BenchFiedler
Undrafted Pro-Bowler
I do agree on paper, we are a great and talented team, BUT unfortunately, football is not all about talent and speed.
When was the last time we had more talent than this year's team?
- Thread starter Dolfan23
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I was not and am not a fielder fan, but you could win with him as long as you didn't expect him to throw a sideline pass.
Last year's team had about the same amount of talent. Going into last year you could feel pretty good about the interior of the offensive line, for example. Now it's in shambles. We have literally the worst OG situation in the entire league and one of the dodgier center situations.
If that's the reality on the "most talented team" we've had for a decade or more, it just goes to show you how low we've been scuttling.
If that's the reality on the "most talented team" we've had for a decade or more, it just goes to show you how low we've been scuttling.
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where's th'fish
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We're still at the filling-holes stage. Once we're done with that we can start worrying about how well our top talent stacks up against other good teams from the present or past. But when we talk about the talent level in this team, we're talking about last year, because no one knows right now what kind of offseason haul we had. Our talent level last year was certainly not impressive.
Contrary to (I won't say popular, because I hope most people disagree) your belief, our coaching last year did a GREAT job of putting our lackluster defense in a position to succeed. I think we were the 18th best scoring defense last season - when you consider the players that got significant starting snaps, that is AMAZING.
You can bang the table for a scheme and coaching change all you want, but the FACT is the defense (and team as a whole) overperformed last season, and that is 100% due to coaching and scheming.
Dolfan23
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Appreciate all of the replies. Keep in mind I'm talking about our depth and talent level across the board. Every single unit on this team has shown that they can be good to great (with a few showing they can be awful at times as well I know).
We haven't had a good coach since Shula was forced out. Jimmy should have been but he had all but given up by that point and while Wanny had success he was just riding the coattails of what Jimmy left him.
Marino never had a run game that he could rely on and our defenses usually sucked. I think people forget how bad those teams were in those areas and how desperate we got to try and fill those massive voids. That certainly improved towards the mid 90's and by then Marino was a shell of what he used to be and our running game still sucked until we got Ricky.
During our dominant defensive run that we had our offense stunk. Fiedler was manageable but our passing game was never anything to brag about. And what's awful is that he was far and away the best we had at QB post-Marino until Tannehill.
And compared with last year? This team is night and day better. I don't care if we do still have a major question mark at OG, at this point last year we KNEW we had trash at OG and kept those turds around until what week 5? Don't get me started on how bad our secondary and even our LB unit was last year either. If anyone can look at this roster and not see enormous improvements in those units then I don't know what to tell you.
There are certainly a lot of ifs, injury questions and question marks with the young kids but if we get 80% of what this team is capable of doing on O, D and ST plus coaching then we will absolutely be the best team we've had in a very long time.
We haven't had a good coach since Shula was forced out. Jimmy should have been but he had all but given up by that point and while Wanny had success he was just riding the coattails of what Jimmy left him.
Marino never had a run game that he could rely on and our defenses usually sucked. I think people forget how bad those teams were in those areas and how desperate we got to try and fill those massive voids. That certainly improved towards the mid 90's and by then Marino was a shell of what he used to be and our running game still sucked until we got Ricky.
During our dominant defensive run that we had our offense stunk. Fiedler was manageable but our passing game was never anything to brag about. And what's awful is that he was far and away the best we had at QB post-Marino until Tannehill.
And compared with last year? This team is night and day better. I don't care if we do still have a major question mark at OG, at this point last year we KNEW we had trash at OG and kept those turds around until what week 5? Don't get me started on how bad our secondary and even our LB unit was last year either. If anyone can look at this roster and not see enormous improvements in those units then I don't know what to tell you.
There are certainly a lot of ifs, injury questions and question marks with the young kids but if we get 80% of what this team is capable of doing on O, D and ST plus coaching then we will absolutely be the best team we've had in a very long time.
hoops
Tua time!
This team has more potential top 10 at its position talent than I can recall.
Tannehill a 5 year already so he can't count even if he still hasn't reached his ceiling Adam gase is the best young head coach in the game it's hard for me to even type that but he's the goods.
In dvp, x, and tunsil we have top 10 at their position type ceiling players if Charles Harris is that level this team is gonna be stacked and stacked at difference maker positions.
Jordan Phillips is an uber talent it's up to him to decide if he wants it or not.
juice and dvp are cornerstone WRs for the next decade. Whatever we do don't even think about making cap moves that threaten our ability to retain these kids. I'd cut half the roster or more to retain the true talents.
And that's not even counting jay ajayi who runs thru contact and sets a tone that few in the NFL can match and was by my grading scale the team player MVP in 2016.
Tannehill a 5 year already so he can't count even if he still hasn't reached his ceiling Adam gase is the best young head coach in the game it's hard for me to even type that but he's the goods.
In dvp, x, and tunsil we have top 10 at their position type ceiling players if Charles Harris is that level this team is gonna be stacked and stacked at difference maker positions.
Jordan Phillips is an uber talent it's up to him to decide if he wants it or not.
juice and dvp are cornerstone WRs for the next decade. Whatever we do don't even think about making cap moves that threaten our ability to retain these kids. I'd cut half the roster or more to retain the true talents.
And that's not even counting jay ajayi who runs thru contact and sets a tone that few in the NFL can match and was by my grading scale the team player MVP in 2016.
Cool Hoops and what I like most about things this year we have the opportunity to hit the ground running unlike the first few games last year when we had so many new players and coaching staff. Yes we may have on paper today a weaker interior line but continuity and great coaching helps fill that gap. As I have posted in the Dan Marnio era we had some pretty poor drafts etc but continuity and good coaching allowed us to win many games we should not have.
On paper, yes. Injuries happen every year and it's either teams that have young players stepping up, or those who have avoided the injury bug, that go on to succeed. I think our offensive line depth is decent, but the problem is that the depth isn't much worse than the starting interior players.
Though it'd be nice for Asiata to start, you shouldn't really ever expect a fifth rounder to come in and start immediately.
Though it'd be nice for Asiata to start, you shouldn't really ever expect a fifth rounder to come in and start immediately.
The greatest areas of concern IMHO..
I think Asiata starts at Guard for better or worse unless he gets hurt in TC. He has the most upside.
Center has been a weak spot for years. Our back up last year did a fair job initially but faded.
Getting a veteran center after cuts should be in the plans.
Same for the LB position. It will take a few games to get the communication down and the players understanding where they need be in the scheme.
The bottom line this season is making the plays in all phases in close games - to win the game. There is going to be a lot of exciting games this year.
This schedule is tough.
I think Asiata starts at Guard for better or worse unless he gets hurt in TC. He has the most upside.
Center has been a weak spot for years. Our back up last year did a fair job initially but faded.
Getting a veteran center after cuts should be in the plans.
Same for the LB position. It will take a few games to get the communication down and the players understanding where they need be in the scheme.
The bottom line this season is making the plays in all phases in close games - to win the game. There is going to be a lot of exciting games this year.
This schedule is tough.
idk about that. if you want to win in the post-season, you have to be able to throw a sideline pass and actually complete it to your own player
Just going over the O-line depth chart....
So far Asiata has been working at at LG & RG. Steen, Larsen and Urbik have been working at C and G. Steen has bulked up from last year and he was the first guy off the bench last year when Pouncey went down. I don't see Asiata starting this season. Our vet backups may not be all-stars but they have been in the system. It took James half the season to pick it up and learn a new technique. He should be primed for his best season yet as he hits the ground running. I see the depth chart shaking out like this day one.
LT Tunsil: An upgrade from a declining Branden Albert who will be better in the running game.
LG Larsen: Played in the system before and offers a veteran presence (102 games) next to a young LT.
C Pouncey: I could see easily Steen starting the season until Pouncey gets into shape. Not being able to work out will set Pouncey back. Limited leg work and only 86 days until game 1 vs Tampa.
RG: Bushrod: Just as James struggled to pick up the system last year, Bushrod had a tougher task. Switching from a 10 year LT to the opposite side of the line as well as a new position. Gase likes this guy and feels he will be much better in his 2nd season as a RG.
RT: James: Should be set up for a good year. Gase expects him to be a dominant player. That may be over-shooting but he can be very good.
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Anthony Steen: #1 backup center
Kraig Urbik: #1 OG off the bench and #3 center
Sam Young: #1 tackle off the bench. RT & LT.
If Pouncey starts the season I could see Steen make a serious push for the starting LG spot.
The rest....
Jake Brendel: 2016 UDFA center from Dallas via UCLA who was waived injured. ZERO games played. Came out as a 286 lb center who has been adding weight. Now listed at 303 lbs. Long shot.
Terry Poole: 2015 4th round pick. Waived injured from Seattle. Projects inside to guard. Long shot.
Avery Young: 2016 UDFA from Saints via Auburn. 6'5 328 lb tackle prospect who probably projects to guard. Played LG, RG & RT. Willie Young's brother, Thomas Davis cousin. Long shot.
Jesse Davis: UDFA from Seahawks via Idaho. Former college defensive lineman. 6'6 286 lbs. Long shot tackle prospect.
Eric Smith: UDFA from Virginia. 6'4 298. May need to add some weight.
With 8 spots likely set on the line, I imagine we will be bringing in more guys for competition when camp rolls around. All of these lower roster guys are developmental prospects who are not likely to see a 53 man roster let alone the 45 game day. We carried 10 linemen last year to start the season.
So far Asiata has been working at at LG & RG. Steen, Larsen and Urbik have been working at C and G. Steen has bulked up from last year and he was the first guy off the bench last year when Pouncey went down. I don't see Asiata starting this season. Our vet backups may not be all-stars but they have been in the system. It took James half the season to pick it up and learn a new technique. He should be primed for his best season yet as he hits the ground running. I see the depth chart shaking out like this day one.
LT Tunsil: An upgrade from a declining Branden Albert who will be better in the running game.
LG Larsen: Played in the system before and offers a veteran presence (102 games) next to a young LT.
C Pouncey: I could see easily Steen starting the season until Pouncey gets into shape. Not being able to work out will set Pouncey back. Limited leg work and only 86 days until game 1 vs Tampa.
RG: Bushrod: Just as James struggled to pick up the system last year, Bushrod had a tougher task. Switching from a 10 year LT to the opposite side of the line as well as a new position. Gase likes this guy and feels he will be much better in his 2nd season as a RG.
RT: James: Should be set up for a good year. Gase expects him to be a dominant player. That may be over-shooting but he can be very good.
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Anthony Steen: #1 backup center
Kraig Urbik: #1 OG off the bench and #3 center
Sam Young: #1 tackle off the bench. RT & LT.
If Pouncey starts the season I could see Steen make a serious push for the starting LG spot.
The rest....
Jake Brendel: 2016 UDFA center from Dallas via UCLA who was waived injured. ZERO games played. Came out as a 286 lb center who has been adding weight. Now listed at 303 lbs. Long shot.
Terry Poole: 2015 4th round pick. Waived injured from Seattle. Projects inside to guard. Long shot.
Avery Young: 2016 UDFA from Saints via Auburn. 6'5 328 lb tackle prospect who probably projects to guard. Played LG, RG & RT. Willie Young's brother, Thomas Davis cousin. Long shot.
Jesse Davis: UDFA from Seahawks via Idaho. Former college defensive lineman. 6'6 286 lbs. Long shot tackle prospect.
Eric Smith: UDFA from Virginia. 6'4 298. May need to add some weight.
With 8 spots likely set on the line, I imagine we will be bringing in more guys for competition when camp rolls around. All of these lower roster guys are developmental prospects who are not likely to see a 53 man roster let alone the 45 game day. We carried 10 linemen last year to start the season.
hoops
Tua time!
i think urbiks probably the lead horse as the backup pivot right now...anchor wasn't really steens issue it's one of the few things he did pretty well...the athlete stunk up the joint in space and at the 2nd level...adding weight I don't see how it helps the pivot play I think it's more about playing a depth guard...those short arms don't help either...the more run he got in 2016 the worse the return was...to where it was obvious that cat had to be benched I think the zona game...one of those games was absolutely horrid pivot play from steen
I think the va kid has talent but it might need a red shirt on the p squad season before it gets any game sniffs...not to warm and fuzzy about the depth tackle situation with young the backup at both spots...but at least he had more fire off the snap and better looking feet when he did play for us than he showed late in his falcons stay...maybe it was about not ever being physically right then...either way gase can probably offset if we have to start young extended provided we aren't getting behind the sticks/chasing the scoreboard...
I think the va kid has talent but it might need a red shirt on the p squad season before it gets any game sniffs...not to warm and fuzzy about the depth tackle situation with young the backup at both spots...but at least he had more fire off the snap and better looking feet when he did play for us than he showed late in his falcons stay...maybe it was about not ever being physically right then...either way gase can probably offset if we have to start young extended provided we aren't getting behind the sticks/chasing the scoreboard...