official 2012 combine discussion thread... | Page 13 | FinHeaven - Miami Dolphins Forums

official 2012 combine discussion thread...

Well, Alonzo Spellman is bipolar. I don't think there's been any indication of that kind of severe personality disorder in Quinton Coples. I hear that accusation about Coples making a "business decision" trying not to get hurt his senior season. I think it's typical of the kind of total horse sh-t you see thrown around this time of year that is based on next to nothing.

I never saw why people say that Michael Brockers is going to tear up the running drills at the Combine. I see a slow guy on the field, personally. Moves well laterally, interesting strength, but not a fantastic athlete. You ask me Quinton Coples or Michael Brockers ON THE FIELD, and it's Quinton Coples, all day, every day.

If you take a Jake Bequette hoping to get a Quinton Coples, be prepared to be disappointed.

Jarron Gilbert is a fair concern with Coples. But there were some differences. Coples did it more consistently against much better competition than Gilbert, and he also moved from tackle to end whereas Gilbert moved from end to tackle. If you're considering both guys as ends, then you prefer the guy that moved from tackle to end, as his most recent experience is where you want him.

Incidentally I think Dontari Poe just showed everyone why I've had him mocked to the Panthers at #8 or #9 overall for months. An unofficial 4.87 in the 40 at like 347 lbs or whatever he weighs. He also did 44 bench reps. When you watch him on tape, he has highly, highly unusual get-off at that size. They'd put him at Defensive End and he'd get off the ball better than guys 100 lbs lighter, and I'm not just talking about 1st and 2nd step, I'm talking 3rd and 4th steps as well, bending the arc like a 260 lbs outside pass rusher at 350 lbs. We went gaga when Glenn Dorsey showed that ability as a 300 lbs guy. This is a 350 lbs guy. As Simon said in our recent Draft Winds (he was paraphrasing from something I said to him), Poe went to the carpet a bit because he doesn't use his hands right yet and could get off balance, but in his defense he gets off the carpet like a man 100 lbs lighter.
 
Last edited by a moderator:
Jacksonville is considered the most likely team to take Coples, but I'm just not seeing it. You look at Gene Smith's history, and he likes hard workers and small school types. The negatives on Coples are overblown, but he just doesn't strike me as a Jacksonville kind of guy. Add that to a coaching staff was specifically brought in to fix Gabbert (and a GM looking to justify that pick to his new owner), and I think there's a very real chance that Coples is there when we pick.

CK makes a good comparison between JPP and Coples, especially with hindsight being 20-20 on JPP, who was considered a lazy and stupid athletic freak who only got like 5 sacks his last year in college against mediocre competition and didn't test to expectations at the combine. I don't think Coples is quite the freak that JPP is athletically. His arms are shorter, he doesn't move as explosively (at least to me). But even something of a poor man's JPP is good value at #8.

Plus, I trust Kacy Rodgers in this kind of deal. You see what he did with Soliai, who's as freakish an athlete as anyone in the NFL for his size but was probably even a worse case than JPP from a mentality standpoint, and you extrapolate that on to Coples? Man, you could really have something there.
 
TheWalrus said:
Jacksonville is considered the most likely team to take Coples, but I'm just not seeing it. You look at Gene Smith's history, and he likes hard workers and small school types. The negatives on Coples are overblown, but he just doesn't strike me as a Jacksonville kind of guy. Add that to a coaching staff was specifically brought in to fix Gabbert (and a GM looking to justify that pick to his new owner), and I think there's a very real chance that Coples is there when we pick.

CK makes a good comparison between JPP and Coples, especially with hindsight being 20-20 on JPP, who was considered a lazy and stupid athletic freak who only got like 5 sacks his last year in college against mediocre competition and didn't test to expectations at the combine. I don't think Coples is quite the freak that JPP is athletically. His arms are shorter, he doesn't move as explosively (at least to me). But even something of a poor man's JPP is good value at #8.

Plus, I trust Kacy Rodgers in this kind of deal. You see what he did with Soliai, who's as freakish an athlete as anyone in the NFL for his size but was probably even a worse case than JPP from a mentality standpoint, and you extrapolate that on to Coples? Man, you could really have something there.
Click to expand...

I think the reality is that Coples is more of a power player than Pierre-Paul, and will be better against the run. I don't know that it's fair to call him a "poor man's JPP"...because it really implies that there's no chance he'll be as good or better than JPP. That MAY be the case, I don't know...but it's not something we should conclude right now.
 
ckparrothead said:
I think the reality is that Coples is more of a power player than Pierre-Paul, and will be better against the run. I don't know that it's fair to call him a "poor man's JPP"...because it really implies that there's no chance he'll be as good or better than JPP. That MAY be the case, I don't know...but it's not something we should conclude right now.
Click to expand...

Sounds like a perfect fit for a position we have no one to fill right now in LDE.
 
TheWalrus said:
Sounds like a perfect fit for a position we have no one to fill right now in LDE.
Click to expand...

Absolutely.

Problem is I think Luke Kuechly is as freakish a player as Coples, but with better mental characteristics, and he could be a very high impact defensive LEADER and ICON for like 10 or 12 years. Really tough call there. Can never have too many guys that can rush the passer and it's a need, but Kuechly might be the better player. Best player versus need. It'll get you every time.
 
ckparrothead said:
Absolutely.

Problem is I think Luke Kuechly is as freakish a player as Coples, but with better mental characteristics, and he could be a very high impact defensive LEADER and ICON for like 10 or 12 years. Really tough call there. Can never have too many guys that can rush the passer and it's a need, but Kuechly might be the better player. Best player versus need. It'll get you every time.
Click to expand...

If we resign Langford and have a 4-3 D-line that's Langford/Starks/Odrick/Wake I definitelly wouldn't mind Kuechly at 8. His ability to diagnose the play presnap and instincts afterwards remind me alot of ZT. Kuechly paired with Burnett at WOLB, Dansby at SOLB and the forementioned D line would give us an amazing front 7.
 
mnphinfan said:
If we resign Langford and have a 4-3 D-line that's Langford/Starks/Odrick/Wake I definitelly wouldn't mind Kuechly at 8. His ability to diagnose the play presnap and instincts afterwards remind me alot of ZT. Kuechly paired with Burnett at WOLB, Dansby at SOLB and the forementioned D line would give us an amazing front 7.
Click to expand...

Kuechly is not short like ZT. He reminds more of a John Offerdahl. I would take that type of leadership and instincts any day
 
jlfin said:
Kuechly is not short like ZT. He reminds more of a John Offerdahl. I would take that type of leadership and instincts any day
Click to expand...

It's his presnap diagnosis of the play and instincts to flow to the ball after the snap which remind me of ZT, not his size. I guess I should have been more clear on that, but ya Offerdahl much more in his stature.
 
If you draft Keuchly then you're left with three linebackers who can play all three downs in a league where you only need two. In general I think it's important in the draft to avoid operating like a plumber -- plugging holes -- instead of a talent acquirerer. Over time you end up with a bunch of good players who get booted from the playoffs early instead of a core of superstars who can make runs at a Super Bowl.

But with that being said, you bring in Kuechly then who's leaving the field in nickel packages? We're not in a position like the Patrick Willis one where your star middle linebacker is nearing the end (and I don't think people are saying Kuechly is another Willis, anyway). It's an important consideration, especially when you might be in position of deciding between a guy like Kuechly and a guy like Coples, who plays a position of need and one of more import than MLB.
 
rrrrphin said:
Kuechly ran an unofficial 4.50 forty..... in the play @ #8????
Click to expand...

He was before he ran that 40 time. He posted a 10'8" broad jump which is among the best in the Combine regardless of position, and 38 inch vertical which is also among the best in the Combine regardless of position.

IMO, you can get all three linebackers a whole lot of snaps in nickel. It's not that difficult, especially because Karlos Dansy is so big and versatile.
 
ckparrothead said:
He was before he ran that 40 time. He posted a 10'8" broad jump which is among the best in the Combine regardless of position, and 38 inch vertical which is also among the best in the Combine regardless of position.

IMO, you can get all three linebackers a whole lot of snaps in nickel. It's not that difficult, especially because Karlos Dansy is so big and versatile.
Click to expand...

I think Kuechly and Kendricks both provide something we don't have and I would take either of them, of course Kendricks in the 2nd-3rd round though.
 
TheWalrus said:
If you draft Keuchly then you're left with three linebackers who can play all three downs in a league where you only need two. In general I think it's important in the draft to avoid operating like a plumber -- plugging holes -- instead of a talent acquirerer. Over time you end up with a bunch of good players who get booted from the playoffs early instead of a core of superstars who can make runs at a Super Bowl.

But with that being said, you bring in Kuechly then who's leaving the field in nickel packages? We're not in a position like the Patrick Willis one where your star middle linebacker is nearing the end (and I don't think people are saying Kuechly is another Willis, anyway). It's an important consideration, especially when you might be in position of deciding between a guy like Kuechly and a guy like Coples, who plays a position of need and one of more import than MLB.
Click to expand...

We don't really HAVE a star middle linebacker. We haven't since Zach was here. Karlos Dansby is not that player. He's a big, fast and versatile player capable of making big plays, but he made his bones as an OUTSIDE linebacker in Arizona. He's a coverage guy, a blitz guy, makes plays that way. He's also what, 31 or 32 years old? This off season if he were a real leader like you'd expect Kuechly to be, he wouldn't have shown up something like 20 or 30 lbs overweight, having to play his way into shape to where the defense sucked for the first half of the year. And if he were the player we thought, we wouldn't have so obviously missed Channing Crowder's football IQ for most of the season. These are the things you'd be getting in Luke Kuechly.

You JUST got done saying if you keep drafting for need and not best player, you end up with an underachieving team. Dansby is 31 or 32 years old, regardless of what his pay is, he's got his strengths and weaknesses. He's not going to be around forever.

And Burnett is like 30 years old, on the 2nd year of a 4 year deal.

Even so, I'm having a tough time seeing why we can't get all three players on the field a significant number of snaps. Didn't Kevin Coyle in his interviews just get done saying that in today's league, your nickel defense is fast becoming your base defense? With Karlos Dansby's prowess as a blitzer, why can't we utilize a 3-3-5 defense on nickel downs, with our fourth rusher coming from any number of directions, be it a defensive back, Dansby, Burnett, Kuechly, etc?
 
I'd be more comfortable with Malik Jackson in the 2nd or 3rd round than I would Coples in the top 10. There's things about Coples that I like, but also things that I question. Too many questions to take him in the top 10 when I think I can get a virtual clone of him with less question marks later.

Nick Perry is the guy who's going to give left tackles fits in the NFL with his lower body explosion and pass rush ability. He's my top rated 4-3 defensive end.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top Bottom