Oh my GOD!!! Is Tony Wise ACTUALLY this clueless?

[DOLFANMIKE]

Originally posted by BSQX4
DolFan Mike, I just went through the same thing with you. People have the right to give their opinion about the Coaching staff. So you 're the defender of the Coaching staff because you Coach Highschool. How many SuperBowl Rings do you have? That's what you asked me. I can't believe you say the same thing to everyone. You're a broken record. People are entitled to their opinions without you jumping in and questioning their credentials. Get a new act. Man are you a monumental freaking bore.

Great. I'm a bore (sure you didn't mean my posts are boring? Don't wanna violate TOS now do you?) and your posts are ignorant. Your posts are ignorant in that you are uninformed son.
I say the same thing to everyone that's a FINGER POINTER. You complain about my repeatitive support for our coaches but don't mind the repeatitive insulting of our staff. I guess the difference is they agree with you.

I have 20 years of Coaching and some players playing on Sunday that played for me. Add all of that up and I still can't tell you everything thats wrong with the Fins, but I can tell you what you are full of son.

 

[DOLFANMIKE]

Originally posted by dolfan4good
Well MIKE, if the problem is individual players making mental and physical mistakes over and over.... then IMO it STILL falls on WANNY. He is responsible for their play. He needs to get rid of them, bench them, reem them up and down... whatever it takes to get the point across that mistakes are NOT tolerable!!!!

If it is the entire team making these mistakes then it STILL falls on Wanny. He obviuosly does not prepare them well enough or has OVER estimated their talent.

Either way, the buck stops at the HC.

I agree....so where should they start? Or where should they have started?

 

[DOLFANMIKE]

Originally posted by Sal Lisitano
Mike...explain to me what you are seeing on the field that i'm not seeing.

the main thing i see is a coach who shows no confindence and is a mess on the sidelines...that rubs off to the players which equals a lack of confindence...hey, how the hell are you suppossed to win with no confindence??? explain coach MIKE.

what comments am i making Mike...that wanny needs to go. that wade smith was left one on one!!! he was, i watched the game yesterday and wade smithwas left 1 on 1 at times and that's when his man got to the QB to cause a turnover.

it falls on the shoulders of the coach...wanny has had his chance in chicago and miami...he needs to go...what i'm seeing on the field is an underachieving team...who do you blame MIKE??? Explain that coach!!!

...............................................
Sal:
Mike...explain to me what you are seeing on the field that i'm not seeing.

the main thing i see is a coach who shows no confindence and is a mess on the sidelines...that rubs off to the players which equals a lack of confindence...hey, how the hell are you suppossed to win with no confindence??? explain coach MIKE.

D-Mike:
How is it that Wanny is "showing no confidence on the sideline?" Is he grabbing his hair? Or it he grabbing his face? Seriously, would you rather see him pose for the camera like Gruden does?
So Pro coaches are responsible for the confidence of their players? What should Wanny do in your opinion to show more confidence. I have no idea what you are seeing here so I have no way to tell you what I think he needs to do.

....................................................
Sal:
what comments am i making Mike...that wanny needs to go. that wade smith was left one on one!!! he was, i watched the game yesterday and wade smithwas left 1 on 1 at times and that's when his man got to the QB to cause a turnover.

D-Mike:
Ok. I have no problems with Wanny going. Personally I could care less. But you are mistaken if you think his leaving will be a cure-all.
So you watched the game and LT wade Smith was left 1 on 1 "at times". So you are saying then that the coaching error was to not ever leave Wade Smith in a 1 on 1 situation. That would severly hamper our playcalling choices and ability to send backs out. Other fans on the board are saying just the opposite, that we need "more variety" than what we are already doing. Part of having a wider play selection is occasionally leaving an OL one on one with a defender.

The other thing I don't think you have thought out is the fact that occasionally a player may be taken out of a double team by a stunt or line slant. That is what happened on the sack that was nearly a safety on Griese. Just the fact that so many of you that are posting your breakdowns don't get that simple fact shows me where some of you are. So the Dolphins don't want to leave Wade Smith in a 1 on 1 situation. Well guess what Sal, the Titans most likely have about 50 ways to make just that happen with certain fronts, movement, blitzes, slants, or formations. It is safe to say that if a Defense wants to force a 1 on 1 it is one of the easiest things in a scheme to do......unless the Offense is willing to check off the play at the LOS all the time (which we do not do) or unless the Offense is willing to play very conservative and go max blocking. Even then in either scenerio there is no certainty of a double team.
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Sal:

it falls on the shoulders of the coach...wanny has had his chance in chicago and miami...he needs to go...what i'm seeing on the field is an underachieving team...who do you blame MIKE??? Explain that coach!!!

D-Mike:

I agree that ultimately it is the HC job to ensure a quality product, and that isnt happening right now. However, the Dolphins have underachieved under our last 3 Head Coaches. Not just Wanny.
As for who do I blame - I don't Blame anyone. I don't FINGER POINT.
I see the WR's dropping several balls each week that should be caught.
I see the players not protecting the ball (Fumbles and INT)
I see the OL not blocking
I see the defense not tackling
I see the secondary blowing coverage
I see the coaches not getting the job done, regardless of the formentioned problems from our players.
I see the fans being spoiled and negative too often

Players are paid to play, coaches are paid to coach. Fans are Fans, not players and NOT coaches.

 

[NCFINFAN38]

Well this seems to be jump on mike night so I thought I would jump in also. My point is simply this, if we are not supposed to voice our opinion then why don't you tell us OL GREAT ONE. Why is it a team with all this talent can't catch a team playing with backups?? Tell us ol great one, if not the coaching then what?? Is it Aliens putting curses on us or what??
And Oh yeah, before you ask for my creds. YES I have them. I am a 11 time Madden tourney CHAMPION. That blows you little CIF crap out of the water. lol

 

[DOLFANMIKE]

Originally posted by NCFINFAN38
Well this seems to be jump on mike night so I thought I would jump in also. My point is simply this, if we are not supposed to voice our opinion then why don't you tell us OL GREAT ONE. Why is it a team with all this talent can't catch a team playing with backups?? Tell us ol great one, if not the coaching then what?? Is it Aliens putting curses on us or what??
And Oh yeah, before you ask for my creds. YES I have them. I am a 11 time Madden tourney CHAMPION. That blows you little CIF crap out of the water. lol

I'm not "OL GREAT ONE", it's more like old smelly one.

I think the problem is that in today's society there are far too many people willing to discredit others without really knowing what's going on. That is exactly whats going on in finheaven right now with all these attacks on our coaches, players,etc.

You can slam me all you want for saying the things I'm saying here....I'm all good with that. I'll tell you this though, there is ALOT more that goes into coaching and team than many of you seem to understand.

But the fact is alot of people are way out of there league when they start blaming the coaches for all of our problems. Are they blameless....heck no. But they are quality people, and there has been alot of personal insulting going on, people making absurd comments that are just FINGER POINTING. It's the kind of stuff Jets fans do.

 

[PhinPhan1227]

Originally posted by Muck
What do you expect him to say?? "Our young guys suck. Hey, hope they aren't reading this."

Cmon. Stop reading so much into what a position coach says about young players to the media.

Come on Muck...there's "keeping up the teams spirit", and then there's just being inane!! We've got a player who is NOT getting the job done, and nobody behind him is even good enough to TRY to replace him. There's being positive, and then there's blowing smoke up everyones rear end!!!

 

[PhinPhan1227]

Re: Re: Re: Re: Better be careful of what you say

Originally posted by DOLFANMIKE

WRONG. You are much less knowledgable about the NFL when it comes to schemes and coaching. Wanny and his staff have made this their career, not a weekend hobby. You are a fan, and they are a professionals.

Obviously you have no training at all or you would understand how foolish that comment is.......if you doubt me take some time this offseason to attend a local football clinic taught by the pro's. You will understand after 1 day how little about the game you really understand.

One of the things I enjoy about my job is that I get to learn about some of the things we see going on in our games on Sunday. I promise you this much, if you did attend start attending clinics you'd have a whole new appreciation for our staff. Even if you did still want them to get the boot.

Coaching is just like most other things in life, the more you do it the more you learn, and all the other things like understanding Team, players, etc all are other aspects of coaching that put the whole package together.

There isn't a single reason the Dolphins are struggling right now IMO. It's not just the coaches or just the players.

Ok...so it's not just the coaches, or the players. Just out of curiosity, what's left? Are the cheerleaders not cheering right? Is the grass being mown improperly at Joe Robbie? Are the iniforms too tight? Maybe the equipment guy isn't buying the right shoes? The bottom line is that this team has MAJOR personel issues, and that's Wanny's fault. The O-line is at the major site of those issues, and while Tony Wise can only coach the players he's provided, I as a fan don't want to hear him saying we're "great" when opposing D's go into EVERY game secure in the knowledge that...

1) They WILL get to the QB early and often, and from his blind side.

2) One of the best RB's in the NFL will be hit before he reahces the LOS every time.

I'm not going to rip Wise for his game planning, but by GOD he's earned himself a ripping for a comment THAT stupid!!!

 

[BSQX4]

Mike, good point on the fact that The D can dictate one on one situations. I assume you mean by example that if Konrads assignment is to help chip on Smiths guy, that assignment is superceeded if there is a blitz that he must address. That leaves Smith one on one. I'm sure as you say there are many different ways the D can do this to an Offense. I must admit you have great patience in answering questions point by point and I do admit that you know more than I do regarding line slants, stunts etc. Having said that anyone can see Wannstedt demeaner on the sidelines is not something that inspires confidence. I don't want him to mug for the camera ala Gruden, I don't expect the stoisism of Tom Landry but it does look like he's coming apart at the seams. This year its been quite evident, more than last year and prior years. It's like the job is getting to him. You say that the Coaches are not getting the job done and in everybodys own way that's what they are saying also. Some criticisms are more personal, maybe too much so, but people are pissed at this team. The line was Titans minus 5. It was going to be a good, tough, close matchup and we got steamrolled. This D got hammered. Titans hit on I think 71 % of their passes, they hit bombs, TOP was onesided. The D is not doing what the Ravens did on their Superbowl run and that's kind of what was expected, where the dollars went. I didn't see quality tackling at all, Madison had one great hit, but not too much else. The Titans O-Line pushed us around all day, very alarming. Let's hope we rebound vs. the Ravens. I'll try to stop FINGER POINTING! By the way, so far there is no betting line on the game.

 

[PhinPhan1227]

Originally posted by DOLFANMIKE


I'm not "OL GREAT ONE", it's more like old smelly one.

I think the problem is that in today's society there are far too many people willing to discredit others without really knowing what's going on. That is exactly whats going on in finheaven right now with all these attacks on our coaches, players,etc.

You can slam me all you want for saying the things I'm saying here....I'm all good with that. I'll tell you this though, there is ALOT more that goes into coaching and team than many of you seem to understand.

But the fact is alot of people are way out of there league when they start blaming the coaches for all of our problems. Are they blameless....heck no. But they are quality people, and there has been alot of personal insulting going on, people making absurd comments that are just FINGER POINTING. It's the kind of stuff Jets fans do.

The issue isn't whether anyone here is a better coach than Dave or Tony. The issue is whether anyone in the NFL who is available is a better coach than Dave or Tony. And the REAL bottom line here Mike is that you, myself, and the rest of the fans PAY for this team. It belongs to us. We BUY the right to criticize when we see something we don't like. Guess what? Wayne Huizinga SURE as heck isn't a better coach than Dave Wannstadt, but maybe you think he doesn't deserve to complain either?

 

[DOLFANMIKE]

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Better be careful of what you say

Originally posted by PhinPhan1227


Ok...so it's not just the coaches, or the players. Just out of curiosity, what's left? Are the cheerleaders not cheering right? Is the grass being mown improperly at Joe Robbie? Are the iniforms too tight? Maybe the equipment guy isn't buying the right shoes? The bottom line is that this team has MAJOR personel issues, and that's Wanny's fault. The O-line is at the major site of those issues, and while Tony Wise can only coach the players he's provided, I as a fan don't want to hear him saying we're "great" when opposing D's go into EVERY game secure in the knowledge that...

1) They WILL get to the QB early and often, and from his blind side.

2) One of the best RB's in the NFL will be hit before he reahces the LOS every time.

I'm not going to rip Wise for his game planning, but by GOD he's earned himself a ripping for a comment THAT stupid!!!

I think the players are more to blame than the coaches for our poor play. Missed tackles, missed blocks, dropped passes are what are costing us games right now more than leadership issues, , scheming, etc...IMO.
In other words, I see our players in position to make plays, but they fail to make the plays. This doesn't mean I think the coaches are blameless, because ultimately they are responsible for the team's production.

I don't pretend to have all the answers to our poor play. But I do know it's not just the coaches.

 

[DOLFANMIKE]

Originally posted by BSQX4
Mike, good point on the fact that The D can dictate one on one situations. I assume you mean by example that if Konrads assignment is to help chip on Smiths guy, that assignment is superceeded if there is a blitz that he must address. That leaves Smith one on one. I'm sure as you say there are many different ways the D can do this to an Offense. I must admit you have great patience in answering questions point by point and I do admit that you know more than I do regarding line slants, stunts etc. Having said that anyone can see Wannstedt demeaner on the sidelines is not something that inspires confidence. I don't want him to mug for the camera ala Gruden, I don't expect the stoisism of Tom Landry but it does look like he's coming apart at the seams. This year its been quite evident, more than last year and prior years. It's like the job is getting to him. You say that the Coaches are not getting the job done and in everybodys own way that's what they are saying also. Some criticisms are more personal, maybe too much so, but people are pissed at this team. The line was Titans minus 5. It was going to be a good, tough, close matchup and we got steamrolled. This D got hammered. Titans hit on I think 71 % of their passes, they hit bombs, TOP was onesided. The D is not doing what the Ravens did on their Superbowl run and that's kind of what was expected, where the dollars went. I didn't see quality tackling at all, Madison had one great hit, but not too much else. The Titans O-Line pushed us around all day, very alarming. Let's hope we rebound vs. the Ravens. I'll try to stop FINGER POINTING! By the way, so far there is no betting line on the game.

LOL....

It's funny how the more we talk, the more we are in agreement on whats going on. Although my reaction was strong in regard to defending the staff, believe me I see things too that make me wonder. Dave's sideline behavior doesn't effect me one bit. Frankly, if the players are standing aroundwaiting on his facial expressions to motive them, or for him to yell to motivate them, we have bigger problems than Dave. Remember, these guys are supposed to be PRO's. They get paid Millions of dollars to play a game you and I would play for free. They shouldn't need anymore motivation than that. While you and I go to work everyday, they go watch film, and get coached like our old High School days. Only they have no classes to attend, nothing but Sony Playstaion and football practice for these guys (for the most part).
When I see players Blocking, tackling, and catching passes they should catch then I'll start to look at the coaches with a little more critical focus, but I really do believe the players are the ones screwing the pooch right now. Wanny is such an easy target....and for that alone he may need to go. Lets face it, Following up Shula and JJ isn't exactly an easy task. Wanny might not be a bright enough star to handle it. But I want to see our players doing the basics before I light my torch and chase Wanny and Company.

Thanks for being willing to work through the rough edges in our different perspectives, I'm aware that I can tend to be "overly loyal" in situations like these.


Favortie Quote from Woody Hayes at a Clinic some time ago:
Never let the Booster club take control. Don't take extra money, don't let them think they can help you play call, don't spend any extra time around those folks. If they try to give you a new car don't take it, because if you do and things get tough, they will also give you the gas to drive out of town when they fire your butt!

 

[DOLFANMIKE]

Originally posted by PhinPhan1227


The issue isn't whether anyone here is a better coach than Dave or Tony. The issue is whether anyone in the NFL who is available is a better coach than Dave or Tony. And the REAL bottom line here Mike is that you, myself, and the rest of the fans PAY for this team. It belongs to us. We BUY the right to criticize when we see something we don't like. Guess what? Wayne Huizinga SURE as heck isn't a better coach than Dave Wannstadt, but maybe you think he doesn't deserve to complain either?

Anyone has the right to complain. However, complaining isn't the same as FINGER POINTING. For example, I could FINGER POINT at you and say you are the reason Miami's play sucks. I could blame you for every poor coaching decision, every dropped pass, every missed tackle, every missed block. All are your fault.
Now, I just Finger POINTED, not complained. See the difference. That is what people are doing to the Coaching staff.

My perspective is that it is just as much the players fault, if not more than the coaches. This thread and others I've responded too Targeted just the coaches, and had some personal attacks on our coaches. I don't buy it and i'm complaning about it.That is the difference between FINGER POINTING and complaining.

I've challenged people's football background because they are saying our coaches can't coach. They are making statements related to play they see on the field. Making statements like "we leave him one on one" or "we don't make adjustments". As an educated football man of 20 plus years, I see a clear error in those comments. I understand what's going on and see that their words don't hold merit. Offense can't always guaruntee a double team. I know this for a fact. I can and have explained why. I also see our coaches making adjustments.
So board members say our coaches can't coach. I don't buy it. Moreover, I doubt many people on this board are qualified to make that assessment as fans. Sorry, but I have too much respect for the profession to buy into the common fan being close to our staff in football know-how. As a coach myself, I've spent a long time growing in my profession, and as a fan like yourself, I can assure you if you aren't coaching, aren't going to professional coaching clinics, you don't know much. Period. I'm also aware that isn't a popular thing to say. But it's true nonetheless.

I have that right......right?

 

[dolfan06]

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Better be careful of what you say

Originally posted by DOLFANMIKE


I think the players are more to blame than the coaches for our poor play.

to a point, but if you take some of the calls bates has come up with, it makes me wonder.

you can't play prevent defense then have the middle liebacker blitz. that leaves the middle wide open. haven't seen it this year but there were three or four games he did that in last year, one was the final pats game and the other was the kc game. i forget the other 2. but we got burned everytime in the kc game!

 

[BSQX4]

I'll tell everybody one fact:If #21 is on the field we're in deep shi*!!

 

[mf52dolphin]

Well the absolute worst decision made by Wanny was dumping Paul Boudreau as the offensive line coach, and bringing in his buddy, Tony Wise to replace him. This move also led to the worst personel move of Wanny's tenue by cutting the excellent guard Kevin Donnalley, and bringing in the inadequate Todd Perry. Sure there may have been a salary cap issue involved, but Wise liked his guy Perry better.
Boudreau was very good at his job. I believehe the one responsible for making Mark Dixon a good player. Also, Boudreau's line allowed Lamar Smith to become a 1,000 yard rusher, which really was an accomplishment.
I have not been impressed with Wise during his entire Dolphin tenure. Also if truly believes that Todd Perry is a better player than Kevin Donnalley, then he has no business being on an NFL coaching staff.
Also somehow Wanny can survive the season, he must make a change in the offensive line coaching posistion.