Martin vs. Incognito OVER... Martin vs. Philbin NEXT

[TheWalrus]

I disagree.

In my opinion, they are rallying behind Incognito because Martin "quit" on them and any support for Martin would 1) make themselves look bad(they are selling an image after all) and 2) break up the status quo. Even players in Tampa are publicly supporting Schiano, and i dont think anyone can question how messed up that team has gotten(leaking medical records is vastly worse then anything thats happened here).
Not to mention the locker room was somewhat insulated. Granted, anyone could see whats happening had they looked hard enough, but most of their time at work would have been spent with position groups. Hell, even our quarterbacks would be more focused on chemistry with receivers and less concerned about their chemistry with the line.

Undoubtedly many of these players just want to get done with the interview, cause as few waves as possible, and put it behind them. If Martin was considered aloof and socially awkward(which i actually can see), they might find it more (personally) acceptable to lay blame on him then the scumbag-but-our-scumbag Incognito.

I think you're absolutely right that the things you're mentioning are a factor here. Perhaps even bigger factors. All I'm saying is that the narrative spun by Incognito Sr also fits into the picture. Every new development that comes out I'm going to be subconsciously checking against his story, looking for definitive inconsistencies or definitive confirmations.

 

[TheWalrus]

The mental health and suicide thing doesn't sit well with me.

1) You don't put someone who is suicidal in the highest profile position on your line. If the coaches knew that, they wouldn't have put him there.

2) the source is biased and can't be trusted. It smacks of discrediting the accuser.

3) the drugs thing... they "all" do drugs. don't kid yourself. It has nothing to do with anything.

4) Philbin has a son who died. He doesn't come off as a heartless bastard. I find it absolutely impossible that he knew JM was suicidal and didn't act on it. just plain impossible.

All good points. Yet what he said still has the proverbial stink of truth to it. Who would make up the suicide angle? It's just so damn bizarre. It's not one of the first things a liar would reach for when seeking to discredit somebody.

And anyway, when you think about it, Martin being suicidal and Incognito knowing about would only make Incognito look worse in the court of public opinion, not better. "You mean you taunted a guy you knew to be depressed and suicidal?" How do you answer that question?

---------- Post added at 01:06 AM ---------- Previous post was at 01:05 AM ----------

If Richie Sr who was ahead of the reporters in awareness of his son's suspension and referenced the machinations of "Zuckerman" who at that point none of us knew to be Martin's agent is also correct about his suicidal tendencies and 3 attempts, occasional gun to head posturing, and drug abuse - then the Dolphins may well have been facilitating much more than a "hostile work environment."

**little regard for own life + gun availability +drugs + rage & revenge = "Potentially Dangerously Violent Work Environment" (aka potential to "Go Postal")**

If that's the case then if management was well aware of a potential ticking time bomb, if they didn't intervene then they essentially were placing his co-workers (ironically including Richie) in harms way.

I agree completely. And not only that, it makes just about everyone in the organization a liar, since they've been claiming ignorance on Martin's issues all along.

 

[laxcoach]

And anyway, when you think about it, Martin being suicidal and Incognito knowing about would only make Incognito look worse in the court of public opinion, not better. "You mean you taunted a guy you knew to be depressed?" How do you answer that question.

I will play. The only thing that makes sense, beyond it being true, is
that cogs is trying to paint JM as nuts. He is nuts to the point of being unreliable and a liar, based on depressive interpretations of normal events.

To be clear, I'm not saying I believe that.

 

[TheWalrus]

I will play. The only thing that makes sense, beyond it being true, is
that cogs is trying to paint JM as nuts. He is nuts to the point of being unreliable and a liar, based on depressive interpretations of normal events.

To be clear, I'm not saying I believe that.

Possibly. I've just checked my screenshots of idrd1994's posts and he made no reference to Martin's mental state before this issue began to blow up. However, the bulk of his posts were after Monday.

 

[cullenbigcstill]

I wonder if Pouncey delivered the gun to Martin?

 

[FinsBR]

Lebatard had a good take on the Martin - Phinbin thing.
If Martin went to the coach to complain about Cogs harassment, what would be Philbin's response? Martin was already considered soft, Philbin would shrug if of as if "Ok Martin, what did they do? Took your lunch money?"
IMO, on that environment, if he wasn't presented with evidence there was nothing he could or would do.

 

[TheWalrus]

Lebatard had a good take on the Martin - Phinbin thing.
If Martin went to the coach to complain about Cogs harassment, what would be Philbin's response? Martin was already considered soft, Philbin would shrug if of as if "Ok Martin, what did they do? Took your lunch money?"
IMO, on that environment, if he wasn't presented with evidence there was nothing he could or would do.

It's possible. But if he's right then Philbin just got up lied his ass off in that press conference yesterday by claiming he knew nothing about Incognito harassing Martin until Sunday morning. Philbin locked himself into a specific timeline. And not by accident. The Dolphins are bracing for a workplace harassment lawsuit and need to be able to prove they had no knowledge any of this was going on, since clearly they did nothing to stop it.

 

[TheWalrus]

Apparently the Dolphins have decided to put Martin on the Non-Football Injury list and go after half a million dollars of his signing bonus.

It's officially war between the Dolphins and Martin, as I predicted it would be. What did Martin say and when? What can he prove?

It's a mistake by the Dolphins, imo. We'll see what Martin can prove but I think the Dolphins knew at least about some of this stuff and it will come out that they did. And as soon as that comes out they'll be liars and lose the public debate. They better be very sure they have their ducks all in a row to make this kind of move. The money they have to gain is relatively small potatoes.

FWIW I think it will be revealed that Dawn Aponte was the "mastermind" behind this move. She enjoys playing hardball over relatively small amounts of money (see: Tannehill rookie contract).

CORRECTION: I posted this following a report I saw somewhere else that Adam Abramson of the PBP post had reported this. Now Abramson is reporting that there are "conflicting reports" about this situation. I will update as appropriate.

 

[scodoublet]

Right...dangerous or smart for Miami (Philbin) to paint themselves into a specific timeline. It was no accident, for sure, so they must be pretty confident Martin either didn't, or can not prove he ever addressed anything with Philbin.
Now, if he addressed it with Turner and Turner never notified Philbin and if Martin can prove he told Turner, does he have a case against Miami, or just Turner?
What about his union rep? If he can prove he told them and they did nothing, who does he sue? The NFLPA? How does that work?

 

[TheWalrus]

And now Abramson is reporting the Dolphins have decided to NOT put Martin on the NFI. Says that since it's a new designation, there was a lot of confusion about whether Martin would be paid under the designation and what the other implications are. Dolphins also thought there was a deadline today to do it when apparently there wasn't.

Smart move, imo. I don't think the Martins are going to stand for the Dolphins a) trying to recoup money, or b) making any move publicly that indicates this situation is Martin's fault (which placing him on the NFI versus, say, injured reserve, would do).

It's been my guess that the Dolphins will eventually take this stance. Their public comments to this point indicate that. We'll see how it unfolds. For the next few days at least I think we'll see each side leak their "evidence" to the media to see what each side has about what Martin said and when and to who.

 

[J. David Wannyheimer]

Apparently NFI is a week to week thing, and they can still place him on it later. He will just be paid for week 10 now. Or that's how I understand it, after reading up on it.