My thoughts on the Joel Collier hiring.... | Page 6 | FinHeaven - Miami Dolphins Forums

My thoughts on the Joel Collier hiring....

I don't know this is just an opinion: I like to think positive which I am most of the time an I am not downing there decision because I don't know nothing about Collier. But with Collier there I believe Wanny will make more calls on offense which will be worse on the team.
 
Originally posted by jmp310
If you want to keep the same system, fine, but not when your offense has been lackluster for several years.
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I think you're discouting one large factor here: the decreasing talent level.

Yes, we added Ricky and Randy. But the OL got older....and older....and suffered injuries.

To this point, we have yet to infuse any young or better talent. I love Wade Smith. And Seth, Whitley, and Yates might bring good things. But the fact is that it was known that they weren't ready. And yet we stood pat.

The #2 receiver position continued to regress. We have Chambers and a bunch of #3's. They gave it a shot and it didn't work out. But that doesn't change the fact that the position also is in dire need.

And lets not forget about our QB situation. Honestly, Jay Fiedler is not the QB to run a vertical offense. And he was never an above average QB anyway. So that's also a position of dire need.

So to sum up, we have an OL that is in dire need, a WR corps in dire need, and a pretty inept starting QB.

I dont't know about you. But from where I'm standing, SCHEME is the least of our worries.
 
I couldn't agree with very much of jmp310 comments...

I don't think it's a fact commonly accepted that a number of HC's could have got 10-6 out of this side (I read recently an article which says Wanny excelled to chieve 10-6). Wanny is a good, albeit conservative, coach. He competes pretty well with one of the acknowledged geniuses (Bellicheck) twice a year and wasn't responsible for either loss this term.

This Collier move is not an obvious one to those of us on the outside. But seems to me from the press conference that it has been in the works for some time. It was known when Turner was hired that he'd go back to HC somewhere else sooner or later. It looks as though Wanny had been making plans for just that event and had this guy groomed so he'd be ready.

I would say though, that continuity of the offense we have seen is not a recipe for success. This offense needs an overhaul as Muck says. The line, receivers and QB have not played at the level required by Wanny's philosophy. It allows for few, if any, mistakes - we've been plagued by penalties on the line, drops by receivers and int's from a risk taker at QB who doesn't have the quality to take the risks (and who says of himself that he won't stop taking those risks). I'm hoping the brain trust can soon explain how they plan to change all this.
 
I'm sure they have at least a rough plan that will be based around FA/draft. I don't expect to see it before those happen though.
 
Originally posted by Trekbiz


Well, I don't agree with you there.
I am optimistic that Collier can get it done.
I have to be.
To point out the fact that the "Win now" Fins organization just put it's entire offense into the hands of an unknown commodity is not being negative, it's facing facts.

You can be optimistic while also looking objectively at both sides of a situation.
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very advantageous. the Unknown that is..:evil:
 
There's no question that the offense needs a major overhaul. As I've said before, I think there needs to be a couple contracts freed up on defense(Madison, Marion, possibly Ogun) to ensure enough to get Brunell and Orlando Pace or Walter Jones, plus drafting a WR in the 1st round.
However, I don't really see the moves made to be any more convincing that there will be major changes made on offense, including at QB. I know that Collier, Speilman, and even Wannstedt have indicated that there needs to be more production from everyone, but I'll believe it when I see it.
 
Originally posted by jmp310
...to get Brunell and Orlando Pace or Walter Jones...
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Why would we spend millions on a Left Tackle if we signed Brunell? Shouldn't we be more concerned about Right Tackle?
 
Originally posted by jmp310
There's no question that the offense needs a major overhaul. As I've said before, I think there needs to be a couple contracts freed up on defense(Madison, Marion, possibly Ogun) to ensure enough to get Brunell and Orlando Pace or Walter Jones, plus drafting a WR in the 1st round.
However, I don't really see the moves made to be any more convincing that there will be major changes made on offense, including at QB. I know that Collier, Speilman, and even Wannstedt have indicated that there needs to be more production from everyone, but I'll believe it when I see it.
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You haven't seen any moves made to be more convincing because we can't sign FAs and draft picks yet.

And there's PLENTY of pointers out there that the QB position specifically will be upgraded.
 
LT is the most important position on the O-Line, b/c a majority of the premire pass rushers line up on the weak side against the LT(Kearse, Freeney, Peppers as examples). While I think Wade Smith is going to be a good OL, I still don't he belongs at the most important position on the O-Line yet, which is why I'd like to see Pace or Jones come here, and the coaches move Smith to RT.
Also, my comments about the moves were directed at the continued faith in Jay Fiedler at QB, primarily. I believe they will draft a QB in the 1st round, or target someone in FA. But I'm not ready to believe Fiedler won't be the starter until they get someone who will unseat him.
 
Originally posted by jmp310
LT is the most important position on the O-Line, b/c a majority of the premire pass rushers line up on the weak side against the LT(Kearse, Freeney, Peppers as examples). While I think Wade Smith is going to be a good OL, I still don't he belongs at the most important position on the O-Line yet, which is why I'd like to see Pace or Jones come here, and the coaches move Smith to RT.
Also, my comments about the moves were directed at the continued faith in Jay Fiedler at QB, primarily. I believe they will draft a QB in the 1st round, or target someone in FA. But I'm not ready to believe Fiedler won't be the starter until they get someone who will unseat him.
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If Brunell is the QB, you need your best tackle on his blind side. You should know that. And furthermore, Wade Smith does not have the size to play on the strong side. He's a Left Tackle. His strength is his footwork and athleticism...not power.

With a lefty at QB, he needs to know that his blindside is protected.

By the way, PEPPERS is a Left Defensive End...Smith held his own against KEARSE (did better than Todd Wade), and Freeney is going to be a problem to any QB that takes a 7 step drop without double team help.
 
Originally posted by PhinstiGator

Smith held his own against KEARSE (did better than Todd Wade), p.
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Frankly, I have no idea which game you were watching. Kearse was dominating Wade Smith at the line throughout most of the first half. The only reason he was shut down was b/c Wannstedt put Randy McMichael as an exclusive blocker on the weak side and the two double-teamed Kearse, which was a stupid move to take out your 2nd best pass option(Donald Lee and 2 TE sets would have been better) but at least neutralized Kearse.

And while your point about Brunell is valid(yes, I do know he's a lefty...dont think you are the only person on the planet that knows football), but most of the premire pass rushers line up at right DE, which is where I think you need a better LT than Wade Smith. Perhaps they should explore moving him to guard. I know it's a different position, but as legendary UM O-Line coach Art Kehoe said, the combination and versatility is more important than the position.
 
Originally posted by jmp310
Frankly, I have no idea which game you were watching. Kearse was dominating Wade Smith at the line throughout most of the first half. The only reason he was shut down was b/c Wannstedt put Randy McMichael as an exclusive blocker on the weak side and the two double-teamed Kearse, which was a stupid move to take out your 2nd best pass option(Donald Lee and 2 TE sets would have been better) but at least neutralized Kearse.
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Like I said before, no one is going to dominate a speed rusher such as Freeney, Kearse, Jason Taylor...if the QB does not step up in the pocket. If you watch the only sack that Kearse gets, Griese is set up 9 yards behind the line of scrimmage. If he steps up a fires the ball within the alotted time...sacks/fumbles don't happen. The exact thing happened with Freeney. It was interesting to hear Freeney make comments before the Patriots game...that it is very difficult to get pressure on the QB when he takes a short drop and gets rid of the ball in a timely fashion. Obviously, we didn't do that. If the QB steps up in the pocket like most of the productive ones do...the LT is able to simply push the outside speed rusher harmlessly beyond the pocket. We see that happen to Jason Taylor ALL THE TIME. Many times he so close to getting the sack...yet so very far away because his momentum is carrying him beyond the pocket.

And while your point about Brunell is valid(yes, I do know he's a lefty...dont think you are the only person on the planet that knows football), but most of the premire pass rushers line up at right DE, which is where I think you need a better LT than Wade Smith. Perhaps they should explore moving him to guard. I know it's a different position, but as legendary UM O-Line coach Art Kehoe said, the combination and versatility is more important than the position.
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Many premiere pass rushers switch sides throughout the game (Jason Taylor, John Abraham). The QB gets sacked from the blind side because he does not see it coming and cannot perceive the pressure. Hence, the blind side blocker becomes the valued commodity.

You are questioning Wade Smith's ability at LT. Certainly, he needs more experience and needs more upper body power. But the thing that makes him a great prospect is his athleticism and ability of move. He had two or three bad games. He also had some very good games. He did very well against John Abraham. Again, if the QB would have been better at setting up, stepping up, and firing the ball within a timely matter...we would not have had the kind of problems that we had from the pressure on both tackle spots. McNair excelled in stepping up and creating more time to deliver the ball. Our QB's were injured....immobile and slow of foot.
 
Every one of my responses to the original post has been covered (the need to keep a consistent game plan, the desire to win now, Collier's 10 years of coaching experience, etc) except one:

I would question making one of the criteria for a good offensive coordinator:"Someone who can take over when the head coach gets fired." I'm surprised no one else jumped on this.
 
In hiring new OC J. Collier, Dave just may have saved his career....

OC J. Collier is by no means a "yes man". He will run this offense the way he wants it, and from what I've gathered on him thus far, he sounds like a great addition....

He's a fesh, intelligent offensive mind, who's been inside the Phinz organization since 1998. He's been surrounded by football his entire life. This guy lives and breaths football...

He's determined, and his new ideas are something this offense needs. I think he'll do a great job, and I'm excited about the change....

Besides, how great of an OC was N. Turner??...I wasn't nearly as impressed as I thought I would be with him. This is a good change IMO....:

PHINZ RULE!!!:pirate:
 
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