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Ricky vs john riggins

Monk

I always agreed w/ that until recently I had a debate about Steev Largent compared to Art Monk and looking up Monk's #s he was a compiler not a great WR.

-Monk was only a 3 time Pro Bowler

-Monk led the league in recs once, was top 3 3 times, top 10 a 4th time

-Monk was top 10 in rec yards just 3 times

-Monk was top 10 in rec TDs ONCE(tied for 9th in '91)

-monk's YPC was 13.5

-Monk had 68 TDs in 16 seasons


When undeserving players like Lynn Swann are in then I think Art belongs but the Hall should be reserved for the greatest of all-time and I don't think Art belongs in that group.

Pro bowls are hardly a gauge of how good a player is. We all know how much BS is involved, it's more of a popularity contest. BTW/ Riggo only went to ONE Pro Bowl, should he not be in the hall?

-Monk led the league in recs once, was top 3 3 times, top 10 a 4th time
Yeah, and that time that he led the league in catches he caught 106, the first guy ever to catch 100 or more in a season, he broke a 20+ year record and his number stood for 10 years before Rice broke it with 112. 106 catches in 1984 is like 150 today.
-Monk was top 10 in rec TDs ONCE(tied for 9th in '91)

That's because Gibbs Redskins were a running team in the redzone. Year in a year out we led the league in rushing TD's. Why throw when you can pound it in with Riggins, George Rogers, and Gerald Riggs? Monk was also a great blocker and was used in that capacity a lot.

Look at the Redskins RB TD totals year by year:

1983: Riggins had 24 TD's. Reggie Evans 4, and Nick Giaquinto 1. That's a total of 29. For comparison, the Dolphins in 1983 only scored 14 TD's on the ground and the 1983 Seahawks with Largent who scored 11 times, only scored 16 rushing TD's.

1984: Riggins had 14, Otis Wonsley 4, and Joe Washington 1. That's 19. The Seahawks had only 7 rushing TD's that year, Largent scored 12 times.

1985: Riggins 8, George Rogers 7, and Keith Griffin 3. That's 18. The Seahawks only had 8 scores on the ground that year.

1986: George Rogers scored 18 rushing TD's and Kelvin Bryant 4. That's 22. In that same year the Niners scored only 14 times on the ground and Rice had 15 TD catches. The Seahawks had 14 total on the ground too, and Largent caught 9.

That's all the #'s I'm gonna go through now, but I think my point is beyond clear. Gibbs was a run first guy in the redzone, and for good reason. Don't penalize Monk bc/ he was surrounded by excellent backs who could pound it in.
-monk's YPC was 13.5

And? It takes 10 yards to get a first down. That's what he was, a first down machine. He was unstoppable at what he did. On 3rd and 8 the D knew the ball was going Monk's way, but there was nothing they could do. I'd give my left nut to have a guy like him on the Redskins now, you can have the speedsters like Coles who fail to hold on to the ball going across the middle on 3rd down.

BTW/ Cris Carter averaged 12.6 per catch, should he not be in the HOF?

Bottom line, Monk set records for catches in season, career catches (BTW/ every guy who has ever held this record is in the HOF), and consecutive games with a catch (consistency counts for something, right?)

Let me offer you some quotes:

http://www.thehogs.net/History/ArtMonk/

Joe Gibbs, HOF inductee

"He was big, he was strong, and he was intelligent. He had everything."

"I can't see how a receiver could be more valuable to a team."

Charlie Casserly

"There was never a classier player in this franchise's history, or in league history, than Art Monk. You always knew the team would be getting Art Monk's best effort day in and day out."

Bill Parcells, 1995

"Monk is headed to Canton downhill on roller skates"

Joe Theismann

"Art was Jerry Rice before Jerry Rice was."

Ronnie Lott, HOF inductee

"Art Monk was an example for Jerry Rice. That's what Jerry always told me."

"There's nothing negative to say. He has the numbers, the catches, the championships."

"You have a Hall of Fame for all it represents. I know he represents all that it's about. Integrity, love and passion for the game, community, what he gave back. Look how he conducted himself. Nobody I know deserves it more."

Thomas Loverro, Washington Times

"He embodied the old school, and for that alone he should be enshrined so that when a father takes his son through the Hall of Fame, he can say, "Son, here is a man who once caught 106 passes in a season when no one was catching 100 passes. Here was a man who caught a pass in 183 straight games. And not once did he ever pull a cell phone out to make a call after any of those catches."

Bill Polian, President Indianapolis Colts

"I believe he's a Hall of Famer. I was a pro scout when he was playing, so it was my job to know who those guys were. I would put Art in that category, but apparently there are a lot of Hall of Fame voters who don't feel Art Monk was in that category. It's hard for me to believe they ever saw him play."

And from Redskins.com: From Gibbs...

http://www.redskins.com/news/newsDetail.jsp?id=5759

"What has hurt Art--and I believe should actually boost his credentials--is that we asked him to block a lot," Gibbs said. "He was the inside portion of pass protection and we put him in instead of a big tight end or running back. He was a very tough, physical, big guy."

"Because Art was an inside receiver, he caught a lot of balls inside," head coach Joe Gibbs said. "So almost everything he caught was inside, where he would take some hard hits. I think that should go to his credit, but what some [Hall of Fame voters] do is downplay it because his average-per-catch wasn't as high."

There's some more stuff I'll post if I can find it, basically showing how much of a leader he was. Monk meant more to the Redskins then numbers can show.
 
Oh yeah, all the stats can be confirmed at Profootballreference.com
 
dolfan2010 said:
WOw why dont you so called dolphins fans out there think of redskins RB John Riggins. He had a great come back w/ the skins after a yr lay off!!!!!GET REAL!!!!!BE A REAL FAN AND SUPPORT RICKY LIKE OUR COACH SAYS!!!!!!DO YOU REMEMBER THE SUPER BOWL RUN AGAINST US?:goof:
riggins did'nt lose a ton of wieght smoke a zip(oz.) a day or shave off his dreads did he? I will always support the phins win or lose but I'll never tolerate disloyalty,greed,selfishness or gangster mentality's.
 
nyjunc said:
I always agreed w/ that until recently I had a debate about Steev Largent compared to Art Monk and looking up Monk's #s he was a compiler not a great WR.

-Monk was only a 3 time Pro Bowler

-Monk led the league in recs once, was top 3 3 times, top 10 a 4th time

-Monk was top 10 in rec yards just 3 times

-Monk was top 10 in rec TDs ONCE(tied for 9th in '91)

-monk's YPC was 13.5

-Monk had 68 TDs in 16 seasons


When undeserving players like Lynn Swann are in then I think Art belongs but the Hall should be reserved for the greatest of all-time and I don't think Art belongs in that group.
Monk should be in the hall.#'s dont always tell the story.Did u ever see him play nyjunc?
 
fish fan 4 life said:
Monk should be in the hall.#'s dont always tell the story.Did u ever see him play nyjunc?
That's exactly right! Monk was the man, and he is getting hosed by not being in the Hall. Hopefully he will be taken care of, and get in there. It was great to see Monk play.
 
nyjunc said:
Talent wise Ricky is better, production wise it's not even close Riggins easily wins that one.
Ricky has talent, but he can't keep his head on straight! Riggins was the better running back by far. Ricky isn't even in the same league as Riggins.
 
bryan allen said:
Alot of NFL players take years off due to injury. Its a non issue IMO

I think he can get physically into shape and the trainers and dietician will/are helping. Plus, he will be fesh which helps offset rust.

The biggest question is did he come back dedicated to football or dedicated to erasing the $8+million debt to the fins?
 
dolphan north said:
I think he can get physically into shape and the trainers and dietician will/are helping. Plus, he will be fesh which helps offset rust.

The biggest question is did he come back dedicated to football or dedicated to erasing the $8+million debt to the fins?
The second part.
 
Pro bowls are hardly a gauge of how good a player is. We all know how much BS is involved, it's more of a popularity contest. BTW/ Riggo only went to ONE Pro Bowl, should he not be in the hall?

I agree w/ that but you would think a player as popular as Monk was would have made more than 3.

Yeah, and that time that he led the league in catches he caught 106, the first guy ever to catch 100 or more in a season, he broke a 20+ year record and his number stood for 10 years before Rice broke it with 112. 106 catches in 1984 is like 150 today.

He did have only 7 TDs and averaged less than 13 yds a rec.

That's all the #'s I'm gonna go through now, but I think my point is beyond clear. Gibbs was a run first guy in the redzone, and for good reason. Don't penalize Monk bc/ he was surrounded by excellent backs who could pound it in.

So b/c they were a running team he belongs in the Hall? That's silly, it's not Art's fault they were a running team but he wasn't an all-time great, he was a very good player but very good shouldn't be enough to get into the Hall.

BTW/ Cris Carter averaged 12.6 per catch, should he not be in the HOF?

It's not just about YPC, you don't want to go into a debate btw Carter and Monk b/c it's not close. Carter alomst doubled Monk's TDs when only playing 10 more games.

Bottom line, Monk set records for catches in season, career catches (BTW/ every guy who has ever held this record is in the HOF), and consecutive games with a catch (consistency counts for something, right?)

He was a compiler, he wasn't great he just hung around long enough w/ good #s.

I LIKE Art and when guys like Swann are in Art should definitely be in but I don't think guys like Monk & Swann should be in but since Swann is in there's no doubt Art should be and will be in 1 day I just wish the Hall was only for the best of the best like it should be.

Monk should be in the hall.#'s dont always tell the story.Did u ever see him play nyjunc?

Yes I did, he was a very good player but not an all-time great. I'm rooting for him, he's a local guy and a good guy so I hope he makes it.

Ricky has talent, but he can't keep his head on straight! Riggins was the better running back by far. Ricky isn't even in the same league as Riggins.

I agree.
 
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