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Drew Rosenhaus Goes on Record and Says....

Originally posted by Jaj
Yes but he had crap as a line to protect him.

Still I think Griese would choke once he saw every Miami fan expecting a TD from him on his first throw. Offcourse not only a TD, but only to Chambers and it must be a bomb.

Who had a crap O-Line? Not Griese, he's had one of the BEST O-Lines in the NFL since he's been in the NFL.

The 2nd part of your post may very well be true. If he thinks he had pressure in Denver replacing a HOF QB named Elway, he's really going to have fun playing under his father's shadow, 2 titles and a perfect season, and a QB named Marino as well.

Oliver...
 
There's something to be said for a QB who has shown that he can utilize the talents that surround him and put it together into a pro bowl year.

By all means Fiedler this year had the offensive coordinator, the tight end, some talented WRs, and one HECK of a running game that scared teams sh!tless, and he didn't put it together into a pro bowl caliber year. Perhaps there's a number of things that went into that, perhaps there's reason to believe that if things were different, he could put together a good year using the talent around him. Maybe even, there's reason to think that Fiedler could have done what Griese did if the situation was the same.

Griese will not beat out Fiedler, but for one reason. Dave Wannstedt won't let him. I'm not saying either one is better. I'm not saying Griese even could win it. I'm just saying its really not possible, because DW isn't going to allow Griese the chance. Come training camp, Jay will get first team reps and Griese will not barring injury.
 
Hold on a best line? He has Salaam and Lepsis as his tackles enough said!!!!

The middle has two stars, but they are declining and the overall line is undersized and is a run above average, line below-average line. Griese or Beurlein had no time with that line.
 
Originally posted by Jaj
Hold on a best line? He has Salaam and Lepsis as his tackles enough said!!!!

The middle has two stars, but they are declining and the overall line is undersized and is a run above average, line below-average line. Griese or Beurlein had no time with that line.

I'm sorry the Broncos have one of the better O-Lines for some years now. I have no idea what you are talking about.

Oliver...
 
How can you say that. I mean just look at their tackles for God sake?!!!

How is that a good line. Two stars that keep the DT's away but the DE's run rampant on Denver QBs every game.
 
BTW there's no truth to the statement that the Denver offense ran perfectly in 2000 when Griese got injured.

Gus Frerotte stepped in for Griese and threw 59% with 238 attempts and 1776 yards, with 9 TDs and 8 INTs. His QB rating was 82. Overall the performance, forgive me for saying this, looked very Fiedler-esque. Good, but not excellent....which is what Griese's numbers were that season, excellent.

The season that Griese catches the most flack for, even by people that dont realize that they are giving him flack for this particular reason, is 2001. Cuz since his sophomore season when he was tossed into the fire to replace Elway, Griese had a 19/4 TD/INT ratio in 2000 with like 270 yards per game average. And in 2002 he had a QB rating of 85.6 which, you guessed it, is a shade higher than Fiedler's QB rating this year..

But in 2001, he had a rating of 78.5 with 23 TDs and 19 INTs but only 188 yards per game with a pretty poor 6.3 ypa. Why? I'll tell you why. Take a guess who their receivers were that season. Easy Ed McCaffrey went down right at the start, and Shanny was caught with his pants down in terms of WR depth. The WRs who attempted to replace Ed were KaRon Coleman, and Chris Cole I believe. And probably toss in one more scrubalicious guy like Scott Montgomery or John Capel or someone like that anyway. We're talking here about the reason Ashley Lelie was drafted by the Broncos in 2002.

I guess this wasn't a good year to say goodbye in the offseason to Griese's safety valve Shannon Sharpe after all.

The passing game was a mess. I remember this year well. Rod Smith was being so over-used it was ridiculous and he kept battling injuries throughout the year that limited him, or outright held him out of games. And teams knew they could basically double team Rod Smith and get away with having like half a cornerback on whatever scrub got the chance to start that particular week.

I saw their offense in operation more than a couple of times that year and let me tell you what it consisted of. Rod Smith, Rod Smith, Tight End, Tight End, Tight End. Rod Smith had a whopping 113 grabs, and folks, he's no Marvin Harrison...Desmond Clark had 51 grabs, Dwayne Carswell had 34 grabs, Patrick Hape had 15 grabs. Yes thats 100 passes to the TEs, and 113 passes to one receiver. Griese only completed 275 passes.

So its pretty obvious why his yards per game and yards per attempt were really really low that year, dragging his QB rating way down even though he had a 23/19 TD to INT ratio which is better than a lot of QBs. Oh yeah, and the running game, not hot that year...as Anderson, Gary, and TD all shared time....prompting Shanny to draft Portis. Offensive line was also not like it was in 2000.

This year? He completed 2/3rds of his passes, had over 3200 yards in 13 games, 15 TDs and 15 INTs with a 7.4 yard per attempt...his yards per game popped back up to 247 yards. Easy Ed was nothing like he was in 2000, their best TE was Dwayne Carswell, and Trey Teague was guarding Griese's blindside so well that they told him not to let the door hit him in the @ss on the way out...and then went ahead and drafted a LT in round 1 about 10 spots ahead of where everyone thought he was going to go. Beurlein by the way came in for Griese and had DECIDEDLY worst numbers.

Griese's being benched, and being kicked out of Denver, has everything to do with what his teammates and coaches think of him from off-field incidents, and very little to do with his on-field talent.

So keep this all in mind next time you want to take the easy route and say "Griese failed in Denver where he had a lot more weapons than he'll have anywhere else" Because, lets be honest now, its just not true if you really look at it.
 
My bad Trey Teague was on the team but it was Ephraim Salaam and Matt Lepsis who were the tackles.

Turnstyle tackles. Jaj is right on that one.

Denver's OL had been known as one of the best for years...before their offensive line coach guru retired. The good news for them is I believe he's un-retiring. The bad news was during his absence, in 2001 and 2002 particularly, pass blocking on that line was by no means "good"

Heck, I'd struggle to even label it "adequate"
 
U seem to have forgotten one DEnny, he said that mcgahee will be the rookie of the year. :lol: :lol:
Dont be surprised if its eddie moore in the running if he acts like al wilson or derrick brooks.:D
 
Originally posted by ckparrothead
BTW there's no truth to the statement that the Denver offense ran perfectly in 2000 when Griese got injured.

Gus Frerotte stepped in for Griese and threw 59% with 238 attempts and 1776 yards, with 9 TDs and 8 INTs. His QB rating was 82. Overall the performance, forgive me for saying this, looked very Fiedler-esque. Good, but not excellent....which is what Griese's numbers were that season, excellent.

The season that Griese catches the most flack for, even by people that dont realize that they are giving him flack for this particular reason, is 2001. Cuz since his sophomore season when he was tossed into the fire to replace Elway, Griese had a 19/4 TD/INT ratio in 2000 with like 270 yards per game average. And in 2002 he had a QB rating of 85.6 which, you guessed it, is a shade higher than Fiedler's QB rating this year..

But in 2001, he had a rating of 78.5 with 23 TDs and 19 INTs but only 188 yards per game with a pretty poor 6.3 ypa. Why? I'll tell you why. Take a guess who their receivers were that season. Easy Ed McCaffrey went down right at the start, and Shanny was caught with his pants down in terms of WR depth. The WRs who attempted to replace Ed were KaRon Coleman, and Chris Cole I believe. And probably toss in one more scrubalicious guy like Scott Montgomery or John Capel or someone like that anyway. We're talking here about the reason Ashley Lelie was drafted by the Broncos in 2002.

I guess this wasn't a good year to say goodbye in the offseason to Griese's safety valve Shannon Sharpe after all.

The passing game was a mess. I remember this year well. Rod Smith was being so over-used it was ridiculous and he kept battling injuries throughout the year that limited him, or outright held him out of games. And teams knew they could basically double team Rod Smith and get away with having like half a cornerback on whatever scrub got the chance to start that particular week.

I saw their offense in operation more than a couple of times that year and let me tell you what it consisted of. Rod Smith, Rod Smith, Tight End, Tight End, Tight End. Rod Smith had a whopping 113 grabs, and folks, he's no Marvin Harrison...Desmond Clark had 51 grabs, Dwayne Carswell had 34 grabs, Patrick Hape had 15 grabs. Yes thats 100 passes to the TEs, and 113 passes to one receiver. Griese only completed 275 passes.

So its pretty obvious why his yards per game and yards per attempt were really really low that year, dragging his QB rating way down even though he had a 23/19 TD to INT ratio which is better than a lot of QBs. Oh yeah, and the running game, not hot that year...as Anderson, Gary, and TD all shared time....prompting Shanny to draft Portis. Offensive line was also not like it was in 2000.

This year? He completed 2/3rds of his passes, had over 3200 yards in 13 games, 15 TDs and 15 INTs with a 7.4 yard per attempt...his yards per game popped back up to 247 yards. Easy Ed was nothing like he was in 2000, their best TE was Dwayne Carswell, and Trey Teague was guarding Griese's blindside so well that they told him not to let the door hit him in the @ss on the way out...and then went ahead and drafted a LT in round 1 about 10 spots ahead of where everyone thought he was going to go. Beurlein by the way came in for Griese and had DECIDEDLY worst numbers.

Griese's being benched, and being kicked out of Denver, has everything to do with what his teammates and coaches think of him from off-field incidents, and very little to do with his on-field talent.

So keep this all in mind next time you want to take the easy route and say "Griese failed in Denver where he had a lot more weapons than he'll have anywhere else" Because, lets be honest now, its just not true if you really look at it.

exactamundo CK, isnt that why they wanted the kid from arizona, so he could scrammble and get out of a sticky mess?
 
Originally posted by Oliver


I'm sorry the Broncos have one of the better O-Lines for some years now. I have no idea what you are talking about.

Oliver...

the super bowl years is when they had the best Oline. which would make alot of sense wouldnt it? Not to mention they take after their ahole coach and play dirty! they are not as good as they used to be cus the league is on to them.
 
Originally posted by ckparrothead
There's something to be said for a QB who has shown that he can utilize the talents that surround him and put it together into a pro bowl year.

By all means Fiedler this year had the offensive coordinator, the tight end, some talented WRs, and one HECK of a running game that scared teams sh!tless, and he didn't put it together into a pro bowl caliber year. Perhaps there's a number of things that went into that, perhaps there's reason to believe that if things were different, he could put together a good year using the talent around him. Maybe even, there's reason to think that Fiedler could have done what Griese did if the situation was the same.

Griese will not beat out Fiedler, but for one reason. Dave Wannstedt won't let him. I'm not saying either one is better. I'm not saying Griese even could win it. I'm just saying its really not possible, because DW isn't going to allow Griese the chance. Come training camp, Jay will get first team reps and Griese will not barring injury.

I won't argue the Griese thing, b/c it's too unpredictable at this point, but I think your comments on Fiedler are unfair. The first 5 games or so Fiedler had all the pieces, but they were just coming into play. Chambers hadn't really gotten it going, McMichael was still a rookie and, as Turner noted this week, was limited by his lack of knowledge of the playbook. There were a lot of surprises during the year (including Ricky). I don't think the coaches really knew what all they had.

Then, Fiedler got hurt - that hurt his continuity and effectiveness even when he came back. When he did come back, McMichael was starting his rookie fade, Chambers was never the same after his hit in the Denver game, and OG was gone. And, the best OL on the team was out the last two crucial games (Nails)! All those were huge factors and cannot be overlooked. When you look at the lineup that last two games, we did not have all the pieces in place on that offense. Whether Jay will be a Pro Bowl calibre QB this year or not, I don't know. The jury is still out ... but, I do think it's unfair to judge him on a year when he missed several games in mid-season and when the starting WR's were not the same at the end of the year.
 
Originally posted by Da 'Fins


I won't argue the Griese thing, b/c it's too unpredictable at this point, but I think your comments on Fiedler are unfair. The first 5 games or so Fiedler had all the pieces, but they were just coming into play. Chambers hadn't really gotten it going, McMichael was still a rookie and, as Turner noted this week, was limited by his lack of knowledge of the playbook. There were a lot of surprises during the year (including Ricky). I don't think the coaches really knew what all they had.

Then, Fiedler got hurt - that hurt his continuity and effectiveness even when he came back. When he did come back, McMichael was starting his rookie fade, Chambers was never the same after his hit in the Denver game, and OG was gone. And, the best OL on the team was out the last two crucial games (Nails)! All those were huge factors and cannot be overlooked. When you look at the lineup that last two games, we did not have all the pieces in place on that offense. Whether Jay will be a Pro Bowl calibre QB this year or not, I don't know. The jury is still out ... but, I do think it's unfair to judge him on a year when he missed several games in mid-season and when the starting WR's were not the same at the end of the year.

Griese had similar circumstances in denver, which shows the upside of us having him. this year jay has a full deck and knows the system already griese doenst know anything. if griese steps in if jay gets hurt and does something, that is when the arguement starts, but right now is a total crapshoot and the only ones who will keep this arguement going are the jay haters. jay is the winningest QB in the last three years. period. this is a team game, the backup needs to come in and do his job, not take the other guys job when he is doing good and winning games. the whole team failed due to injuries at the wrong times. that is why this draft will prove to be a good one, we will have very capable guys to backup.
 
Originally posted by PhinPhan1227



Kind of like smelling a fart? You don't want to...but for some reason you just have to....:lol:

Uhhh No. Thats just you.:lol:
 
Originally posted by Migs182005


I couldn't have said it any better myself.

You cannot expect a QB to come into a complicated system and master it so well in such a short amount of time to start over a QB that has done very well in it when he's been healthy.

But, if Fiedler gets hurt, you can sure bet Griese will step in, and I believe do a good job.

All these rumors of him going to Green Bay are bogus. He's coming down here.



The problem is that Brian Griese has played in an also complicated offensive system in Denver. He is a veteran in the league already and has played against enough defenses to know whats complicated and not. There is adjustments of course but that doesn't mean it will be complicated for Brian Griese.
 
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