Why Glenn Dorsey is NOT the right choice | Page 5 | FinHeaven - Miami Dolphins Forums

Why Glenn Dorsey is NOT the right choice

cnc66 said:
I think he was overwhelmed some.. not that he can't work through it, but work it will take.
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Good assesment I think Marty:up:

That is one kid that HAS to improve to what was expected..if that is fair. He could really be the difference between our Linebackers making plays or not. IMO
 
Dorsey weighs about the same as the top NT in the league when they came out in the draft, plus we aren't expected to run a pure 3-4 D, we are supposedly going to play a hybrid 3-4 4-3. AND like others said, Dallas' NT weighs less than 300 lbs
 
Boomer said:
Soliai? I think he's devastatingly raw. I don't think he has any idea how to use his hands and I don't think he understands his body and leverage. He needs a LOT of work. I would hope that Kacy Rodgers makes him his pet project and gets him into Davie everyday and get him working.
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Esp. since he use to be an offensive lineman....
 
Boomer said:
Glenn Dorsey is 6'2, 316lbs.

He's a NT, an end on both sides, a 3 technique. Miami isn't going to play a pure 3-4, much as Dallas didn't - the same Dallas who played with a starting NT/DT in Jay Ratliff who was 298lbs. You move Dorsey all around the formation to work in what will likely be a 2 gap defense. He will need to be accounted for on every play.
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that sounds good to me . very good observation man
 
lbmclean_sj said:
thats kind of a needs based assessment

if we can't find a guy in the later rounds to stop the gashing, then we are in trouble

we should try fattening up a 6'5" guy and put him in the middle
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http://www.dolphinsnation.com/forums/showthread.php?t=207300

Nose Tackle (NT)
The nose tackle in a 34 base set has several different responsibilities than a tradition 43 DT. His ideal frame is short, compact, and stout with exceptional strength. As opposed to a 43 Tackle, he doesnt need to be taller with long arms to put an arm up in passing lanes on throwing downs because pass rush isnt his first responsibility In the run game his job first and foremost, is to occupy the Center with enough leverage that a guard must help block him. He can never allow the post snap line of scrimmage to be pushed back. Normally in pass rush, his main goal is to push the Center back into the pocket far enough as to not allow the QB to step up in the pocket avoiding the outside rush. A good Nose Tackle who does his job well is essential for this defense to be successful.
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These 2 descriptions of what a NT is supposed to be (the description of the first NT for the Vikings and the description of what a NT is supposed to do) describe Glenn Dorsey exactly. Exceptionally strong with great leverage that cannot be blocked by 1 man and cannot be pushed back.
 
Nose Tackle (NT)
The nose tackle in a 34 base set has several different responsibilities than a tradition 43 DT. His ideal frame is short, compact, and stout with exceptional strength. As opposed to a 43 Tackle, he doesnt need to be taller with long arms to put an arm up in passing lanes on throwing downs because pass rush isnt his first responsibility In the run game his job first and foremost, is to occupy the Center with enough leverage that a guard must help block him. He can never allow the post snap line of scrimmage to be pushed back. Normally in pass rush, his main goal is to push the Center back into the pocket far enough as to not allow the QB to step up in the pocket avoiding the outside rush. A good Nose Tackle who does his job well is essential for this defense to be successful.
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self-contradicting

an ideal NT is tall, but only at finheaven would less than ideal be perfect for the #1

I am glad that morons are not running our FO, so we won't pick a 3 technique DT @ #1 and make him a NT
 
lbmclean_sj said:
http://www.chicagotribune.com/sports/chi-25-pompei-onnfljan25,1,7829951.story?ctrack=1&cset=true



learn it, know it, live it
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Why does everyone assume we moving exclusively to a 3 - 4 defense? Has anyone in the Dolphins organization confirmed that we are? It seems to me that we'll be running a hybrid of some kind because we simply don't have the personel to run a full time 3 - 4 and we won't have the pieces for quite a few years.

And I think a DT that can play both a NT in a 3 - 4 and a DT in a 4 - 3 and can play either passing or running downs is worth the #1 pick. I bet we could even play Dorsey at DE occasionally because of his explosiveness. Much like moving an outstanding WR around while on offense to confuse the defense, Dorsey could be moved around the line to confuse the offensive blocking schemes.
 
lbmclean_sj said:
self-contradicting

an ideal NT is tall, but only at finheaven would less than ideal be perfect for the #1

I am glad that morons are not running our FO, so we won't pick a 3 technique DT @ #1 and make him a NT
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wilfork is 6'1. Pat Williams is 6'3.Casey Hampton of the steelers is 6'2.Our own Keith Traylor is 6'2. Glen Dorsey is 6'2 he is more than tall enough to be a NT, and he weighs enough as well.\

Plus as the poster above me said, we are going to run a hybrid set of 3-4 and 4-3, dallas does the same thing and their NT, weighs less than 300 lbs!!
 
(warning: i have read none of this thread beyond the first post :warning)

he doesn't have to play NT in the 3-4, he can be a 3-4 End... he would be our Richard Seymour
 
I think the argument that you can't take a NT at #1 is disingenious and oversimplification.

First of all I think the #1 overall can be more a curse than a blessing. No matter how high a pick you get you are never guaranteed a pro-bowler...but at #1 you will be paying them pro bowl wages.

Now the theory is to get the bang for your buck at this spot you have to get a certified game breaker. Normally people think of game breakers as QBs, RBs, Wrs, and LT since they are so hard to acquire.

However I make the argument that a game breaker is ANYONE who decisively changes the flow of the game from their position. If you acquire such a player, regardless of where the pick is, you have achieved worth from your drafting perspective.

Glenn Dorsey plays a position that is often away from the ball. So your casual observer doesn't see him play in and play out. However he is a beast against the run and makes an awful high number of sacks as well for the position he plays and attention he gets.

He can play both NT and DE in a 3-4 and Dt in a 4-3. Think about it. This is a guy we can line up all over the place in the front four and who will be the first focus of the offensive line on every single running play. How do you gameplan your running attack then?

So is Glenn Dorsey worth the number 1? is it worth the number one pick to go from being a sieve against the running attack to automatically elevating your team being a wall in the middle?

I say yes. Stop the run and punish the other guy with the run. Do both and you will win and you will win consistantly.
 
MexDolfan said:
Maybe we could need to add one RB, but only if Ronnie can't return full recovered. Even with Chatman, this pick may sound intelligent if Ronnie doesn't shows signs of a healthy recovery.
:unsure:
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Sure, add another RB by all means. I'm not at all opposed to bringing another HB as an insurance policy and telling Ricky to hit the bricks. In fact, I encourage the move. Yet, this team has too many holes that need fixed. Using the #1 overall pick and subsequently eating another 7-8 million + a year in salary cap space is neither practical nor smart.

As for Dorsey, some of you are overevaluating and underestimating Dorsey badly. 3-4 defense, 4-3 defense, the 46, a hybrid.. It all means nothing to me because I view Dorsey as a good football player who is talented enough to make necessary adjustments to fit the defensive scheme he's in.

You really should take a look at some LSU games from this year. The guy was clearly the best player on the field (and yes, I'm mentioning on both sides of the football). An entire defense was built around him, which for a DT is extrordinarily rare.

Dorsey's a rare breed of football player who will make a lot of Pro Bowl appearances and be regarded as a top 3 DT wherever he goes. I look at him and see Warren Sapp minus the baggage. He's got huge upside and I think the Phins cannot go wrong by taking him.. And this from a guy who HATES LSU.
 
MrTree said:
I think the argument that you can't take a NT at #1 is disingenious and oversimplification.

First of all I think the #1 overall can be more a curse than a blessing. No matter how high a pick you get you are never guaranteed a pro-bowler...but at #1 you will be paying them pro bowl wages.

Now the theory is to get the bang for your buck at this spot you have to get a certified game breaker. Normally people think of game breakers as QBs, RBs, Wrs, and LT since they are so hard to acquire.

However I make the argument that a game breaker is ANYONE who decisively changes the flow of the game from their position. If you acquire such a player, regardless of where the pick is, you have achieved worth from your drafting perspective.

Glenn Dorsey plays a position that is often away from the ball. So your casual observer doesn't see him play in and play out. However he is a beast against the run and makes an awful high number of sacks as well for the position he plays and attention he gets.

He can play both NT and DE in a 3-4 and Dt in a 4-3. Think about it. This is a guy we can line up all over the place in the front four and who will be the first focus of the offensive line on every single running play. How do you gameplan your running attack then?

So is Glenn Dorsey worth the number 1? is it worth the number one pick to go from being a sieve against the running attack to automatically elevating your team being a wall in the middle?

I say yes. Stop the run and punish the other guy with the run. Do both and you will win and you will win consistantly.
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Dorsey is as worthy as anyone else of being the #1, but I would have him in a system that would play to his strengths(ie the 4-3)

making him a NT or DE is a waste of his talent, the #1 pick should not be a subject to shoehorn, he should be at his natural position
 
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