The Official 2006 New York Yankees Thread!

[phunwin]

RIVERA pitches one inning! :shakeno:

Good call. You should absolutely focus on a player I mentioned as an afterthought (and noted as much) and ignore the rest of the analysis.

 

[nyjunc]

Just for comparison's sake, here are the splits between regular season ERA and postseason ERA from some of Clemens' contemporaries (i.e. guys who have been around long enough to accumulate a decent sample size of postseason appearances, and who were considered top-notch starters)...

(Format: Regular season/postseason)
Randy Johnson - 3.11/3.28
Curt Schilling - 3.40/2.06 (holy ****!)
David Wells - 4.06/3.15
Mike Mussina - 3.64/3.30
Greg Maddux - 3.01/3.22
Tom Glavine - 3.44/3.58
Orel Hershiser - 3.48/2.59
John Smoltz - 3.26/2.66
Pedro Martinez - 2.72/3.40

And just for comparison's sake:
Mariano Rivera - 2.33/0.81 (certainly reinforces the thinking that he's a great postseason pitcher)

That's a pretty small and unscientific sample. But it certainly bears mention that of that group, only Clemens and Martinez had a postseason ERA that's significantly worse than their regular season ERA.

Pedro is another guy who has a great reputation but is not a great postseason pitcher. Outside of '99 when he was great against Cle in game 5 then against the Yanks in game 3 he was not very good.

 

[MikeO]

AROD doesn't help you get to the posteseason with those MVP numbers he puts up over 162 games year after year (ya gotta actually GET to the postseason first)! Yeah, Im sure every team wouldn't want him on their team!

Please........if you brought ANY of these topics to ANY sports radio show in ANY of the 50 states, any SPORTS radio show on the air today, and tried to spin this crap (which is what it is crap) you would be on the air for 3 seconds before they hung up on you! Literraly, 3 seconds!

Yeah, JT THE BRICK, I think Matt Clement is better than Randy Johnson. CLICK!

Yeah Jim Rome, I am a Dolphins fan and I don't want Peyton Manning on the Fins. CLICK!!!!!!!!!!!!

Yeah Dan Patrick, I am a Pittsburgh Pirates fan, screw AROD I wouldn't want him here in the burgh. CLICK!!!! CLICK! and then mocked for an hour by ESPN on air talent!

Try it, please!

Keep spinning!

 

[MikeO]

Pedro is another guy who has a great reputation but is not a great postseason pitcher. Outside of '99 when he was great against Cle in game 5 then against the Yanks in game 3 he was not very good.

You can't just cherry pick games out of a guys career and change his stats and say he sucks.

That's like saying.....Dan Marino threw 420 TD passes in his career. Take away his 1984, 85', 88', 91', 92', and 97' seasons and what did he ever do! Those numbers aren't impressive! :shakeno: I mean please!

 

[phunwin]

Pedro is another guy who has a great reputation but is not a great postseason pitcher. Outside of '99 when he was great against Cle in game 5 then against the Yanks in game 3 he was not very good.

That surprised me, but there you have it: Pedro's not nearly as good when the calendar hits October. The numbers don't lie. If there were an auto-filter somewhere (limit it to, say, starting pitchers with over 75 postseason IP), I'd do a more detailed study; I don't like to base a conclusion on a sample of 10 starting pitchers. But still, the numbers from his contemporaries seem to indicate that Clemens isn't the same pitcher, and God knows, he's been pitching long enough that we've got plenty of postseason data to chew on.

I'd still take Clemens in a postseason series, Pedro too. Only a fool wouldn't, because they're still much better than the average pitcher, but their collective reputations exceed their performance.

 

[nyjunc]

AROD doesn't help you get to the posteseason with those MVP numbers he puts up over 162 games year after year (ya gotta actually GET to the postseason first)! Yeah, Im sure every team wouldn't want him on their team!

Please........if you brought ANY of these topics to ANY sports radio show in ANY of the 50 states, any SPORTS radio show on the air today, and tried to spin this crap (which is what it is crap) you would be on the air for 3 seconds before they hung up on you! Literraly, 3 seconds!

Yeah, JT THE BRICK, I think Matt Clement is better than Randy Johnson. CLICK!

Yeah Jim Rome, I am a Dolphins fan and I don't want Peyton Manning on the Fins. CLICK!!!!!!!!!!!!

Yeah Dan Patrick, I am a Pittsburgh Pirates fan, screw AROD I wouldn't want him here in the burgh. CLICK!!!! CLICK! and then mocked for an hour by ESPN on air talent!

Try it, please!

Keep spinning!

It's not about individual success it's about winning and I want winning players. So far in his Yankee career ARod is not a winning player.

RIVERA pitches one inning!

You know he has pitched more than 1 inning in ALOT of postseason games. In '96 he pitched 2 routinely and w/ the alck of a quality setup man for a few years Joe has gone to him alot in the 8th in recent years.

 

[phunwin]

Keep spinning!

Dude, if anyone's spinning, it's you. You're ignoring the overall numbers and attacked my mini-analysis simply because I included Rivera as an afterthought.

 

[MikeO]

I'd still take Clemens in a postseason series, Pedro too. Only a fool wouldn't, because they're still much better than the average pitcher, but their collective reputations exceed their performance.

1) There are a lot of "FOOLS" around here.

2) Pedro and Roger are maybe the 2 best pitchers in MLB the last 25 years and we have people knocking them here! :sidelol: I love it.

What's the next debate, someone gonna tell me Curt Schilling is a HALL OF FAMER? :sidelol: Come on, I know someone is gonna jump on that one and take on that debate!

 

[nyjunc]

You can't just cherry pick games out of a guys career and change his stats and say he sucks.

That's like saying.....Dan Marino threw 420 TD passes in his career. Take away his 1984, 85', 88', 91', 92', and 97' seasons and what did he ever do! Those numbers aren't impressive! :shakeno: I mean please!

Keep his '99 #s in there and his #s are still average.

I'd still take Clemens in a postseason series, Pedro too. Only a fool wouldn't, because they're still much better than the average pitcher, but their collective reputations exceed their performance.

I'd take my chances w/ them as well knowing what they are capabale of.

 

[MikeO]

Dude, if anyone's spinning, it's you. You're ignoring the overall numbers and attacked my mini-analysis simply because I included Rivera as an afterthought.

I put out the numbers! Im not spinning. My numbers don't lie.

You posted numbers too, but those numbers are pointless in my opinon. I don't care if his ERA jumps from regular season to postseason.

If you have a WORLD SERIES era of 2.37........YOUR GOOD! If you have a postseason ERA of 3.71, YOUR GOOD! Period. DEBATE OVER!

 

[nyjunc]

1) There are a lot of "FOOLS" around here.

2) Pedro and Roger are maybe the 2 best pitchers in MLB the last 25 years and we have people knocking them here! :sidelol: I love it.

What's the next debate, someone gonna tell me Curt Schilling is a HALL OF FAMER? :sidelol: Come on, I know someone is gonna jump on that one and take on that debate!

Who would you rather have on the mound in game 7 of the WS- Schilling or Clemens or Pedro?

 

[Ray Finkle]

That surprised me, but there you have it: Pedro's not nearly as good when the calendar hits October. The numbers don't lie. If there were an auto-filter somewhere (limit it to, say, starting pitchers with over 75 postseason IP), I'd do a more detailed study; I don't like to base a conclusion on a sample of 10 starting pitchers. But still, the numbers from his contemporaries seem to indicate that Clemens isn't the same pitcher, and God knows, he's been pitching long enough that we've got plenty of postseason data to chew on.

I'd still take Clemens in a postseason series, Pedro too. Only a fool wouldn't, because they're still much better than the average pitcher, but their collective reputations exceed their performance.

I was actually going to bring up Pedro in the debate. He was lights out in both the regular and post season before his injury in 1999. Before then anything he took the mound you'd be shocked if he lost.

As a Red Sox fan, I wasn't as confident in Pedro in the 2003 and 2004 playoffs as I was with a guy like Schilling. This isn't a knock on Pedro because he left the Sox because I still love the guy and this isn't a love fest for Schilling because he's still on my team.

I'd take Pedro and Clemens on my team any day of the week because they're great HOF pitchers, however in October I'd be very nervous with them starting. I'd love to get Clemens on the Sox because a playoff rotation of Schilling, Beckett, Wakefield and Clemens is scarier than ClemenT instead of Clemens. Eventhough Clemens hasn't be lights out in the playoffs he's still better than the average pitchers in baseball pitching in the playoffs.

 

[MikeO]

Who would you rather have on the mound in game 7 of the WS- Schilling or Clemens or Pedro?

I would take ANY OF THEM! I wouldn't be upset with any of those 3. They are all fine! Pedro and Roger got the hall of fame careers, but I wouldn't be upset with Schilling.

 

[nyjunc]

I would take ANY OF THEM! I wouldn't be upset with any of those 3. They are all fine! Pedro and Roger got the hall of fame careers, but I wouldn't be upset with Schilling.

Pick one.

 

[Ray Finkle]

Who would you rather have on the mound in game 7 of the WS- Schilling or Clemens or Pedro?

You can throw in Johnson, Maddux and anyone else in baseball and I'd pick Schilling.

Schilling isn't a Hall of Fame pitcher but so what? He's clutch as hell when it comes to the playoffs. I'd take 5 Schillings over Pedro, Clemens, Johnson, Maddux and Glavine (5 HOFers).