Dansby thinks the defense can be great

[hoops]

i don't mind a guy talking when his play backs it up...sean smith shut your yap...you don't play 1/10 what your mouth puts out there...

that said this d is completely gonna revolve around what kind of help wake gets on passing downs with the pass rush...we don't have enough real playmakers in the secondary to rely on good coverage being the difference...we need quick consistent pressure...if its just wake all by himself again this secondary will get chewed up

 

[datruth55]

i don't mind a guy talking when his play backs it up...sean smith shut your yap...you don't play 1/10 what your mouth puts out there...

that said this d is completely gonna revolve around what kind of help wake gets on passing downs with the pass rush...we don't have enough real playmakers in the secondary to rely on good coverage being the difference...we need quick consistent pressure...if its just wake all by himself again this secondary will get chewed up

From the sounds of practice it seems Coyle has pressure coming from everywhere. He's had Dansby come up the middle, Safety blitzes from Reshad Jones and Jimmy Wilson in addition to Olivier Vernon and Odrick getting pressure and sacks from the front 4. Now will all this be negated when the pads come on and the O-line can actually block and lay someone out? We'll see. But from the sounds of it Coyle has pressure coming from everywhere.

 

[hoops]

From the sounds of practice it seems Coyle has pressure coming from everywhere. He's had Dansby come up the middle, Safety blitzes from Reshad Jones and Jimmy Wilson in addition to Olivier Vernon and Odrick getting pressure and sacks from the front 4. Now will all this be negated when the pads come on and the O-line can actually block and lay someone out? We'll see. But from the sounds of it Coyle has pressure coming from everywhere.

that sounds great and all and i like an attack mindset but when you bring pressure from everywhere you leave yourself with more one on one matchups and the good qbs if they see you coming will chew that stuff up...i just hope i don't see us playing so much soft coverages giving te's free releases and letting guys get into their routes unimpeded...

i still think it comes down to can our other de win his one on one pass rush matchups consistently...last year we could not...wake is gonna get a lot of attention someone else needs to step up and take off some of the heat...vernon odrick or both...someone

 

[datruth55]

that sounds great and all and i like an attack mindset but when you bring pressure from everywhere you leave yourself with more one on one matchups and the good qbs if they see you coming will chew that stuff up...i just hope i don't see us playing so much soft coverages giving te's free releases and letting guys get into their routes unimpeded...

i still think it comes down to can our other de win his one on one pass rush matchups consistently...last year we could not...wake is gonna get a lot of attention someone else needs to step up and take off some of the heat...vernon odrick or both...someone

Agree on leaving yourself open if they see it coming. They are generating turnovers though (could be more of the fact that we have so-so QBs right now until Tannehill gets used to the speed of the game) so they must be disguising their coverages well and getting pressure. Don't have to come up with a sack as long as you get consistent pressure. We'll see how it plays out. When the pads come on that's when we see who the pretenders are and who's for real on this squad.

On another note, I wonder how they're going to give 90 players enough run to see what they've got. I can see how the extra bodies will help in getting reps and practice but I'm having a hard time imagining how they're going to get 90 players play time in a pre season game...enough at least to determine if they make the team. My guess would be guys at the bottom of their position rankings won't play at all.

 

[hoops]

Agree on leaving yourself open if they see it coming. They are generating turnovers though (could be more of the fact that we have so-so QBs right now until Tannehill gets used to the speed of the game) so they must be disguising their coverages well and getting pressure. Don't have to come up with a sack as long as you get consistent pressure. We'll see how it plays out. When the pads come on that's when we see who the pretenders are and who's for real on this squad.

On another note, I wonder how they're going to give 90 players enough run to see what they've got. I can see how the extra bodies will help in getting reps and practice but I'm having a hard time imagining how they're going to get 90 players play time in a pre season game...enough at least to determine if they make the team. My guess would be guys at the bottom of their position rankings won't play at all.

i bet you right now that there's only 60 guys that are even in consideration for making this roster...they know 30 guys they could cut tomorrow and be fine...if not yet they'll know by the end of the first week of training camp 30 guys they could cut...honestly outside of what maybe 10 guys who you debate i don't see where this is that hard...they have all the tape from last year they have all the tape from the on field work thus far yeah the pads will separate guys like they always do but they know who they believe in and who has a real uphill climb to make this roster right now i'd say...only exception might be the staff for the most part is so new but the tape don't lie for the returning players especially...

 

[datruth55]

I think it's more than 60 but no more than 70 for sure. D-line and O-line would be extremely hard to judge with the work that's gone on so far...until those guys get the pads on there's no way to really tell how good or bad they are. I think there could be some real surprises on O-line and the final roster will look much different from last year on that unit. I think a couple of undrafted DBs could make this team. 2 or 3 new O-line, 2 new DBs, 2 or 3 new WRs, 1 new DE...apart from the draft picks and free agent signings...I think will all by trying to make the 53...so 7-9 undrafted or 2nd year players along with 9 rookies makes it about 70 players with a real shot IMO.

 

[tay0365]

that sounds great and all and i like an attack mindset but when you bring pressure from everywhere you leave yourself with more one on one matchups and the good qbs if they see you coming will chew that stuff up...i just hope i don't see us playing so much soft coverages giving te's free releases and letting guys get into their routes unimpeded...

i still think it comes down to can our other de win his one on one pass rush matchups consistently...last year we could not...wake is gonna get a lot of attention someone else needs to step up and take off some of the heat...vernon odrick or both...someone

I really doubt Miami is going to blitz as much as people think to get a pass-rush. Even though I don't think Olivier Vernon will be looking like a pass-rushing stud from the get go, of what I have heard about him, he very well may be a thorn quite a bit in the QB backside with the type of strength he has consistantly shown.

As far as Odrick, yes he will be huge player at DE in a 4-3, but this huge player can pass-rush. When he is at DE, I personally think he will hold his own, and when the opponant is in an obvious passing down or in 3rd down position, he will go inside, and Vernon will take over the DE position, and as most of us will find out, double team Wake, Vernon or Odrick will get it done or at worse make QBs very nervous.

 

[hoops]

I think it's more than 60 but no more than 70 for sure. D-line and O-line would be extremely hard to judge with the work that's gone on so far...until those guys get the pads on there's no way to really tell how good or bad they are. I think there could be some real surprises on O-line and the final roster will look much different from last year on that unit. I think a couple of undrafted DBs could make this team. 2 or 3 new O-line, 2 new DBs, 2 or 3 new WRs, 1 new DE...apart from the draft picks and free agent signings...I think will all by trying to make the 53...so 7-9 undrafted or 2nd year players along with 9 rookies makes it about 70 players with a real shot IMO.

meet in the middle 65 guys in play...if this staff doesn't know what they have in say a tyrone culver already after combing his tape i don't know if they ever will...its just not that hard to me

 

[datruth55]

meet in the middle 65 guys in play...if this staff doesn't know what they have in say a tyrone culver already after combing his tape i don't know if they ever will...its just not that hard to me

65 it is. Culver they know...it's Russell Anderson that has me anxious to see what he does in pads.

 

[hoops]

I really doubt Miami is going to blitz as much as people think to get a pass-rush. Even though I don't think Olivier Vernon will be looking like a pass-rushing stud from the get go, of what I have heard about him, he very well may be a thorn quite a bit in the QB backside with the type of strength he has consistantly shown.

As far as Odrick, yes he will be huge player at DE in a 4-3, but this huge player can pass-rush. When he is at DE, I personally think he will hold his own, and when the opponant is in an obvious passing down or in 3rd down position, he will go inside, and Vernon will take over the DE position, and as most of us will find out, double team Wake, Vernon or Odrick will get it done or at worse make QBs very nervous.

if you don't get pass rush with your front 4 you have to bring it other ways...ideally the front 4 provides it and we don't have to expose ourselves so much but if they don't thats when you get yourself in trouble...and exposed

i like vernon i think as a rook we can get maybe 5 sacks out of him but its more about provide pressure force the qb to have to reset his feet or leave the pocket etc and make plays tht way then just stand there and see the blitz and torch you when you go to it

 

[luduporcu]

This "D" was a lot better than some think LAST season. And I see improvement PLUS potential for even greater improvement.

I like VERNON, a lot. Admittedly, I could be wrong. And pressure is the only way to cope w/top QBs, like TOMMY BOY. (The NY GIANTS proved THAT much, TWICE!) If VERNON shows up bigtime, and ditto ODRICK, then the play of the "D" as a whole will improve tremendously. I don't care WHO your CBs are, any QB can torch ANY pair of CBs if he sits back there for a "7 Mississippi" count. And the best S's in the universe won't help much, either. Last season, it was basically WAKE and JT, w/slower-bigger "DE"s (LANGFORD and STARKS). Now, you have ODRICK, STARKS, and McDANIELS to play DT,
in a 4-3, where they MUST be considered to be FASTER than the usual DTs we see. And as to SOLIAI, he's quick and powerful, and might very well do as well/better than (e.g.) T BOWENS. Our MLB will be shielded from blocks, just like ZACK was, i/m/o.

So, who do you "double-team"? You can't double-team EVERYONE. WAKE's the logical choice. But, e.g., who handles SOLIAI "1-on-1"? Do they risk SOLIAI making a quick move and flushing the "pocket" early and often? What about a rushing OLB blitzing? What if it's MISI? Who stops his "bull rush" making a straight line to the QB? ODRICK and McDANIELS both have a little extra speed w/o sacrificing "4-3" size. And if VERNON shows something coming off the edge, then what? You can't "double-team" everyone...so name your poison, i/m/o.

We have a new DC who likes his "D" to attack. The secondary i/m/o should be improved anyway. So the opportunities should be there, and MIAMI does NOT need much else.

 

[hoops]

the oppositions gonna double wake til someone else shows them they need to pay attention elsewhere...i can promise you that much...our guys are gonna have to make believers out of the ocs and oline coaches we face before any of that changes

 

[tay0365]

if you don't get pass rush with your front 4 you have to bring it other ways...ideally the front 4 provides it and we don't have to expose ourselves so much but if they don't thats when you get yourself in trouble...and exposed

i like vernon i think as a rook we can get maybe 5 sacks out of him but its more about provide pressure force the qb to have to reset his feet or leave the pocket etc and make plays tht way then just stand there and see the blitz and torch you when you go to it

And that is why I doubt very much we will need to blitz as much as some think. Even though I don't expect many sack from vernon this year, I do expect very good push from Vernon and Odrick, with Odrick having better more refined pass-rush moves. QB will have less time to get rid of the ball then last year.

 

[hoops]

And that is why I doubt very much we will need to blitz as much as some think. Even though I don't expect many sack from vernon this year, I do expect very good push from Vernon and Odrick, with Odrick having better more refined pass-rush moves. QB will have less time to get rid of the ball then last year.

we'll see...i think odrick may wear down from all the de snaps he's gonna receive on 1st and 2nd downs and not be the same pass rusher we are hoping for but we'll see...vernon doesn't possess all that much pass rush arsenal at this stage but his strength will translate and he's got a good motor...more tools as a rusher than misi at least...

 

[tay0365]

we'll see...i think odrick may wear down from all the de snaps he's gonna receive on 1st and 2nd downs and not be the same pass rusher we are hoping for but we'll see...vernon doesn't possess all that much pass rush arsenal at this stage but his strength will translate and he's got a good motor...more tools as a rusher than misi at least...

I agree, realistically, what your saying is true, but I have watched Odrick, and the man has very good pass rush moves for a big man (He is a very good athlete for his size), add to that how powerful he can be, and I just have a feeling he will be successful, but with that much wieght (I do expect he comes down to low 290s, high 280s) he probably will start to wear down a bit.....gotta hope by then Vernon has gotten better learning the position better, and added a few finesse pass-rushing moves to to go along with his power moves. All big Ifs.