

    Being the 4th best Defense means NOT allowing the Patriots back into that game... Stat wise we might have been 4th, but there are more than 3 Defenses that played better than ours...
     

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