Comment By Sirspud On Thill.... (when Thill Has Time) | Page 2 | FinHeaven - Miami Dolphins Forums

Comment By Sirspud On Thill.... (when Thill Has Time)

Well, we almost made it a day of happiness. :)

I think we all agree RT is very accurate when given time. And has grown immensely over the years.

Which brings me to my point, if you live in the statistical age and have undeniable evidence that your Franchise QB is one of the most accurate QBs in the league with protection and decent time to throw.... Then why have you blatantly disregarded providing him ample protection to give him and your team almost predictable success?

Why have you almost openly stated you do not value the interior OL, had to be gifted a true Franchiee LT and chronically buy retreads and aging vets to fill the ranks of the OL to protect your most important asset?

For those who hate on RT, if you were the coach and realized RT gives you the best chance for success in your coaching tenure, wouldn't you spend the draft picks and FA money to make sure he has a chance to succeed?

Then why haven't we?

It is blatant arrogance by our coaches and FO that have led the fans to this meaningless debate.

It is a failure of leadership.

Pure and simple. And the fans are left to blame RT in moments other coaches would find ways to help him succeed; our coaches find ways to force him to fail.

It's leadership that is to blame.
 
phinfan40353 said:
Well, we almost made it a day of happiness. :)

I think we all agree RT is very accurate when given time. And has grown immensely over the years.

Which brings me to my point, if you live in the statistical age and have undeniable evidence that your Franchise QB is one of the most accurate QBs in the league with protection and decent time to throw.... Then why have you blatantly disregarded providing him ample protection to give him and your team almost predictable success?

Why have you almost openly stated you do not value the interior OL, had to be gifted a true Franchiee LT and chronically buy retreads and aging vets to fill the ranks of the OL to protect your most important asset?

For those who hate on RT, if you were the coach and realized RT gives you the best chance for success in your coaching tenure, wouldn't you spend the draft picks and FA money to make sure he has a chance to succeed?

Then why haven't we?

It is blatant arrogance by our coaches and FO that have led the fans to this meaningless debate.

It is a failure of leadership.

Pure and simple. And the fans are left to blame RT in moments other coaches would find ways to help him succeed; our coaches find ways to force him to fail.

It's leadership that is to blame.
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Yup, looks like someone finally figured out they better get players to protect Luck also.. cause they were doing the same thing to him.

Most QB’s obviously can perform when protected, all the majority of the pro-Ryan people wanted was at least a decent OL (average) to give Ryan a decent opportunity to succeed.

That NE team had the better QB, better TE, better WR and better OL yesterday and still Ryan had them in position to win that game before the 2 plays by Stills (besides the miracle play at the end).

Another thing about Ryan’s pocket presence, sometimes I would like him to make more of an attempt to throw the ball and avoid getting hit (on the plays he actually has a chance on when it isin’t immediate pressure), but he doesn’t normally kill his team either but throwing 3 and 4 picks a game either like other QB’s do- when they are just ‘getting rid of it’).
 
Spiff said:
You did see the difference between the Patriots’ and Dolphins’ OL yesterday? Tom Brady had all day to throw, Ryan Tannehill was hit on every other passing attempt. Honestly, do you really think the lines were close in performance?
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Brady gets rid of the ball - often with poor throws - when he is pressured...

Brady is determined not to get hit for the most part.

Brady is comparable to Marino in terms of his pocket presence. He is elite.

Tannehill is a bumbling fool in relation to avoiding pressure- why on God’s green earth was Tannehill rolling left when he got his ankle stepped on - if he plants and explodes right he can run or throw.

He is simply awful in terms of pocket presence. It’s a prime reason the dolphins are so average.
 
Awsi Dooger said:
Offensive line play is well within league norm. Anyone who doesn't understand that is going to adjust, adjust and adjust their way to nonsense.

Just because some ranking system put us low on the list doesn't mean it is 20% below median level, or anything close to that.

Gore at age 35 would never be putting up these type of numbers if the offensive line was inept. This season Gore is averaging 4.5 yards per carry, which is above his career average and his highest number since 4.7 in the 2012 Super Bowl season with the 49ers.

That should be borderline impossible at age 35. He is not getting better or faster or quicker with age. He simply has superior blocking in front of him. The number of times we absolutely gash an opponent up the middle is incredible. Gore doesn't have to pause and weave. He explodes because the crease is obvious in front of him. The past three seasons with the Colts his rushing average never reached 4.0 -- 3.7, 3.9, 3.7 -- because that offensive line was inferior to the one the Dolphins are fielding. Gore has never been below 4.0 in his life other than all 3 seasons with the Colts.

The aggressive effective running game opens up everything else, including for Tannehill. If we were sitting there at 2nd and 10 all the time after running for no gain then Tannehill's numbers would not be what they are.
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No our tackle play is above average and interior line play is way below average and that’s a shame because guards and centers should not be that difficult to find. Also pressure up the middle kills. Most decent QB’s can move up in the pocket and negate outside speed. Nobody deals well with pressure up the middle.
 
Albert Romano said:
Yup, looks like someone finally figured out they better get players to protect Luck also.. cause they were doing the same thing to him.

Most QB’s obviously can perform when protected, all the majority of the pro-Ryan people wanted was at least a decent OL (average) to give Ryan a decent opportunity to succeed.

That NE team had the better QB, better TE, better WR and better OL yesterday and still Ryan had them in position to win that game before the 2 plays by Stills (besides the miracle play at the end).

Another thing about Ryan’s pocket presence, sometimes I would like him to make more of an attempt to throw the ball and avoid getting hit (on the plays he actually has a chance on when it isin’t immediate pressure), but he doesn’t normally kill his team either but throwing 3 and 4 picks a game either like other QB’s do- when they are just ‘getting rid of it’).
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The other thing I notice for NE, if Brady throws a somewhat catchable ball, their receivers come down with it. That is so critical for their type of offense.

With Miami, I just don’t have that confidence in our receivers
 
raving said:
why on God’s green earth was Tannehill rolling left when he got his ankle stepped on - if he plants and explodes right he can run or throw.
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Because James was being pushed back into his face on the right and the wide side of the field was on the left and there were two receivers on the left and one more crossing right to left. That's why.
 
LoneStarPhin said:
On that thread about THill toughness, Sir spud said something simple that I thought was really profound:



I think in the last couple years for sure, RT seems literally to be the best in the business when he has a comfortable pocket and time to set his feet throwing 15+ yds downfield.

It’s true if you’re any kind of Dolphin fan- you get this rush of excitement when RT drops back and launches with time because he is so dead accurate and makes good decisions on ball placement.

RT is not the elite player that will carry a team game in and game out (few are) but he really brings out the wonderment of what might have been had he been surrounded with better coaching and line play for any real duration.

I hope somewhere sometime good fortune surrounds him for at least a couple of seasons. The guy deserves it.
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While I agree with him, that Tannehill is good with a clean, unfortunately this is the NFL and its not all sunshine and rainbows in the pocket. In the NFL QBs are expected to improvise sometimes and Tannehill has no clue on how to do that when the pocket collapses. I'm not saying he needs to do something amazing everytime but I mean at least once out of 5 or 6 times , is that too much to ask for as opposed to taking sacks. I see so many other QBs bail out and pick up a few yards. Tannehill is supposed to be athletic, need to see him scramble more and move his feet more.
 
I completely agree with the statement in the OP. Given time and a clean pocket, Ryan Tannehill is one of the best decision-makers + arm talent combinations in the league.

To state it simply though, there is a hell of a lot more to quarterbacking a team than how you perform when you have time and a clean pocket, because if anybody watches any games outside of the Dolphins, it's immediately clear that having time and a clean pocket is not the norm when playing a game in the NFL.

It' just not.
 
Martel13 said:
Maybe it will click ala Rich Gannon and a few others. I’ve been as hard on him as anyone but I would love for him to prove me and the millions of other doubters wrong. Even a lot of my friends today are shooting down today’s win as a fluke etc. They aren’t my friends anymore FYI #PhinsUp
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the worm is turning
 
njFinsForever said:
The other thing I notice for NE, if Brady throws a somewhat catchable ball, their receivers come down with it. That is so critical for their type of offense.

With Miami, I just don’t have that confidence in our receivers
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They have worked together for a good while- at least Gronk and Edelman and Brady- even the announcers were stunned when Edleman dropped that one pass. That laser Brady threw was almost just out of the reach of Patterson but he hung on.
 
Blake the great said:
While I agree with him, that Tannehill is good with a clean, unfortunately this is the NFL and its not all sunshine and rainbows in the pocket. In the NFL QBs are expected to improvise sometimes and Tannehill has no clue on how to do that when the pocket collapses. I'm not saying he needs to do something amazing everytime but I mean at least once out of 5 or 6 times , is that too much to ask for as opposed to taking sacks. I see so many other QBs bail out and pick up a few yards. Tannehill is supposed to be athletic, need to see him scramble more and move his feet more.
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He was moving better just before the knee injury, I don’t know, like to see him move some more also but remember each time your risking an injury. All that running caught up to Jackson yesterday.

Working and sliding around in the pocket (when their is one) is even more crucial- most of the best QB’s seem to do that as opposed to scambling all the time.

Just give him adequate protection as most Qbs get, you cant argue that both Allen and Brady had better pass protection these last 2 games
 
Albert Romano said:
They have worked together for a good while- at least Gronk and Edelman and Brady- even the announcers were stunned when Edleman dropped that one pass. That laser Brady threw was almost just out of the reach of Patterson but he hung on.
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Yea that catch by Patterson was impressive, must be those gloves
 
O Tannehill, we stand on guard for theeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee!!!!!
 
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