Joe-28th ranked coach? | Page 4 | FinHeaven - Miami Dolphins Forums

Joe-28th ranked coach?

Hayden Fox said:
The rating fits and so does the analysis
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So he's trending up. What has he done to warrant such a positive praise for you? I believe you predicted we'd win 2 games last year so I guess that might have something to do with it.
 
roy_miami said:
First of all many QBs have broken out in year three so if we see a drastic improvement that could be part of it.

Second of all we added one of the highest priced free agents and spent our first three picks on the offensive side, unless you think the o-line is a superfluous part of the offense I don't see how you can say the offensive personnel isn't improved. I think its highly likely that if we would have just added Albert last season or drafted Lane Johnson instead of Jordan even Sherman's offense would have been good enough to get us into the playoffs.

Third of all why do you say it was Philbin's offense last year but will be Lazor's offense this year? You know we had an offensive coordinator then too right? It's either Philbin's offense the whole time or it's the coordinators offense the whole time. Obviously you're trying to be hyperbolic for effect but it really does make you Philbin bashers look silly at times. I remember people used to bash Philbin for setting himself up for failure for not being able to take control over his old boss, and it was really Sherman's team. Of course now because its convenient, the argument is Sherman was just his puppet.
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It's Philbin's team. It's Philbin's offense. It's all Philbin's staff. Lazor is going to work work with what's there. If we have two losing seasons and a late season collapse, and this year it's turned around, I think you have to attribute a lot of that to the new OC, who is helping develop the QB, bringing in some new plays, moving Wallace around, using RB's to catch more passes, and insisting on a 50/50 run pass offense.

I anticipate that as the offense succeeds, Philbin will give more autonomy to Lazor. If there isn't early success, he might start overriding his decisions like he did with Sherman.
 
roy_miami said:
So he's trending up. What has he done to warrant such a positive praise for you? I believe you predicted we'd win 2 games last year so I guess that might have something to do with it.
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In that list, Philbin is only ranked above one other coach who has been a HC in the league, all the rest are first year coaches, so they have opportunity to shoot past Philbin on such a list.

Philbin is an assistant coach miscast as a head coach, just like Sparano and Cameron. That will become obvious in due time...
 
HoneyB said:
But I think that's fair.

Other than the severe O line shakeup, the offensive roster is basically the same. It's still the Tannehill, Clay, Wallace, Hartline, Matthews and Miller show. We'll also still running basically the same scheme. So yes, this is year three in the Philibin program.

Lazor will have a huge impact because he's going to try to heavily tweak Philbin's offense to make it work, and bring in some of his own stuff. If we do see drastic improvement, then to me, that can only be attributed to Bill. Bill is inheriting an offense that scored 7 points in 8 quarters at the end of the year. That's what he's got, and if we see a turnaround we know why.
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All of the blame but none of the credit is fair?
 
rent this space said:
All of the blame but none of the credit is fair?
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He'll get his share of credit. But I'm not interested in revisionist history. He piloted a ship into the rocks. IMO, the HC deserves some credit for the overall program and for choosing a QB, but much credit has to go to the new coaches who made it work.

If things DO work out, ask yourself this question. In a couple years, will Philbin be a hot commodity around the NFL? Or more likely do you think Bill Lazor would get a ton of offers to coach on other teams?
 
Its funny how the emotions of football can make otherwise rational people become completely brain dead. The perception of Andy Dalton is he is a bad QB, the perception is he is actually worse than Jay Cutler. What is his crime? Losing playoff games. So in some peoples minds losing playoff games is actually a bigger crime than not even making it to the playoffs. That's really ****ed up when you think about it.

Whether you want to admit it or not our team improved last season. Tannehill improved. Our record improved. And we had a 60% chance at going to the playoffs week 17. That is better than the 0% chance we had in years prior. Logically speaking having a 60% chance, or any chance is still better than no chance even though it might make you feel ****tier, but some of you still act like what happened was the worst thing ever. And 60% is not a lock, not even close, even 90-95% is not a lock, sometimes you will lose even as a favorite, but if we have a 60% chance to get in every year we'll get in, exactly 60% of the time. So stop with the childish pouting.

Plus I believe Tannehill was hurt more than most seem to recall, he suffered a similar injury to Flacco and finished the season very similarly. And in that game Tannehill missed a wide open Wallace for an easy TD which would have put us up 14-3 and totally changed the dynamic of the game. Tannehill slid feet first a yard short of the first down instead of fighting for that extra yard, if you aren't fighting for one yard with everything on the line week 17 then you aren't thinking clearly. I guarantee Russell Wilson, or any decent, thinking QB would have picked up that yard. Tannehill is just as much at fault for our 8-8 record as Philbin is but I don't see many beating that drum.

Tannehill has been mediocre. Philbin has been mediocre. Those points are probably not mutually exclusive, for example Philbin trusts Tannehill to call audibles even with the game on the line, that has probably cost him wins but is it a bad coaching decision? I would say no because it will pay off in the future. They are both capable of being better, and we'll find out a lot sooner rather than later so lets just see what happens.
 
roy_miami said:
Tannehill has been mediocre. Philbin has been mediocre. Those points are probably not mutually exclusive, for example Philbin trusts Tannehill to call audibles even with the game on the line, that has probably cost him wins but is it a bad coaching decision? I would say no because it will pay off in the future. They are both capable of being better, and we'll find out a lot sooner rather than later so lets just see what happens.
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It's my understanding that all Tannehill can do is choose between a pass and run play that's been preselected for him.
 
I think people need to stop focusing on the ranking number and just realize that he has been an under-performing coach, regardless of being the 18th, 24th, or 28th worst coach. Whatever you want to rank him, he has been consistently below average.
 
HoneyB said:
He'll get his share of credit. But I'm not interested in revisionist history. He piloted a ship into the rocks. IMO, the HC deserves some credit for the overall program and for choosing a QB, but much credit has to go to the new coaches who made it work.

If things DO work out, ask yourself this question. In a couple years, will Philbin be a hot commodity around the NFL? Or more likely do you think Bill Lazor would get a ton of offers to coach on other teams?
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again, I'm not sure 8-8 is running aground.
If things work out I'm sure anyone that is part of it will be a hot commodity right or wrong.
Let me ask you- if Lazor is a hit, does Philbin get credit for hiring him?
 
I heard this morning that the late Chuck Noll only had 12 wins in his first 3 seasons as Head Coach of the Pittsburgh Steelers. But the Rooneys were smart enough to stick with him and he ended up winning 4 Super Bowls and successfully changed the team culture.
In comparison, Joe Philbin has won 15 games in the first 2 seasons and the media and half of Finheaven want his head on a plate. Let's try to be patient. I remain very optimistic for this season. I continue to see Joe as a very well organized coach who knows what he is doing. The departure of Mike Sherman was tough for him because Mike was his mentor, but it had to be done and I'm eager to see what Lazor can do to develop Tannehill.
 
roy_miami said:
So he's trending up. What has he done to warrant such a positive praise for you? I believe you predicted we'd win 2 games last year so I guess that might have something to do with it.
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I predicted 7 to 9 wins, but we have been over this like…maybe ten times...
 
spiketex said:
I heard this morning that the late Chuck Noll only had 12 wins in his first 3 seasons as Head Coach of the Pittsburgh Steelers. But the Rooneys were smart enough to stick with him and he ended up winning 4 Super Bowls and successfully changed the team culture.
In comparison, Joe Philbin has won 15 games in the first 2 seasons and the media and half of Finheaven want his head on a plate. Let's try to be patient. I remain very optimistic for this season. I continue to see Joe as a very well organized coach who knows what he is doing. The departure of Mike Sherman was tough for him because Mike was his mentor, but it had to be done and I'm eager to see what Lazor can do to develop Tannehill.
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Patience is a key alright, but it is very hard to be patient, when you see other teams turn it around, and the Dolphins remain the same no matter who coaches or GM's the team. In a round about way, I guess that proves the point of patience, change hasn't helped very much.
 
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