Belichick Pulls Brady, Starters Before 2min. Warning.

[ArmyFin7]

At least Juncs lovefest with Brady is a little more warranted than the lovefest most fins fans have with ronnie brown...

 

[nyjunc]

At least Juncs lovefest with Brady is a little more warranted than the lovefest most fins fans have with ronnie brown...

I appreciate greatness whether I hate the player or team or not.

I also have an appreciation for manning, I just happen to think Brady is better.

 

[MarinePhinFan]

Wow! One good game in the cold against the 29th ranked defense and a franchise that has a grand total of 3 playoff wins since 1970.

Actually, the morons recite the meaningless regular season fantasy #s where Manning plays at least half his games in dome every year. Those that understand the game discuss how those QBs play when it matters most and when it matters most Brady has been the much more successful QB despite never having half the offensive talent around Manning has had w/ the exception of 2007.

Your assumptions about Manning are provably false and I've proved them wrong a few times in this one thread alone.

Jan. 19, 2002, Foxboro, MA- 25 degrees. Brady has a 70 QBR- Pats win

Jan. 14, 2006, Denver, CO- 36 degrees. Brady has a 74 QBR- Pats lose

Jan. 20, 2008, Foxboro, MA- 19 degrees. Brady has a 66 QBR- Pats win

Jan. 14, 2007, San Diego, CA- 66 degrees. Brady has a 57 QBR- Pats win


I guess Brady can't play in cold OR warm weather? His team sure knows how to help him out when he plays bad though, huh?

You stupid morons who act like Brady has done nothing but play in the cold dark recesses of hell and Manning has played in sunny Hawaii their entire careers are just looking for excuses. Later I'll post ALL of the temperature to ALL of their games just to make you look even more dumb. :up:

 

[nyjunc]

Your assumptions about Manning are provably false and I've proved them wrong a few times in this one thread alone.

Jan. 19, 2002, Foxboro, MA- 25 degrees. Brady has a 70 QBR- Pats win

Jan. 14, 2006, Denver, CO- 36 degrees. Brady has a 74 QBR- Pats lose

Jan. 20, 2008, Foxboro, MA- 19 degrees. Brady has a 66 QBR- Pats win

Jan. 14, 2007, San Diego, CA- 66 degrees. Brady has a 57 QBR- Pats win


I guess Brady can't play in cold OR warm weather? His team sure knows how to help him out when he plays bad though, huh?

You stupid morons who act like Brady has done nothing but play in the cold dark recesses of hell and Manning has played in sunny Hawaii their entire careers are just looking for excuses. Later I'll post ALL of the temperature to ALL of their games just to make you look even more dumb. :up:

WHO cares about QB rating?

Jan 19, 2002 he led his team to the game tying FG and game winning FG in OT

Jan. 14, 2006: he had a bad game, it happens

Jan 20, 2008: threw an INT that cost his team points, came back next possession and led team to TD that iced the game. very different from Peyton TWICE throwing INts to cost his team pts against SD the week before and not coming through when he had multiple chances late in the game.

Jan. 14, 2007: He wasn't great but when Troy Brown forced the fumble off the INT Brady capitlaized unlike Manning who was given multiple gifts at home vs. Pitt in Jan '06.



Does every game have to be perfect? he makes plays when it matters.


Outside of the '06 AFC Championship, the '06 SD game and the FOUR Super Bowls Brady has played in the rest of his postseason games have been played in cold weather Cities in January.

If you don't think playing AT LEAST 8 reg season games a year in domes and playing 3 warm weather road games inside the Colts div doesn't help a QB than you are more clueless than you let on.

 

[MarinePhinFan]

WHO cares about QB rating?

Jan 19, 2002 he led his team to the game tying FG and game winning FG in OT

Jan. 14, 2006: he had a bad game, it happens

Jan 20, 2008: threw an INT that cost his team points, came back next possession and led team to TD that iced the game. very different from Peyton TWICE throwing INts to cost his team pts against SD the week before and not coming through when he had multiple chances late in the game.

Jan. 14, 2007: He wasn't great but when Troy Brown forced the fumble off the INT Brady capitlaized unlike Manning who was given multiple gifts at home vs. Pitt in Jan '06.



Does every game have to be perfect? he makes plays when it matters.


Outside of the '06 AFC Championship, the '06 SD game and the FOUR Super Bowls Brady has played in the rest of his postseason games have been played in cold weather Cities in January.

If you don't think playing AT LEAST 8 reg season games a year in domes and playing 3 warm weather road games inside the Colts div doesn't help a QB than you are more clueless than you let on.

Who cares about QBR? You do realize what the QBR is, right? I watched that 2002 game against the Raiders. You say Brady "led his team to a FG" and the win. He moved the ball close enough for AV to kick a 45yrd FG in a snow storm. Brady played like **** and his team, especially AV, picked up his slack.

You keep repeating yourself but yet you don't bother to read my posts where I debunk every one of your OPINIONS with FACTS.

Manning will retire and be mentioned in the same sentence as the UNitas', Graham's, Marino's and Montana's.

Brady will retire and be another Aikmen. All but forgotten except by Pat's fans.

 

[MarinePhinFan]

Kryptonite fact for the Brady lovers:

When Brady fails to lead the Pats to 25 points the Pats still win 82% of the time. When Manning fails to lead the Colts to 25 points, they win only 22% of the time.


I mean, it has to be kryptonite, right? They ignore it and refuse to respond to it.

 

[Tom Bündchen]

Kryptonite fact for the Brady lovers:

When Brady fails to lead the Pats to 25 points the Pats still win 82% of the time. When Manning fails to lead the Colts to 25 points, they win only 22% of the time.


I mean, it has to be kryptonite, right? They ignore it and refuse to respond to it.

I could care less about Brady vs Manning debates, really. But what does that stat tell us? That Brady has a better defense, I think we get it. Does that automatically make Manning better? It doesn't.

 

[MarinePhinFan]

I could care less about Brady vs Manning debates, really. But what does that stat tell us? That Brady has a better defense, I think we get it. Does that automatically make Manning better? It doesn't.

You're right.

Manning's ability to out do Brady in every single measurable stat with less help proves that Manning is better.

Manning, who was able to win a Super Bowl with the 23rd ranked defense in the league while Brady can't win more than 10 games when his defense is ranked lower than 6th proves Manning is better.


All things even, coaches, players etc...I choose P. Manning every time in every situation over Tom Brady.

P. Manning = Unitas

T. Brady = Aikmen

 

[nyjunc]

Who cares about QBR? You do realize what the QBR is, right? I watched that 2002 game against the Raiders. You say Brady "led his team to a FG" and the win. He moved the ball close enough for AV to kick a 45yrd FG in a snow storm. Brady played like **** and his team, especially AV, picked up his slack.

You keep repeating yourself but yet you don't bother to read my posts where I debunk every one of your OPINIONS with FACTS.

Manning will retire and be mentioned in the same sentence as the UNitas', Graham's, Marino's and Montana's.

Brady will retire and be another Aikmen. All but forgotten except by Pat's fans.

Yes he played like Sh$t by leading his team in a snowstorm, in his 1st playoff game to the game tying and GW FGs.


When you debunk any of my argument I'll let you know, as of now you are too focused on meaningless fantasy #s.

Brady is already in the same sentence w/ the Montana's, Graham's, Unitas' and Marino's. Peyton has a long way to go, he can start by doing something this January. All he needes is to not choke like usual and he'll rapidly climb the charts.

You're right.

Manning's ability to out do Brady in every single measurable stat with less help proves that Manning is better.

Manning, who was able to win a Super Bowl with the 23rd ranked defense in the league while Brady can't win more than 10 games when his defense is ranked lower than 6th proves Manning is better.


All things even, coaches, players etc...I choose P. Manning every time in every situation over Tom Brady.

P. Manning = Unitas

T. Brady = Aikmen

In the REGULAR SEASON playing AT LEAST half his games in dome and very rarely playing in the elements along w/ having superior offensive weapons for 90% of their careers. Manning is a better reg season QB, Brady is a better postseason QB- which is more important?

 

[MarinePhinFan]

Yes he played like Sh$t by leading his team in a snowstorm, in his 1st playoff game to the game tying and GW FGs.


When you debunk any of my argument I'll let you know, as of now you are too focused on meaningless fantasy #s.

Brady is already in the same sentence w/ the Montana's, Graham's, Unitas' and Marino's. Peyton has a long way to go, he can start by doing something this January. All he needes is to not choke like usual and he'll rapidly climb the charts.



In the REGULAR SEASON playing AT LEAST half his games in dome and very rarely playing in the elements along w/ having superior offensive weapons for 90% of their careers. Manning is a better reg season QB, Brady is a better postseason QB- which is more important?

You can stop with the "fantasy numbers" bull. I've never played fantasy football.

You act like Brady has outplayed Manning in the post season. That is provably false. I have shown you ALL the numbers and stats that prove that statement to be false.

The Colts have played more poorly than the Pats in the post season, but Manning and Brady are pretty much even.

Once more, and I'll expect you to keep ignoring it:

When Brady fails to lead the Pats to 25 points the Pats still win 82% of the time. When Manning fails to lead the Colts to 25 points, they win only 22% of the time.


These are post season numbers. Do you know what it shows? It shows that Manning is ALWAYS under more pressure to score. It shows that Brady has had a great defense to rely on.

Also, here are some interesting stats. A certain site that I go to has compiled career stats of nearly every QB that has ever played in the NFL and compared them to each other.

For Manning's career so far he compares to these QB's: Unitas, Young, Montana, Marino, Ken Anderson, Fouts, Staubach <<< ALL legends of the game


For Brady's career so far he compares to these QB's: Trent Green, Bert Jones, Jess Garcia, Theismann, Esiason, Culpepper, Hasselbeck<<<< NONE legends of the game

 

[nyjunc]

You can stop with the "fantasy numbers" bull. I've never played fantasy football.

You act like Brady has outplayed Manning in the post season. That is provably false. I have shown you ALL the numbers and stats that prove that statement to be false.

The Colts have played more poorly than the Pats in the post season, but Manning and Brady are pretty much even.

Once more, and I'll expect you to keep ignoring it:

When Brady fails to lead the Pats to 25 points the Pats still win 82% of the time. When Manning fails to lead the Colts to 25 points, they win only 22% of the time.


These are post season numbers. Do you know what it shows? It shows that Manning is ALWAYS under more pressure to score. It shows that Brady has had a great defense to rely on.

Also, here are some interesting stats. A certain site that I go to has compiled career stats of nearly every QB that has ever played in the NFL and compared them to each other.

For Manning's career so far he compares to these QB's: Unitas, Young, Montana, Marino, Ken Anderson, Fouts, Staubach <<< ALL legends of the game


For Brady's career so far he compares to these QB's: Trent Green, Bert Jones, Jess Garcia, Theismann, Esiason, Culpepper, Hasselbeck<<<< NONE legends of the game

You have nothing. You arguments are weak. What does that meaningless 25 point stat tell us? B/c Manning ran up the score against Denver this proves something?

In postseason Manning has led his O to 25 or more points just FOUR times in 15 games.

In postseason Brady has led his O to 25 or more points 5 times in 17 games.



If you think Brady compares to those guys you know less about football than you let on and that's saying something.

 

[MarinePhinFan]

You have nothing. You arguments are weak. What does that meaningless 25 point stat tell us? B/c Manning ran up the score against Denver this proves something?

In postseason Manning has led his O to 25 or more points just FOUR times in 15 games.

In postseason Brady has led his O to 25 or more points 5 times in 17 games.



If you think Brady compares to those guys you know less about football than you let on and that's saying something.

You're too stupid to understand simple math. What does ONE game in Denver have to do with what I posted? NOTHING, that's what.

How is 4 times in 15 tries any worse than 5 times in 17 tries?

The difference, my mentally challenged friend, is that when the Colts FAIL to get 25 points they lose 88% of the time. However, when the Pats FAIL to get 25 points they lose on 18% of the time.

Do you understand that? Do you understand the significance?


And Brady DOES compare to those QB's. At least his individual stats do. And that is how you determine individual greatness. Individual stats. Not team accomplishments.

Manning > Brady

 

[nyjunc]

You're too stupid to understand simple math. What does ONE game in Denver have to do with what I posted? NOTHING, that's what.

How is 4 times in 15 tries any worse than 5 times in 17 tries?

The difference, my mentally challenged friend, is that when the Colts FAIL to get 25 points they lose 88% of the time. However, when the Pats FAIL to get 25 points they lose on 18% of the time.

Do you understand that? Do you understand the significance?


And Brady DOES compare to those QB's. At least his individual stats do. And that is how you determine individual greatness. Individual stats. Not team accomplishments.

Manning > Brady

The Den example was brought up b/c he has twice led Indy to blowouts of Denver.


Indy is supposed to be the offensive juggernaut led by the great Peyton Manning, why does Brady have a higher % of leading his O to 25+ pts than the great Peyton? By the way, pre Moss and Welker he led his O to 25 or more pts 4 times in 13 games.



That stat is meaningless, it's not like Indy is losing games 38-34. he leads his O's to LESS than 14 PPG in playoff losses, only ONE time has he led his O to more tha 20 points in a playoff loss so you can try to manipulate the #s all you want but those if us that understand the game know better.



"And Brady DOES compare to those QB's. At least his individual stats do. And that is how you determine individual greatness. "

this explains why you think Manning is better- just b/c of fantasy stats. The game is about more than meaningless individual #s espeically when Peyton plays more than half his games in domes. It doesn't impress me that he dominates the Texans, what he is judged on is how he does when it matters and he doesn't do well when it matters.

Brady is top 5 all time, manning cracks the top 20. Both great, just different levels of greatness. Peyton has time to catch him but he better get started soon.

 

[MarinePhinFan]

The Den example was brought up b/c he has twice led Indy to blowouts of Denver.


Indy is supposed to be the offensive juggernaut led by the great Peyton Manning, why does Brady have a higher % of leading his O to 25+ pts than the great Peyton? By the way, pre Moss and Welker he led his O to 25 or more pts 4 times in 13 games.



That stat is meaningless, it's not like Indy is losing games 38-34. he leads his O's to LESS than 14 PPG in playoff losses, only ONE time has he led his O to more tha 20 points in a playoff loss so you can try to manipulate the #s all you want but those if us that understand the game know better.



"And Brady DOES compare to those QB's. At least his individual stats do. And that is how you determine individual greatness. "

this explains why you think Manning is better- just b/c of fantasy stats. The game is about more than meaningless individual #s espeically when Peyton plays more than half his games in domes. It doesn't impress me that he dominates the Texans, what he is judged on is how he does when it matters and he doesn't do well when it matters.

Brady is top 5 all time, manning cracks the top 20. Both great, just different levels of greatness. Peyton has time to catch him but he better get started soon.

You're cherry picking, again.

When you take into consideration ALL of their stats both are pretty much even in the post season. However, when you dig a little deeper you find that in order for Manning to have those same numbers he has had to play under more pressure. Your "dome" suppositions are ridiculous and I blew those out of the water a few posts back.


It's not "fantasy", son. You keep saying that. These stats and facts are REAL LIFE and not derived from fantasy. They are objective and true.

Your bromance with Tom Brady is, however, fantasy. Your man-love for Brady clouds your reasoning and makes you look stupid. I have used nothing in my debates that can't be measured and all you do is sit there and drool over your life-size Tom Brady blow-up doll.

I guess I shouldn't expect more from a Jests fan.

 

[nyjunc]

You're cherry picking, again.

When you take into consideration ALL of their stats both are pretty much even in the post season. However, when you dig a little deeper you find that in order for Manning to have those same numbers he has had to play under more pressure. Your "dome" suppositions are ridiculous and I blew those out of the water a few posts back.


It's not "fantasy", son. You keep saying that. These stats and facts are REAL LIFE and not derived from fantasy. They are objective and true.

Your bromance with Tom Brady is, however, fantasy. Your man-love for Brady clouds your reasoning and makes you look stupid. I have used nothing in my debates that can't be measured and all you do is sit there and drool over your life-size Tom Brady blow-up doll.

I guess I shouldn't expect more from a Jests fan.

You are funny man. I took you seriously and debated w/ you for a while but why? You are just trying to get me going, I'm sorry I didn't see it earlier. There's just no way possible an intelligent football fan can present an argument as weak as you presented.