Culpepper...will he return to form? | Page 7 | FinHeaven - Miami Dolphins Forums

Culpepper...will he return to form?

Dolfan984 said:
forgot to mention 607 rushing yards and 10 rushing tds

and 2001 wasn't a horrible year. wasn't a great year but far from horrible. 83 rating.....how bad can you really be?
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So lets see that makes 28 TDs total compared with 83 negative plays (a couple of fumbles may have also been included in sack total) and a 6-10 record.

Your point is his 10 rushing TDs made it a good year? Honestly, I am ok if a RB rushes for the TDs.

In 2001 he had 14 TD passes (5 rushing TD) 13 INT 33 sacks 16 fumbles 7 lost.

Your statement shows the difference between you and me. You think a QB who accounts for 19 TDs while making 62 negative plays and leading his team to a 4-7 record in the worst division in football is not a horrible year. Whereas, I think it is!
 
RenoFinFan said:
The problem I see with Daunte is that even if he gets back to his "pro bowl form" is that during his best year 2004 all he could do was lead his team to an 8-8 record in the worst division in football. The worst part being his team finished the season 3-7 (a common theme for Daunte led teams) after starting 5-1. The only team they beat with a winning record was Jacksonville at 9-7.

Keep in mind 4 of the last 6 years have been absolutely disasterous with Daunte at QB. He was also 100% healthy in 2002 when he posted these numbers:

18 TD passes 23 Interceptions 47 sacks / -244 yards, 23 fumbles 9 lost.

It is much more likely we are going to get the above numbers than his 04 numbers.
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Reno,

Are you aware that more than a Quarterback makes a team. There are 10 other men on the field on the offense, and last time I checked, Daunte did not play linebacker, safety, or defensive line. That would be like saying the loss vs. Boise State and the loss @ Fresno, @ ASU, and @ Hawaii for Nevada were all Rowe's fault, plain and simple some of the blame may have rested on his shoulders, but in particular those first few games the defense didn't show up in any aspect. So goes the defense, so goes the team in most instances.
 
2002 was a bad year. I'm not saying it wasn't. I never said that. I just said you forgot to add 10 rushing TDs, which is significant. Without those, the year looks dreadful instead of mediocre.

2001 was an okay year. Not great but not horrible. What were the defensive statistics for 2001? Sure he wasn't world beating but I can probably safely say that the defense had a big part in that 4-7 record just like it was for most of his career with Minny. Hell it's a better year than Joey is having this year :lol: also in 2001 he had NO running game.

I hope that clears it up.


edit: just looked it up. Vikings defense was 28th in the league in 2001 in the supposed worse division in football. 26th in 02.
 
In addition to that, if you look at JH's record, THIS YEAR, as a starter (might I add that he has been the slight benefactor of a very stout defense up until the JAX game and a solid running game ((minus the minni game)) is a mere 4-4 vs. the teams which he has played. Yes, I understand that Daunte was 1-3 against a weaker schedule, however, compare our running stats and sack stats (yes joey has avoided a few that an unhealthy daunte couldn't have) after the shift, and tell me that had Daunte had the same help, he could not have won those games. If you tell me "no" then you have got to be one of the most blind individuals watching games or your knowledge of football is absolutely minute.
 
Hell I'll post the defensive rankings for 2000-2004 might as well

2000: 29th ranked defense
2001: 28th ranked defense
2002: 26th ranked defense
2003: 25th ranked defense
2004: 28th ranked defense

Now you should understand why Culpepper had a bad record.
 
WPBtoRNOFinFan said:
Dolfan984.....you da man ;-)
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:hi5: I'll admit when I'm wrong, but football is such a team sport, when a guy like Fiedler has a 4th highest winning % of any active Qb (at the time...was like 2003) that tells you right there that there is a lot more to do with W's and L's than just QB play.
 
Joey 22 said:
Wasnt back then when Minny Oline was awfull? Wasnt that a year with new coach and coordinator? Wasnt that the first year without Chris Carter, Reed and Robert Smith? Dang THIS is an example of misleading stats...
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No Minnesota's OL wasn't awful.

Talk about misleading...Reed was a guy that only had 27 catches for 309 yards and 1 TD the year before, but you are passing him off like he was a major contributor.

Secondly, Robert Smith retired two years before that. Here are the stats for Minnesota's RBs for 2002:

Michael Bennet:
255 rushes 1296 yards 5.1 average 5 TDs

Doug Chapman:
12 rushes 89 yards 7.4 average

Moe Williams:
84 rushes 414 yards 4.9 average 11 TDs

Total:
351 rushes 1799 yards 5.13 average 16 TDs (not bad running behind an awful line as you indicate)
 
Lets do the Dolphins defense now for fun

2000: 6th ranked defense
2001: 5th ranked defense
2002: 3rd ranked defense
2003: 11th ranked defense (dang eagles)
2004: 8th ranked defense (in such a putrid year!)

Now tell me if Culpepper had a defense like that, that he wouldn't have a winning record.
 
Dolfan984 said:
Lets do the Dolphins defense now for fun

2000: 6th ranked defense
2001: 5th ranked defense
2002: 3rd ranked defense
2003: 11th ranked defense (dang eagles)
2004: 8th ranked defense (in such a putrid year!)

Now tell me if Culpepper had a defense like that, that he wouldn't have a winning record.
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Even Fiedler had a winning record with that so I'm inclined to agree with you on that one.
 
RenoFinFan said:
No Minnesota's OL wasn't awful.

Talk about misleading...Reed was a guy that only had 27 catches for 309 yards and 1 TD the year before, but you are passing him off like he was a major contributor.

Secondly, Robert Smith retired two years before that. Here are the stats for Minnesota's RBs for 2002:

Michael Bennet:
255 rushes 1296 yards 5.1 average 5 TDs

Doug Chapman:
12 rushes 89 yards 7.4 average

Moe Williams:
84 rushes 414 yards 4.9 average 11 TDs

Total:
351 rushes 1799 yards 5.13 average 16 TDs (not bad running behind an awful line as you indicate)
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Minny's O-line was always pretty solid until 2005. It wasn't the offense that was the problem there, it was the defense.
 
Alright since I have the stats right in front of me, I'm going to do the offenses too

Dolphins

2000: 27th
2001: 24th
2002: 15th (hello Ricky)
2003: 24th
2004: 29th

Minny

2000: 5th
2001: 12th
2002: 1st
2003: 1st
2004: 3rd
 
Dolfan984 said:
2002 was a bad year. I'm not saying it wasn't. I never said that. I just said you forgot to add 10 rushing TDs, which is significant. Without those, the year looks dreadful instead of mediocre.

2001 was an okay year. Not great but not horrible. What were the defensive statistics for 2001? Sure he wasn't world beating but I can probably safely say that the defense had a big part in that 4-7 record just like it was for most of his career with Minny. Hell it's a better year than Joey is having this year :lol: also in 2001 he had NO running game.

I hope that clears it up.


edit: just looked it up. Vikings defense was 28th in the league in 2001 in the supposed worse division in football. 26th in 02.
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can we see the lions defensive rankings from when joey was there?
 
Dolfan984 said:
So when Daunte has a bad defense (and great MVP hall of fame stats mind you) and loses it's his fault. but when joey loses with bad defense (like yesterday) it's Miami's fault and not Joey's? double standard?
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I love this. I keep having this thrown at me. I will respond to you the same way I have to others...I challenge you to find a post of mine where I am claiming that Joey did not have responsibility in Miami losing the four games he started that Miami lost. So my answer is "no" I am not using a double standard.

As for 2004. One year does not make a hof. DC had an excellent year in 2004. However, to use 2004 as a barometer for the type of QB he is is a mistake IMO. I have posted before that 2004 every QB had their stats inflated due to refs calling "no touch" that year. For example, Manning went from 29 TD passes in 2003 to 49 in 2004 to 28 in 2005...9 QBs threw for 27 or more TD passes in 2004 whereas 2 did in 2003 and 2 in 2005.

Simply put, 2004 is a terrible year to use as an example of how good a QB is bc it is very misleading. Joey Harrington's stats are a perfect example...he went from 17 TD 22 INT in 2003 to 19 TD and 12 INT in 2004 to 12 TD and 12 INT in 2005. But everyone keeps using 2004 like that is his average year. It is very misleading and a mistake to think that is representative of the QB Daunte is. Just like it is misleading to use Manning's 2004 stats to indicate how good he is.
 
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