Belichick Pulls Brady, Starters Before 2min. Warning.

[joenhre]

The whole AFC is pretty weak this year. The Colts are still the best of the bunch though. The team that they will probably have to worry about the most is their Nemesis for the passed couple years, the Chargers.

I don't think the Colts would be able to beat either the Saints or Vikings on a neutral field, even though you can never count Peyton out.

 

[nyjunc]

The whole AFC is pretty weak this year. The Colts are still the best of the bunch though. The team that they will probably have to worry about the most is their Nemesis for the passed couple years, the Chargers.

I don't think the Colts would be able to beat either the Saints or Vikings on a neutral field, even though you can never count Peyton out.

You can always count Peyton out as long as it's postseason.

 

[Batroc]

You can always count Peyton out as long as it's postseason.

I keep seeing statements like this one and my only question would be: Do the 2007 AFC Championship and Super Bowl victories not count all of a sudden? You can call it a fluke or say it was only one Super Bowl, but it's one more than your team or mine has over the last thirty years. Peyton will be fine if his defense gives him some support in the playoffs...

 

[MarinePhinFan]

You can always count Peyton out as long as it's postseason.

Typical Jest fan.

Why don't you actually look up P. Manning's stats, average them out then take oh...I don't know...T. Brady's stats and compare them. You may be surprised at what you find.

I'll help you out:

Brady post season QBR 88

Manning post season QBR 86.9

Brady has more post season wins because his defense, running game and coaches have been better. Retards like to spout off how Manning has "choked" in big games when in fact the Colts defense has choked.

For example, the Colts have scored 24 or less points ten times in the post season since Manning's been there. They have lost 8 out of those 10 games.

The Pats have scored 24 or less points ten times in the post season since Brady has been there. They have lost 2 out of those 10 games.


So let me explain that to you, a brain dead Jest fan:

Manning has played just as well as Brady in the playoffs even though he has been under more pressure to score, had crappier run game support and had inferior coaches.

Manning is going to retire as one of the top 10 (maybe top 5 ) greatest QB's to ever play in the NFL. Brady will retire and be remembered as another Aikmen, Bradshaw or Griese. HOF'er, yes, but no where near the greatest.

 

[shula_guy]

If I were a N.E. fan (I'ld have to hang myself) I would be pretty damn mad they pulled my starters out. I am the customer payinf for a product. I want 4 quarters of the best football they can give me. I could careless about any of their feelings they are entertainment products. It is not entertaining to watch a team give up like they did. They owe all their fans a refund.

 

[nyjunc]

I keep seeing statements like this one and my only question would be: Do the 2007 AFC Championship and Super Bowl victories not count all of a sudden? You can call it a fluke or say it was only one Super Bowl, but it's one more than your team or mine has over the last thirty years. Peyton will be fine if his defense gives him some support in the playoffs...

He has his one title, he has had SB caliber talent around him for about a decade and has just ONE appearance in a playoff year he had one great half('06 title game) and was mediocre the rest of the playoffs.

The D has been good enough to win w/. They have lost games giving up 19, 17 in regulation(twice), 20, 21, 22, ...


They haven't been losing games 38-34, the one game they gave up 41 pts the offense scored ZERO. It's possible to win a game allowing 41 pts, it's impossible to win a game scoring ZERO.

Typical Jest fan.

Why don't you actually look up P. Manning's stats, average them out then take oh...I don't know...T. Brady's stats and compare them. You may be surprised at what you find.

I'll help you out:

Brady post season QBR 88

Manning post season QBR 86.9

Brady has more post season wins because his defense, running game and coaches have been better. Retards like to spout off how Manning has "choked" in big games when in fact the Colts defense has choked.

For example, the Colts have scored 24 or less points ten times in the post season since Manning's been there. They have lost 8 out of those 10 games.

The Pats have scored 24 or less points ten times in the post season since Brady has been there. They have lost 2 out of those 10 games.


So let me explain that to you, a brain dead Jest fan:

Manning has played just as well as Brady in the playoffs even though he has been under more pressure to score, had crappier run game support and had inferior coaches.

Manning is going to retire as one of the top 10 (maybe top 5 ) greatest QB's to ever play in the NFL. Brady will retire and be remembered as another Aikmen, Bradshaw or Griese. HOF'er, yes, but no where near the greatest.

No I'm not a typical fan at all, typical fans THINK Peyton is better than Brady b/c he puts up better fantasy #s in the regular season but those of us that watch and understand the games see what he does in january and how he has struggled while Brady has been great.


The QB ratings in postseason are close so they must be close! You show how little you know.


Did you know in regulation the Colts D has allowed less than 2 PPG less than the "great" NE defense in postseason?

Did you know in 8 playoff losses Peyton has led that high powered O to less than 14 PPG on average?

Did you know Peyton has gone one and done SIX times? Brady never.

Did you know Peyton is 0-3 when he has a bye? Brady undefeated.

Did you know Bill Belichick never got as far as a conf title game w/o Brady and that Tony Dungy once made a conf title game w/ Shaun King as his QB?

Did you know that in their SB run Peyton threw 3 TDs and 7 INTs in their 4 postseason games?

Did you know that in 3 SB title runs Brady threw a total of 3 INTs.

Did you know Brady led last minute SB victories in 2 of his 3 title years?

Did you know in the lone SB loss he led his team 80 yds in the final minutes? has Peyton ever had a postseason loss where he led his on a late scoring drive only to watch his D give it up?

Did you know that the first year Brady got weapons comparable to what Manning had his entire career he smashed records and led them to a 16-0 season and another SB?


keep reading stat sheets, like the one that tells you he had a good game w/ a 90 rating against Pitt in '05 even though he was terrible and cost them that game.

 

[MarinePhinFan]

He has his one title, he has had SB caliber talent around him for about a decade and has just ONE appearance in a playoff year he had one great half('06 title game) and was mediocre the rest of the playoffs.



The D has been good enough to win w/. They have lost games giving up 19, 17 in regulation(twice), 20, 21, 22, ...

Wrong again. Do you realize that the Pats, since Brady, has had a defense ranked lower than 6th in the league TWICE. The Pats failed to win more than 10 games each season the defense was ranked that low. Since Manning has played for the Colts they have had a defense ranked lower than 6th 9 times. The Colts made the playoffs 8 of those times winning, 13, 10, 10, 12, 12, 14, 12, 12. Manning won his Super Bowl with the 23rd ranked defense in the league. The Patriots defense ranked 6th, 1st and 2nd respectively in their Super Bowl winning seasons.


They haven't been losing games 38-34, the one game they gave up 41 pts the offense scored ZERO. It's possible to win a game allowing 41 pts, it's impossible to win a game scoring ZERO.





No I'm not a typical fan at all, typical fans THINK Peyton is better than Brady b/c he puts up better fantasy #s in the regular season but those of us that watch and understand the games see what he does in january and how he has struggled while Brady has been great.


The QB ratings in postseason are close so they must be close! You show how little you know.


Did you know in regulation the Colts D has allowed less than 2 PPG less than the "great" NE defense in postseason?

Did you know in 8 playoff losses Peyton has led that high powered O to less than 14 PPG on average?

Did you know Peyton has gone one and done SIX times? Brady never.

Did you know Peyton is 0-3 when he has a bye? Brady undefeated.

Did you know Bill Belichick never got as far as a conf title game w/o Brady and that Tony Dungy once made a conf title game w/ Shaun King as his QB?

Did you know that in their SB run Peyton threw 3 TDs and 7 INTs in their 4 postseason games?

Did you know that in 3 SB title runs Brady threw a total of 3 INTs.

Did you know Brady led last minute SB victories in 2 of his 3 title years?

Did you know in the lone SB loss he led his team 80 yds in the final minutes? has Peyton ever had a postseason loss where he led his on a late scoring drive only to watch his D give it up?

Did you know that the first year Brady got weapons comparable to what Manning had his entire career he smashed records and led them to a 16-0 season and another SB?


keep reading stat sheets, like the one that tells you he had a good game w/ a 90 rating against Pitt in '05 even though he was terrible and cost them that game.

God I hate stupid Jests fans. What do you mean read over a stats sheet? And if a QB posts a 90QBR he DID have a good game you dolt.

Example:

2007- Against SD Manning led the Colts to 24 points, passed for 400 yards on a day they couldn't run the ball, had a 97 QBR with 3 td's and 2 int, and the colts lost because the defense allowed 28 points.

Against that same SD team...Brady led the pats to 21 points, had a 66.7 QBR with 2 td's and 3 ints and 201 yards passing...but the pats won because the defense held SD to 12 points.

There is no question that Manning played far better against SD in the 2007 playoffs than Brady did. Unlike Brady, his defense did not bail him out. That is a recurring pattern in their careers, and the biggest reason Brady's playoff record is better than Manning's. In playoff games where Brady has a QBR below 80 the Pats are 5-2, including 2-0 when Brady has been below 70. In games where manning has a QBR below 80, the Colts are 3-4.

The last two seasons have had bizarre endings for the Pats. The Giants game was the first time the Pats had lost a playoff game in the Brady era when they held the other team to 17 points or less. They are 9-1 in those games. (they are 0-2 when the offense scores 14 points or fewer). In 2006 they lost for the first time when they had scored over 21 points in a game. They are also 9-1 in those games.

Were those Manning losses to the Pats a failure for Manning or a triumph for Belichick? Joe Montana never beat a Belichick coordinated defense, scoring 3, 3 and 13 points against them. Those games were both in New England because New Englad was better during the regular season. The best team won...as they did in 2006 at Indy. There have been no upsets when Brady and Manning have gone head to head in the post season.

 

[MarinePhinFan]

It's not that Peyton can't get it done, it's that the Colts require him to do a lot more to produce a win than the Pats do of Brady, because he doesn't get the same level of defensive support.

For instance, in those great comebacks for Brady, how many have been td drives? Heck, how many have required Brady to put the Pats into great field goal position? The game winning kick in the Super Bowl against the Rams was 48 yards and against the Panthers was 41 yards. Those are not chip shots, even in the snow to force overtime against Oakland, Vinatieri hit a 45 yard. The FG that beat the Titans in 2004 was a 46 yarder. The Colts make Peyton drive for TD's because their defense doesn't provide the support that the Pats D does for Brady.

Even the greatest qb of all time never won a playoff game against a Belichick coordinated defense. There is just much more to winning a playoff game than the talent level or even the performance of the QB. the difference is when Brady plays poorly, the Pats usually find a way to win. When manning does, the Colts don't.

Did you know Brady has never thrown a td pass for the game winning td in a playoff game? I would not have guessed that. Manning is the only one of the two to have a game winning td drive. Brady has 4 drives that led to game winning field goals...the 3 long kicks i mentioned above and the 31 yard chip shot to win the SD game after 2006.

A lot of what people see as the Brady playoff magic is due to the Pats defense, the coaching, the gm's, and Adam Vinatieri. And that was and is my point.

 

[nyjunc]

God I hate stupid Jests fans. What do you mean read over a stats sheet? And if a QB posts a 90QBR he DID have a good game you dolt.

Example:

2007- Against SD Manning led the Colts to 24 points, passed for 400 yards on a day they couldn't run the ball, had a 97 QBR with 3 td's and 2 int, and the colts lost because the defense allowed 28 points.

Against that same SD team...Brady led the pats to 21 points, had a 66.7 QBR with 2 td's and 3 ints and 201 yards passing...but the pats won because the defense held SD to 12 points.

There is no question that Manning played far better against SD in the 2007 playoffs than Brady did. Unlike Brady, his defense did not bail him out. That is a recurring pattern in their careers, and the biggest reason Brady's playoff record is better than Manning's. In playoff games where Brady has a QBR below 80 the Pats are 5-2, including 2-0 when Brady has been below 70. In games where manning has a QBR below 80, the Colts are 3-4.

The last two seasons have had bizarre endings for the Pats. The Giants game was the first time the Pats had lost a playoff game in the Brady era when they held the other team to 17 points or less. They are 9-1 in those games. (they are 0-2 when the offense scores 14 points or fewer). In 2006 they lost for the first time when they had scored over 21 points in a game. They are also 9-1 in those games.

Were those Manning losses to the Pats a failure for Manning or a triumph for Belichick? Joe Montana never beat a Belichick coordinated defense, scoring 3, 3 and 13 points against them. Those games were both in New England because New Englad was better during the regular season. The best team won...as they did in 2006 at Indy. There have been no upsets when Brady and Manning have gone head to head in the post season.

First off, act like an adult. Enough w/ the silly name calling.


Who cares where the D was ranked in the reg season? It's about how well they play in January and they have played well enough to win in most years. I showed you the PA, a great offense like Indy's should be able to score enough to win most of those games.



2007: he threw not one but TWO INTs deep in SD territory, it cost his team AT LEAST 6 points- they lost by 4 but b/c you look at the boxscore and the rating is good you think he played well.


Brady didn't have a great game against SD in the 2007 title game but he also didn't throw 2 critical INTs that cost his team the game. After his 2nd INT he bounced back and led them to the game clinching TD. Manning had TWO chances to win that game against SD and failed on 2 different possessions after SD took the lead.

The Giant SB Brady led his team 80 yds for the go ahead score in the final minutes. The D then blew the game, that has NEVER happened to Peyton in a playoff loss. he has never led his team to a late score only to watch the D blow it.

The AFC title Game in '06 it was miraculous NE was there, Peyton has trouble winning w/ the amazing weapons he has had around him his entire career so imagine him winning 2 playoff games w/ Reche Caldwell and Jabar Gaffney as his starting WRs.

Belichick had the best defensive player ever to play the game w/ the Giants and those were truly great defenses and Montana was beating the Giants in 1990 until he got knocked out of the game.


The D's were comparable w/ NE and Indy in postseason, the weapons on O in all but one year were hugely in favor of Indy yet Brady is 14-3 in postseason while Manning is 7-8.

 

[MarinePhinFan]

Also, Jest fan. What records did Brady "smash"? I love making Jests fans look stupid.

P. Manning played in 14.5 games the season he threw for 49 TD's. Brady played 16 games when he threw for 50. Manning averaged 10 TD's per 100 attempts and Brady average 8. So, who had the better season?

Moss has made Culpepper and Brady BOTH look like super stars when in all reality they are/were good but not great.

 

[MarinePhinFan]

First off, act like an adult. Enough w/ the silly name calling.


Who cares where the D was ranked in the reg season? It's about how well they play in January and they have played well enough to win in most years. I showed you the PA, a great offense like Indy's should be able to score enough to win most of those games.



2007: he threw not one but TWO INTs deep in SD territory, it cost his team AT LEAST 6 points- they lost by 4 but b/c you look at the boxscore and the rating is good you think he played well.


Brady didn't have a great game against SD in the 2007 title game but he also didn't throw 2 critical INTs that cost his team the game. After his 2nd INT he bounced back and led them to the game clinching TD. Manning had TWO chances to win that game against SD and failed on 2 different possessions after SD took the lead.

The Giant SB Brady led his team 80 yds for the go ahead score in the final minutes. The D then blew the game, that has NEVER happened to Peyton in a playoff loss. he has never led his team to a late score only to watch the D blow it.

The AFC title Game in '06 it was miraculous NE was there, Peyton has trouble winning w/ the amazing weapons he has had around him his entire career so imagine him winning 2 playoff games w/ Reche Caldwell and Jabar Gaffney as his starting WRs.

Belichick had the best defensive player ever to play the game w/ the Giants and those were truly great defenses and Montana was beating the Giants in 1990 until he got knocked out of the game.


The D's were comparable w/ NE and Indy in postseason, the weapons on O in all but one year were hugely in favor of Indy yet Brady is 14-3 in postseason while Manning is 7-8.

Your post is crap and you're doing nothing more than making excuses. Like Manning's INT's are somehow worse than Brady's INT's. :lol2:

Along with the numbers when their ratings are below 80 (5-2 for Brady, 3-4 for Manning)...when their ratings are 81 to 90 the Pats are 2-1 and the Colts are 1-1. When their ratings are 91 to 100, the pats are 1-0 and the colts are 1-2. When the QB's don't play great...qb rating less than 100, the pats are 8-3 and the colts are 5-7. When Brady isn't great the Pats still find a way to win. When Manning doesn't play great, the colts usually lose. Hard to blame that all, or even mostly on Manning.

 

[nyjunc]

It's not that Peyton can't get it done, it's that the Colts require him to do a lot more to produce a win than the Pats do of Brady, because he doesn't get the same level of defensive support.

For instance, in those great comebacks for Brady, how many have been td drives? Heck, how many have required Brady to put the Pats into great field goal position? The game winning kick in the Super Bowl against the Rams was 48 yards and against the Panthers was 41 yards. Those are not chip shots, even in the snow to force overtime against Oakland, Vinatieri hit a 45 yard. The FG that beat the Titans in 2004 was a 46 yarder. The Colts make Peyton drive for TD's because their defense doesn't provide the support that the Pats D does for Brady.

Even the greatest qb of all time never won a playoff game against a Belichick coordinated defense. There is just much more to winning a playoff game than the talent level or even the performance of the QB. the difference is when Brady plays poorly, the Pats usually find a way to win. When manning does, the Colts don't.

Did you know Brady has never thrown a td pass for the game winning td in a playoff game? I would not have guessed that. Manning is the only one of the two to have a game winning td drive. Brady has 4 drives that led to game winning field goals...the 3 long kicks i mentioned above and the 31 yard chip shot to win the SD game after 2006.

A lot of what people see as the Brady playoff magic is due to the Pats defense, the coaching, the gm's, and Adam Vinatieri. And that was and is my point.

Peyton does not have to do more- he TRIES to do more but he doesn't need to do more. Like I explained, the difference in PA btw the 2 Ds in postseason is less than 2 PPG. It's not like Manning is losing 38-34 shootouts, he guides his O to less than 14 PPG in their 8 playoff losses and has only led his O to more than 20 points in ONE playoff loss.

It doesn't matter how many drives have been TD drives, he's gotten the job done. The one time he led a late, long TD drive his D blew it. Peyton has never had that happen to him.


Belichick only faced Montana led teams in postseason 3 times and they knocked him out of 2 of them including the '90 title game that he left SF w/ a lead in. In '85 and '86 SF didn't have great teams and Montana was having injury problems(he only played 8 games in '86). BB was on the staffs when SF beat the Giants in '81 and '84.

Better than BB in just 3 games against montana look up BB's coaching record w/ and w/o Brady and let me know what you find. Also, BB had never reached a conf title game w/o Brady, Tony Dungy made one w/o Peyton.


So if the magic has so much to do w/ Adam Vinatieri why does Peyton only have 1 title w/ him? Brady set up his kicker to make kicks and he made them. You can blame the kicker all you want for '05 vs. pitt but on 2nd and 3rd and 2 Manning took shots at the EZ instead of moving the chains and getting in better FG position. Brady would move the chains. In SB XXXVIII AV missed 2 FGs yet Brady still got him in position to kick the GW.

Show me the playoff losses that peyton has done all he could but other parts of the team collapsed.

 

[nyjunc]

Your post is crap and you're doing nothing more than making excuses. Like Manning's INT's are somehow worse than Brady's INT's. :lol2:

Along with the numbers when their ratings are below 80 (5-2 for Brady, 3-4 for Manning)...when their ratings are 81 to 90 the Pats are 2-1 and the Colts are 1-1. When their ratings are 91 to 100, the pats are 1-0 and the colts are 1-2. When the QB's don't play great...qb rating less than 100, the pats are 8-3 and the colts are 5-7. When Brady isn't great the Pats still find a way to win. When Manning doesn't play great, the colts usually lose. Hard to blame that all, or even mostly on Manning.

You are the one making excuses- the kicker, the coaching, the defense, etc...

Who cares about QB ratings? Did you WATCH the games? manning had an 82 rating against Miami in 2000 but couldn't put up more than a 2nd half FG as they lost to one of the legendary choking D's of all time. he had a 91 rating against Pitt in '05 but even being given 2 gifts(an overturn of an INT and a Bettis fumble at the GL that was returned to midfield) he still couldn't even get the game to OT, he had a 98 rating against SD in '07 but his 2 critical INTs deep in SD territory plus his inability to lead Indy to a TD on either of their last 2 drives cost them that game and last year he had a 90 rating at 8-8 SD but did nothing all game besides one play where they caught SD napping and he had a chance to seal the game w/ one 1st down late and couldn't do it.


yes the magic of the Pats D to blow a 14 pt lead in SB XXXVI, the magic of the Pats D to blow multiple leads in SB XXXVIII, the magic of BB who in 7 years w/o Brady has ONE playoff app.

You do the GM of the Colts built the Buffalo AFC dynasy team, right? When did Scott Pioli or BB ever build a SB team before they got lucky w/ Brady?


You do realize Peyton has had vinatieri for 4 years now, right?


Any more excuses?

 

[satz]

Peyton 3TD-8int in his post season sb winning year.Avg a team over a year is a dumb standard with injuries and how players and rookies develop.

also claiming that ederin james in 2003 is worst then antwan smith is even bigger claim. a train rain for 700 yds comapred to james nearly 1600 yds seasin in 03.

 

[nyjunc]

Also, Jest fan. What records did Brady "smash"? I love making Jests fans look stupid.

P. Manning played in 14.5 games the season he threw for 49 TD's. Brady played 16 games when he threw for 50. Manning averaged 10 TD's per 100 attempts and Brady average 8. So, who had the better season?

Moss has made Culpepper and Brady BOTH look like super stars when in all reality they are/were good but not great.

He broke the single season TD record and didn't play more than half his games in DOMES.


You are right, Moss made Brady which is why he won 3 SBs w/o him and has yet to win one w/ him. You are talking about making someone look stupid?:lol2: