If Moore was in from the start....

[phins_4_ever]

Okay lets go back to last year. NE, Pittsburgh and had the ball removed from his hands in OT at Buffalo. He’s not starting caliber.

Again, you are using games we have lost before. Losing to NE is not new to us. Doesn't matter who the QB is or was. Losing in Pittsburgh, in snow, in the playoffs has given many teams fits.
The Jets last year game planned for him as well. So did Buffalo. We can go around as much as we want to. Moore will not start for us as long as we have a starting QB in Tannehill. But under the circumstances there is no harm in letting him continue. It is not just the turnovers (INTs) today. Cutler looks for the most part pathetic out there. If we have to lose at least I like to lose with some excitement not sleep inducing.

 

[gofins60]

Yes Moore was awful in that Baltimore game along with the rest of the team. We also lost 38-6 against them with Tannehill last year.

While I'm not a fan of Moore, I believe the reason for sucking against Baltimore has less to do with the QBs and everything to do with Philbin building a "finesse" team that is consistently dominated by tough, physical teams. And, Gase's team runs an offense and defense similar to what Philbin ran... which apparently can be described as the opposite of tough and physical.

 

[DolfanDuBbZ~]

And then what?
Honestly I am as sick and tired of people saying we need a top 5 pick as I am watching the Dolphins stumble around.
A top 5 pick doesn't guarantee us ****. We had 3 top 5 picks in the last 11 or so years and we got crap out of it.

The art of forming a winning franchise does not depend on one lousy pick. It depends on hitting on your picks in the later rounds as well and complement the team in free agency.

This "we must suck for a high draft pick" is the cheesiest way of explaining that you root for losses.

So why should I root for average? Mediocrity? Status quo? Because that is exactly what you advocate. It's a cheesy way of saying shut up and sit down.

Sorry. But the product on the field does such a disservice to your argument. And the FO and ownership thinking is more in line with your own thinking, than mine.

A top 5 pick isnt about one lousy pick. It's about reinforcing the foundation you are trying build. It's about getting a possible elite talent. It's about helping a coach establish his teams identity.

 

[phins_4_ever]

So why should I root for average? Mediocrity? Status quo? Because that is exactly what you advocate. It's a cheesy way of saying shut up and sit down.

Sorry. But the product on the field does such a disservice to your argument. And the FO and ownership thinking is more in line with your own thinking, than mine.

A top 5 pick isnt about one lousy pick. It's about reinforcing the foundation you are trying build. It's about getting a possible elite talent. It's about helping a coach establish his teams identity.

The thinking about building a foundation with high picks is outdated. It is old fashion. If you want a foundation with high picks you need to be drafting high for the next 3 or 4 years. Since the days of unrestricted free agency began (mid 90s) the way teams are build have changed. You are using a mix of FA and draft choices. Like I said in the last 10 or 11 years we had 3 top 5 picks and an additional 2 or 3 top 10 picks. That's about 50% of all drafts during that period. How did that work out?

Drafting high does not guarantee you a hit either. As a matter of fact drafting high puts the pressure on team and player to be successful. Good teams do not rebuild. Good teams reload. And since they are good teams they draft in the later portion of the first round.

Rooting for them to be mediocre is not the solution. But rooting for them to lose to please your false notion that a top 5 draft will be the end of all evils is shitty.

Your attitude (lose for a high draft pick) was the 90s attitude of a lot of Dolphins fans. They were "sick" of always being in competition for the playoffs. Reaching the playoffs was considered "mediocre" and deemed "no good".
How did that work out 20 years later?
We have not been mediocre. We have been bad. We need so much help that one pissy top 5 pick does not do it. If we ever end up for a top 5 pick I would trade the pick away anyways and get me some value in the later rounds.

How did drafting in the top 5 or top 10 work out for Cleveland? I think they had 8 or 9 drafts in the 11 or 12 drafts a top 10 pick.

Give me one team in the last 10 years who had a top 5 pick, build around that top 5 pick and went to the Superbowl and maybe won it. We are not talking about a complementary pick. We are talking about a foundation building pick. How about the last 20 years? Last one I know of would be Payton Manning. He was the first brick and the base of a foundation.

 

[russianbear]

The thinking about building a foundation with high picks is outdated. It is old fashion. If you want a foundation with high picks you need to be drafting high for the next 3 or 4 years. Since the days of unrestricted free agency began (mid 90s) the way teams are build have changed. You are using a mix of FA and draft choices. Like I said in the last 10 or 11 years we had 3 top 5 picks and an additional 2 or 3 top 10 picks. That's about 50% of all drafts during that period. How did that work out?

Drafting high does not guarantee you a hit either. As a matter of fact drafting high puts the pressure on team and player to be successful. Good teams do not rebuild. Good teams reload. And since they are good teams they draft in the later portion of the first round.

Rooting for them to be mediocre is not the solution. But rooting for them to lose to please your false notion that a top 5 draft will be the end of all evils is ****ty.

Your attitude (lose for a high draft pick) was the 90s attitude of a lot of Dolphins fans. They were "sick" of always being in competition for the playoffs. Reaching the playoffs was considered "mediocre" and deemed "no good".
How did that work out 20 years later?
We have not been mediocre. We have been bad. We need so much help that one pissy top 5 pick does not do it. If we ever end up for a top 5 pick I would trade the pick away anyways and get me some value in the later rounds.

How did drafting in the top 5 or top 10 work out for Cleveland? I think they had 8 or 9 drafts in the 11 or 12 drafts a top 10 pick.

Give me one team in the last 10 years who had a top 5 pick, build around that top 5 pick and went to the Superbowl and maybe won it. We are not talking about a complementary pick. We are talking about a foundation building pick. How about the last 20 years? Last one I know of would be Payton Manning. He was the first brick and the base of a foundation.

Ok - so you're beating up the guy who says give me a top 5 pick, and your alternative is what exactly? Nothing is going to change?

I'd rather have an earlier pick than a later one with a few extra wins this season. Of course I'm rooting for my fins week-in week-out...but I am way passed the point of giving a **** when we do lose. I'll take it.

There is absolutely no logical argument why you'd rather not have a pick earlier in the draft than later. So the only question is if a win over the next few weeks means more you to as a fan than an earlier pick would mean to a team?

 

[CaneHammer]

Went back four years to the last time this team was looking at win and you're in scenarios and versus the same two divisional opponents to boot.

Team was basically playing win and your in after the crappy start last year.

 

[montequi]

While I'm not a fan of Moore, I believe the reason for sucking against Baltimore has less to do with the QBs and everything to do with Philbin building a "finesse" team that is consistently dominated by tough, physical teams. And, Gase's team runs an offense and defense similar to what Philbin ran... which apparently can be described as the opposite of tough and physical.

The only tough and physical player we had on offense was traded away for a 4th round pick.

 

[J. David Wannyheimer]

The only tough and physical player we had on offense was traded away for a 4th round pick.

When did we trade Jarvis Landry?

 

[Third Eye]

So Moore is best off the bench. This is the consensus of the forum. Even though I think if we never did the Cutler Experiment and just started Moore from the get go we would be far better off today. Gameplanning for him or not.

But here we are and the solution seems to be available in Dolphins lore. WOODSTROCK.

Yes my friends. Cutler to Moore. If we had done this from the outset we would be 7-3.

CUTMOORE.

 

[Sirspud]

Team was basically playing win and your in after the crappy start last year.

Except the team had worked itself into wildcard position for several years under Tannehill and he crapped the bed both times. I'd been an intense Tannehill critic for much of his career but do believe he really elevated and got better last year, finally learning to convert chances to win a lot of games at the end into actual wins pretty much every time. That said, playing well in the middle of the season is something that he has done frequently, and as he showed before, it's a different ballgame when you're looking to turn your middle of the seasons success into an actual playoff berth.

 

[SabanHater]

to make this season somewhat interesting.... I am now rooting for all teams worse than us to win.

 

[Sirspud]

Ok - so you're beating up the guy who says give me a top 5 pick, and your alternative is what exactly? Nothing is going to change?

I'd rather have an earlier pick than a later one with a few extra wins this season. Of course I'm rooting for my fins week-in week-out...but I am way passed the point of giving a **** when we do lose. I'll take it.

There is absolutely no logical argument why you'd rather not have a pick earlier in the draft than later. So the only question is if a win over the next few weeks means more you to as a fan than an earlier pick would mean to a team?

What he's saying is that a top 5 pick really doesn't guarantee us anything and the thought of rooting for it is just stupid because the reality is that good teams are built by drafting well, not by drafting in the top 5. If you're not a smart organization, it's not as if you convert that many of those picks anyway.

 

[DolfanDuBbZ~]

The thinking about building a foundation with high picks is outdated. It is old fashion. If you want a foundation with high picks you need to be drafting high for the next 3 or 4 years. Since the days of unrestricted free agency began (mid 90s) the way teams are build have changed. You are using a mix of FA and draft choices. Like I said in the last 10 or 11 years we had 3 top 5 picks and an additional 2 or 3 top 10 picks. That's about 50% of all drafts during that period. How did that work out?

Drafting high does not guarantee you a hit either. As a matter of fact drafting high puts the pressure on team and player to be successful. Good teams do not rebuild. Good teams reload. And since they are good teams they draft in the later portion of the first round.

Rooting for them to be mediocre is not the solution. But rooting for them to lose to please your false notion that a top 5 draft will be the end of all evils is ****ty.

Your attitude (lose for a high draft pick) was the 90s attitude of a lot of Dolphins fans. They were "sick" of always being in competition for the playoffs. Reaching the playoffs was considered "mediocre" and deemed "no good".
How did that work out 20 years later?
We have not been mediocre. We have been bad. We need so much help that one pissy top 5 pick does not do it. If we ever end up for a top 5 pick I would trade the pick away anyways and get me some value in the later rounds.

How did drafting in the top 5 or top 10 work out for Cleveland? I think they had 8 or 9 drafts in the 11 or 12 drafts a top 10 pick.

Give me one team in the last 10 years who had a top 5 pick, build around that top 5 pick and went to the Superbowl and maybe won it. We are not talking about a complementary pick. We are talking about a foundation building pick. How about the last 20 years? Last one I know of would be Payton Manning. He was the first brick and the base of a foundation.

Didn't the Atlanta Falcons draft Matt Ryan #3? Did they not just goto a Super Bowl? Did Atlanta build there team around Matt Ryan?

Your argument is still status quo. Where at this point in history, I rather this team with it's starting QB out....look to the out years. I can't change a thing concerning the drafting of this Franchise. From Billy Milner to Pat White this Franchise leaves alot to be desired when talking personnel and drafting.

But here's the thing.... nothing will change as long as Ross makes the ultimate decision. Things will remain on course to keep you and others content Fielding a playoff appearance every 8 years....on gimmicks or smoke and mirrors. While I just decide to go on with my life, and really no longer caring about the ins and outs of the dysfunction in Davie.

Proud fan since 82-83. Your pot shots are worth exactly the product you defend. Nothing. It's a scam.

 

[DolfanDuBbZ~]

What he's saying is that a top 5 pick really doesn't guarantee us anything and the thought of rooting for it is just stupid because the reality is that good teams are built by drafting well, not by drafting in the top 5. If you're not a smart organization, it's not as if you convert that many of those picks anyway.

He offers up no solutions. Except to mock and shame. While defending a crappy product.

A top 5 pick can be parlayed into many things. But from Ross down, and even before Ross, will the right decisions be made? But hey go 7-9/8-8 get a Top 15 pick, and have no chance at a elite talent or possible picks. Status quo.

 

[russianbear]

What he's saying is that a top 5 pick really doesn't guarantee us anything and the thought of rooting for it is just stupid because the reality is that good teams are built by drafting well, not by drafting in the top 5. If you're not a smart organization, it's not as if you convert that many of those picks anyway.

Ok. So we're not a smart organization and therefore who cares when we draft?

I am not someone who roots for a loss to get us in better draft position but let's not fool ourselves here and fail to appreciate that it is actually more beneficial at this point in the season to lose than to win.