the official senior bowl week discussion thread... | Page 5 | FinHeaven - Miami Dolphins Forums

the official senior bowl week discussion thread...

Yea I recall Kaep was lighting it up while Dalton wasn't. Here's a question I never got answered. Why was Gabbert rated so highly with such bad collegiate stats? He barely had more TDs thrown in his career than Chase Daniels did in one season.
 
Yea I recall Kaep was lighting it up while Dalton wasn't. Here's a question I never got answered. Why was Gabbert rated so highly with such bad collegiate stats? He barely had more TDs thrown in his career than Chase Daniels did in one season.


The Tom Condon hype train. That's it, and 95% of the people that bought into Blaine Gabbert went purely off the hype and never actually watched the kid play. Otherwise, I find it hard to believe that so many would've been mislead.

There's no way you could watch him without seeing him bail from clean pockets while the defense was only sending a 3 man rush. His lack of accuracy and ball placement on throws beyond 10 yards.

His "stock" took off because Andrew Luck went back to Stanford and Gabbert was the underclassman who's flaws hadn't been put under the microscope yet.

That's why I don't like how QB's shoot up draft boards based on another QB or two staying in school. Blaine Gabbert nor Christian Ponder should've been 1st round picks.
 
Actually Weeden's hands are 9.5 inches and yes Russell Wilson's hands are 10.0 inches. Half an inch difference not exactly earth shattering there.

Weeden is put together very well for a quarterback at 6034 and 219 lbs, 30.5 inch arms and 9.5 inch hands. His hands aren't small for a QB, they're normal sized. Could his hands be a little bigger? Sure. Does it matter on a guy that throws a 97 mph fast ball and puts smoke trails on the football? No.

Foles has a fantastic 6'5" and 244 lbs frame with hands nearly 11 inches but his 33 inch arms are a little longer than ideal for quick, compact, versatile and consistent mechanics.
It's pretty significant when one guy is 6'3.5" and the other is only 5'10". Wilson has huge hands for a guy his size.
 
I found it interesting tonight on NFL32 that they were talking the importance of hand size. Dilfer mention that it is an important measurement and Mort quoted Mike McCarthy has saying it is indicator off being able to play in all weather conditions wet and cold included.
 
I bet Foles steals the show for QB's. Foles and Tannehill will push for the 3rd QB in the draft.

Foles size is impressive and loved him as a junior. He did not get much help this year and was in the middle of a coaching change.
 
mike adams is one massive dude...and for that size he looked pretty darn athletic to me...

count me as an isiah pead fan...
 
mike adams is one massive dude...and for that size he looked pretty darn athletic to me...

count me as an isiah pead fan...

I am hoping some RT prospects can emerge for the 2nd or 3rd round. He might be one.
 
I found it interesting tonight on NFL32 that they were talking the importance of hand size. Dilfer mention that it is an important measurement and Mort quoted Mike McCarthy has saying it is indicator off being able to play in all weather conditions wet and cold included.


The issues with small hands for a quarterback surface long before playing in the elements is even a factor. It begins with taking the snap from under center, and Weeden did fumble his first one today.

The proper way to receive a snap from under center is your hand on the meat of the football. If you have trouble getting your hand around the meat of the football, the center has to compensate for it by turning the football a full 90 degrees as opposed to a 'stock' 1/4 turn. It can lead to a long term issue that will always affect being able to take snaps from under center without mishandled snaps creeping in at times.

Inclement weather or high pressure situations magnify it.


It's just something to pay attention to.....
 
if he continues to look the way he looked to me today in full pads when the men separate from the boys tomorrow and wednesday i'm thinking mike adams might be a 1st rounder...he towers over people and like i said i didn't see a waist bender despite that size...

i don't know...i know this...this draft to me is not the same level as the last 2 years...i think this drafts depth is lacking...i see a lot of guys who i don't think will help anyone in 2012...shrine bowl for my eyes was loaded with meh talent...senior bowl roster and north practice i saw few and far between...hopefully it will get better tomorrow...

dennard struggled with transitioning to his pedal and i think he lacks long speed...he was off balance all day...no wonder the guys so hands on...he has to be...quite overrated imo...amukamura last year had way better feet balance and hips...

leonard johnson is someone i've had my eye on but i thought today he had average feet and burst...i wanna see these guys in press mirror these wrs...and the north wrs...ehhhh...awful lot of guys running crap routes and lacking burst imo...

devier posey just the next garbage pro wr to come out of ohio st...the quick kid i thought was interesting til i saw him run routes...no burst or explosion there

stiff hips and meh prospects all over the place
 
if he continues to look the way he looked to me today in full pads when the men separate from the boys tomorrow and wednesday i'm thinking mike adams might be a 1st rounder...he towers over people and like i said i didn't see a waist bender despite that size...

i don't know...i know this...this draft to me is not the same level as the last 2 years...i think this drafts depth is lacking...i see a lot of guys who i don't think will help anyone in 2012...shrine bowl for my eyes was loaded with meh talent...senior bowl roster and north practice i saw few and far between...hopefully it will get better tomorrow...

dennard struggled with transitioning to his pedal and i think he lacks long speed...he was off balance all day...no wonder the guys so hands on...he has to be...quite overrated imo...amukamura last year had way better feet balance and hips...

leonard johnson is someone i've had my eye on but i thought today he had average feet and burst...i wanna see these guys in press mirror these wrs...and the north wrs...ehhhh...awful lot of guys running crap routes and lacking burst imo...

devier posey just the next garbage pro wr to come out of ohio st...the quick kid i thought was interesting til i saw him run routes...no burst or explosion there

stiff hips and meh prospects all over the place



We talked about exactly that with Dennard several weeks ago after the Nebraska/South Carolina bowl game.

Devier Posey isn't even on my draft board. I literally like nothing about him. On or off the field.
 
where is that explosive ready to give you 8 sacks as a rookie at least impact pass rush prospect in this draft??? i can't find it...cam johnson today to me looked like he had the best get off of the ball and i thought he redirected nicely back inside but he was wearing out a guy kisemele to me i think his name was who needs to be kicked inside...

where's the damn top 10 pass rush talent you find in pretty much every draft??? coples...ehhh...love the length love the frame but don't love the lack of hand use to get off blocks as a pass rusher or the relatively average explosion i see...could be a monster but he's definitely not a can't miss guy...and i don't care what anyone says i'm not taking that guy to play 34 olb...he'll give up soft corners all day long against speed imo...i'm taking him to play in 4 man fronts and shift inside in some packages...

not a fan of the ingram kid in the top 10...sure looks like a guy to me who is most effective with a hand in the dirt...and most comfortable...
 
where is that explosive ready to give you 8 sacks as a rookie at least impact pass rush prospect in this draft??? i can't find it...cam johnson today to me looked like he had the best get off of the ball and i thought he redirected nicely back inside but he was wearing out a guy kisemele to me i think his name was who needs to be kicked inside...

where's the damn top 10 pass rush talent you find in pretty much every draft??? coples...ehhh...love the length love the frame but don't love the lack of hand use to get off blocks as a pass rusher or the relatively average explosion i see...could be a monster but he's definitely not a can't miss guy...and i don't care what anyone says i'm not taking that guy to play 34 olb...he'll give up soft corners all day long against speed imo...i'm taking him to play in 4 man fronts and shift inside in some packages...

not a fan of the ingram kid in the top 10...sure looks like a guy to me who is most effective with a hand in the dirt...and most comfortable...


Ingram is better from a 2-point stance than he is with his hand in the dirt. The thing about Ingram is that you don't have to pencil him in as "this" or "that". He can play a variety of roles because he has a rare combination of speed, athletic ability, weight, frame and strength. I think he can literally play 5 different roles in a front 7.

Keep in mind that we're not seeing guys like Nick Perry and Ronnell Lewis either until the combine.

If Upshaw doesn't get 8 sacks as a rookie I'll eat my hat. Somebody is going to surprise you and end up being as good as they appear to be in games.

Like I said, once you see the broad jump/vertical jump numbers from the combine, you'll be able to narrow down who the 10 sack candidates are.
 
admittedly i don't have much exposure to ingram other than the bowl game...and i swear he played the whole thing pretty much in a 3 point stance...i couldn't tell at all if he could play 34 olb...i'm guessing you think he can...

that 10 yard split number matters to me also...its not an end all be all but if a guy shows he gets off the ball well like that wilber kid did in the shrine game and backs it up with a fast 10 yard split tells me i have a pretty good initial quickness edge rusher...at least he's got tools

slimm if you have seen evidence of upshaw showing something other than pure power edge pass rusher wearing out tackles point me in the direction of it...thats what i'm looking for
 
i tell ya one thing though...i think upshaw will destroy blocking schemes if they try to get away with blocking him with a te...he's way too strong for that...i think he'll toss them around the room

that said if you take upshaw and make him your 3 down solb that 2nd round pick 2 years ago on misi becomes bust mode...i guess you could shift him inside to lb in some packages and get some run from him there...i still say that guy can play ilb in a 34 in some packages...
 
Hoops, you have to understand the responsibilies of force and contain. Saban's defense is designed to defend from the inside out. Upshaw is often the "force" player on runs that come to his side. His priority is to maintain proper outside leverage and "force" the runner back inside to where the meat and strength of the defense is at. That's why Bama's defense doesn't give up long runs.

He can't tee off on every play. On 3rd downs, he can usually let it go a little more.


Aldon Smith didn't beat any tackles with a flat out speed rush last year. He only had 4.5 sacks in 10 games, and 2 of those came in the first game against Illinois. He whipped up on Nate Solder the year before, but Solder couldn't even get out of his stance against Cam Jordan.

Aldon Smith is allowed to come in for the 49ers strictly in pass rush situations and throw responsibility to the wind and tee off on QB's while he has fresh legs. If he becomes a full time starter and has to play the run on 1st and 2nd down every game, his sack totals are going to go down... but he's actually going to be a better football player.

Upshaw is immediately going to make the defense better for whichever team he goes to. He's not Von Miller, Derrick Thomas, or Terrell Suggs as a pure college pass rusher, but who is?

I just don't think it's possible to tell yet who's going to be racking up double digit sacks as a rookie. A lot of it is going to depend on how they're used, and whether or not they're starting players and required to play disciplined football on 1st and 2nd down, as opposed to strictly being a fresh legged pass rusher.

Go back and look at Upshaw's game last year against Cam Newton, and then the bowl game against Michigan St. Look at any of his games this year against Florida, Ole Miss, LSU, and Auburn. The guy can flat out get after the quarterback when the situation calls for it and he's allowed to cut loose.
 
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