Sanchez pulled against the Cards

[The New Guy]

It is sad, it sucks we aren't going back to the playoffs but tiebreakers count so we are on the raod to 7 of the last 9 seasons finishing ahead of you. I've been here since 2004 and only 2005 and 2008 you finished ahead of us yet every year I hear how you guys are going to be better and you have the brighter future.

The 9-7 Jets team in 2002 played in a division where the weakest team was 8-8. The '02 Jets would ahve smacked the '00 dolphins or '08 dolphins and last I checked the '08 team got smoked at home in the WILD CARD round.


Rex and Sanchez have finished ahead of Miami every year so you must really not like winning.

That is liking bragging about beating a handicap in a foot race 50% of the time. :wheels:


This has been your Franchise's best 12 years and the Dolphins worst. You should have finished ahead of Miami 12 out of 12 times. I'm sure you have heard a bunch of ridiculous things from fans on this message board. There has not been many years in the past decade that I thought that Miami would finish ahead of the Jets or made that claim on this board. With change comes hope for the future. I have not been happy with the changes the Dolphins made in the past, but for the first time in a long time, it looks like the Dolphins are headed in the right direction. I have no idea if Philbin and Tannehill will pan out, but I like the direction we are heading in. We have 5 picks in the first 3 rounds and are in a better cap situation than the Jets. I don't think any expert in his right mind would pick the Jets near future over the Dolphins. The Dolphins are in year one and have already exceeded expectations. The Jets are in year 4 and have been going backwards for 2 years now.

Rex and Sanchez have struggled to have a winning record 3 out of 4 years in the NFL. That has nothing to do with Miami being worse the last 3 years. I hope they keep it up because it won't take much improvement to move ahead.

 

[nyjunc]

That is liking bragging about beating a handicap in a foot race 50% of the time. :wheels:


This has been your Franchise's best 12 years and the Dolphins worst. You should have finished ahead of Miami 12 out of 12 times. I'm sure you have heard a bunch of ridiculous things from fans on this message board. There has not been many years in the past decade that I thought that Miami would finish ahead of the Jets or made that claim on this board. With change comes hope for the future. I have not been happy with the changes the Dolphins made in the past, but for the first time in a long time, it looks like the Dolphins are headed in the right direction. I have no idea if Philbin and Tannehill will pan out, but I like the direction we are heading in. We have 5 picks in the first 3 rounds and are in a better cap situation than the Jets. I don't think any expert in his right mind would pick the Jets near future over the Dolphins. The Dolphins are in year one and have already exceeded expectations. The Jets are in year 4 and have been going backwards for 2 years now.

Rex and Sanchez have struggled to have a winning record 3 out of 4 years in the NFL. That has nothing to do with Miami being worse the last 3 years. I hope they keep it up because it won't take much improvement to move ahead.

we've been one of the best teams in the AFC the last decade or so, I think we are 4th or 5th in playoff wins. You guys don't have a playoff win in the last decade.

The dolphins have not exceeded expectations, teams go from bad to good right away. You were supposedly a playoff team after you beat us. Remember all the Tannehill vs. Luck matchups we'll see? the new Brady vs. Manning. Come on.

 

[The New Guy]

we've been one of the best teams in the AFC the last decade or so, I think we are 4th or 5th in playoff wins. You guys don't have a playoff win in the last decade.

The dolphins have not exceeded expectations, teams go from bad to good right away. You were supposedly a playoff team after you beat us. Remember all the Tannehill vs. Luck matchups we'll see? the new Brady vs. Manning. Come on.

The 4 playoff wins in 2 years boosted the Jets in the standings, but they have not been one of the best teams in the AFC in the last decade. To me, you have to have a better winning % and actually win something tangible to have that title. NE, Pitt, Bal, and Indy are the best AFC teams from 2000 to now. All have a winning percentage above .600; won their division multiple times and have actually made it to the Super Bowl. The Jets have been average these past 12 years. Prior to the 4 playoff wins in 2009/10 the Jets only had 2 playoff wins since 2000, which would tie with Tenn and Den and is behind Oak and SD. In the last 12 years, the Jets rank #8 in winning % (.515) behind NE, Pitt, Bal, Indy, Den, SD and Tenn.

To be considered one of the best, quality regular seasons are needed. The Jets would not have even made the playoffs in 09 if it was not for Indy laying down. They had a quality season in 2010, but that seems to be a fluke rather than the norm. One more season like this one and Rex, Sanchez and Tannenbaum will probably be gone and the Jets will be starting all over. Sanchez and Tannenbaum might even be gone after this year.

Most experts thought the Dolphins would win 2 to 4 games all year. Especially with a QB as inexperienced as Tannehill, I was thinking 5 or 6 wins. 5 wins with 4 games to go in the season has definitely exceeded expectations. I'm sure you heard a lot of things from fans. You can't attribute those things to me because I never thought that or said that. What I am saying now is I would rather have the Dolphins future over the Jets. Most non homers would as well.

 

[MD]

Junc, you don't have a QB. Thats not a bright future. The book is out on ours but we have a head start. Thats a brighter future.

 

[nyjunc]

The 4 playoff wins in 2 years boosted the Jets in the standings, but they have not been one of the best teams in the AFC in the last decade. To me, you have to have a better winning % and actually win something tangible to have that title. NE, Pitt, Bal, and Indy are the best AFC teams from 2000 to now. All have a winning percentage above .600; won their division multiple times and have actually made it to the Super Bowl. The Jets have been average these past 12 years. Prior to the 4 playoff wins in 2009/10 the Jets only had 2 playoff wins since 2000, which would tie with Tenn and Den and is behind Oak and SD. In the last 12 years, the Jets rank #8 in winning % (.515) behind NE, Pitt, Bal, Indy, Den, SD and Tenn.

To be considered one of the best, quality regular seasons are needed. The Jets would not have even made the playoffs in 09 if it was not for Indy laying down. They had a quality season in 2010, but that seems to be a fluke rather than the norm. One more season like this one and Rex, Sanchez and Tannenbaum will probably be gone and the Jets will be starting all over. Sanchez and Tannenbaum might even be gone after this year.

Most experts thought the Dolphins would win 2 to 4 games all year. Especially with a QB as inexperienced as Tannehill, I was thinking 5 or 6 wins. 5 wins with 4 games to go in the season has definitely exceeded expectations. I'm sure you heard a lot of things from fans. You can't attribute those things to me because I never thought that or said that. What I am saying now is I would rather have the Dolphins future over the Jets. Most non homers would as well.

the 2 SBs in the last 5 years boosted the Giants from 1 more SB win than us to 4, what is your point?

we made the playoffs in '09, stop whining. If you didn't play dead teams throughout 2008 you wouldn't have made the playoffs but you did and you made it.

I only go by the experts on here and the experts here told me 9-11 wins, playoff berth and possible overtaking of the Pats.

2001-2011:
playoff apps/wins in AFC:
NE: 9 playoff apps, 16 playoff wins, Jets 1-1 vs. them in postseason
Ind: 9 playoff apps, 9 playoff wins. Jets 2-1 vs. them in postseason
Pitt: 8 playoff apps, 12 playoff wins, Jets 0-2 vs Pitt
Bal: 7 playoff apps, 6 playoff wins, 0-0
NYJ: 6 playoff apps, 6 playoff wins
SD: 5 playoff apps, 3 playoff wins. NYJ 2-0 vs. SD
Ten: 4 playoff apps, 2 playoff wins
Den: 4 playoff apps, 2 playoff wins
Cin: 3 playoff apps, 0 playoff wins. NYJ 1-0 vs. Cin
KC: 3 playoff apps, 0 playoff wins
Oak: 2 playoff apps, 3 playoff wins. NYJ 0-2 vs. Oak
Jax: 2 playoff apps, 1 playoff win
Mia: 2 playoff apps, ZERO playoff wins
Hou: 1 playoff app, 1 playoff win
Cle: 1 playoff app, 0 playoff wins
Buf: zero playoff apps

5th in playoff apps out of 16 teams, 4th in playoff wins.

Junc, you don't have a QB. Thats not a bright future. The book is out on ours but we have a head start. Thats a brighter future.

we have a QB we know we can win w/ if surrounded w/ the right cast, you have no idea about yours yet.

 

[grogan12]

the 2 SBs in the last 5 years boosted the Giants from 1 more SB win than us to 4, what is your point?

we made the playoffs in '09, stop whining. If you didn't play dead teams throughout 2008 you wouldn't have made the playoffs but you did and you made it.

I only go by the experts on here and the experts here told me 9-11 wins, playoff berth and possible overtaking of the Pats.

2001-2011:
playoff apps/wins in AFC:
NE: 9 playoff apps, 16 playoff wins, Jets 1-1 vs. them in postseason
Ind: 9 playoff apps, 9 playoff wins. Jets 2-1 vs. them in postseason
Pitt: 8 playoff apps, 12 playoff wins, Jets 0-2 vs Pitt
Bal: 7 playoff apps, 6 playoff wins, 0-0
NYJ: 6 playoff apps, 6 playoff wins
SD: 5 playoff apps, 3 playoff wins. NYJ 2-0 vs. SD
Ten: 4 playoff apps, 2 playoff wins
Den: 4 playoff apps, 2 playoff wins
Cin: 3 playoff apps, 0 playoff wins. NYJ 1-0 vs. Cin
KC: 3 playoff apps, 0 playoff wins
Oak: 2 playoff apps, 3 playoff wins. NYJ 0-2 vs. Oak
Jax: 2 playoff apps, 1 playoff win
Mia: 2 playoff apps, ZERO playoff wins
Hou: 1 playoff app, 1 playoff win
Cle: 1 playoff app, 0 playoff wins
Buf: zero playoff apps

5th in playoff apps out of 16 teams, 4th in playoff wins.



we have a QB we know we can win w/ if surrounded w/ the right cast, you have no idea about yours yet.

Oh yeah, I see what you’re saying, the Jets are set at QB for years to come. God I hope Rex and the rest of the rest of the guys down in that swamp ridden garbage dump of Jersey agree with you. Because other than watching my team position themselves for yet another playoff run, the second best part of the football season is watching Jet fans see their dreams come crashing down every year, and then guys like you playing make believe so you don’t have to deal with the reality of the situation. You’re like the guy that's up to his neck in flood waters commenting on how dry his hair still is. :sidelol:

 

[nyjunc]

Oh yeah, I see what you’re saying, the Jets are set at QB for years to come. God I hope Rex and the rest of the rest of the guys down in that swamp ridden garbage dump of Jersey agree with you. Because other than watching my team position themselves for yet another playoff run, the second best part of the football season is watching Jet fans see their dreams come crashing down every year, and then guys like you playing make believe so you don’t have to deal with the reality of the situation. You’re like the guy that's up to his neck in flood waters commenting on how dry his hair still is. :sidelol:

if the Jets win or lose it doesn't change my life. Sure I am happer when thet win but do you think I am crying in a corner and can't go on w/ my life if they lose? I feel bad for you.

 

[The New Guy]

the 2 SBs in the last 5 years boosted the Giants from 1 more SB win than us to 4, what is your point?

we made the playoffs in '09, stop whining. If you didn't play dead teams throughout 2008 you wouldn't have made the playoffs but you did and you made it.

I only go by the experts on here and the experts here told me 9-11 wins, playoff berth and possible overtaking of the Pats.

2001-2011:
playoff apps/wins in AFC:
NE: 9 playoff apps, 16 playoff wins, Jets 1-1 vs. them in postseason
Ind: 9 playoff apps, 9 playoff wins. Jets 2-1 vs. them in postseason
Pitt: 8 playoff apps, 12 playoff wins, Jets 0-2 vs Pitt
Bal: 7 playoff apps, 6 playoff wins, 0-0
NYJ: 6 playoff apps, 6 playoff wins
SD: 5 playoff apps, 3 playoff wins. NYJ 2-0 vs. SD
Ten: 4 playoff apps, 2 playoff wins
Den: 4 playoff apps, 2 playoff wins
Cin: 3 playoff apps, 0 playoff wins. NYJ 1-0 vs. Cin
KC: 3 playoff apps, 0 playoff wins
Oak: 2 playoff apps, 3 playoff wins. NYJ 0-2 vs. Oak
Jax: 2 playoff apps, 1 playoff win
Mia: 2 playoff apps, ZERO playoff wins
Hou: 1 playoff app, 1 playoff win
Cle: 1 playoff app, 0 playoff wins
Buf: zero playoff apps

5th in playoff apps out of 16 teams, 4th in playoff wins.



we have a QB we know we can win w/ if surrounded w/ the right cast, you have no idea about yours yet.

Winning the Super Bowl is a little different than winning meaningless playoff games. The point is, 4 playoff wins in 2 years does not erase a decade of mediocrity. Especially when the Jets would not have qualified one of those years had another team not laid down for them. There is a huge difference in playing bad teams versus teams that rest their guys and have no desire to win. The 2011 (8-5) Jets faced a couple of bad teams to end the season with the playoffs on the line and lost to both teams. Had it been another situation like 09, they probably would have made it.

Winning %, Division titles and Conference Championships are needed to be considered one of the best teams over a decade. The Jets don't qualify.

AFC EAST		W	L	T	PCT	S.B Wins	Super Bowl Appear.	Playoff Appear.
New England Patriots		139	53		.723	3	5	8
New York Jets		99	93		.515			6
Miami Dolphins		92	100		.479			3
Buffalo Bills		76	116		.395
AFC NORTH
Pittsburgh Steelers		127	64	1	.661	2	3	8
Baltimore Ravens		116	76		.604	1	1	8
Cincinnati Bengals		81	110	1	.421			3
Cleveland Browns		66	126		.343			1
AFC SOUTH
Indianapolis Colts		126	65		.661	1	2	10
Tennessee Titans		106	86		.552		1	5
Jacksonville Jaguars		89	103		.463			2
Houston Texans		65	95		.406			1
AFC West
Denver Broncos		105	87		.546			5
San Diego Chargers		102	90		.531			5
Kansas City Chiefs		87	105		.453			3
Oakland Raiders		78	114		.406		1	3

Even Oakland and Tennessee (who has a higher winning % and more division titles than the Jets) have been to a Super Bowl in that time frame, (when the Jets have not) and I don't consider either as one of the best AFC teams over that span.

 

[nyjunc]

Winning the Super Bowl is a little different than winning meaningless playoff games. The point is, 4 playoff wins in 2 years does not erase a decade of mediocrity. Especially when the Jets would not have qualified one of those years had another team not laid down for them. There is a huge difference in playing bad teams versus teams that rest their guys and have no desire to win. The 2011 (8-5) Jets faced a couple of bad teams to end the season with the playoffs on the line and lost to both teams. Had it been another situation like 09, they probably would have made it.

we lost to one bad team when we were essentially already eliminated, the other 2 games we lost to the eventual champs and one of the hottest teams in the league.

The Jets have been one of the top AFC teams for over a decade, sorry the truth bothers you. Only 3 teams have more playoff wins and we did it w/ a dynasty team in the division knowing we were playing for 2nd every year. You see what that did to the bottom 2 teams in our division but the Jets were able to overcome and still be one of the top teams in the AFC.

 

[The New Guy]

we lost to one bad team when we were essentially already eliminated, the other 2 games we lost to the eventual champs and one of the hottest teams in the league.

The Jets have been one of the top AFC teams for over a decade, sorry the truth bothers you. Only 3 teams have more playoff wins and we did it w/ a dynasty team in the division knowing we were playing for 2nd every year. You see what that did to the bottom 2 teams in our division but the Jets were able to overcome and still be one of the top teams in the AFC.

The Eagles were 2-4 in the previous 6 games before facing the Jets, and the Giants were 1-5 in their previous 6 games before facing the Jets. Not exactly what I would call the hottest teams in the league. With the playoffs on the line, the Jets lost all 3 games and 2 of the 3 were considered bad teams and most thought the 3rd would miss the playoffs. Facing those bad teams had a different outcome than facing a good team that laid down.

It is not the truth. The Jets only have 3 more playoff apps and only won 7 more games than the Dolphins did over that span. The Jets barely qualified for a playoffs several times while Miami missed at 9-7 (x2) and 10-6. How can they be considered one of the best over a decade when they are so close to a team that has been as bad as Miami? 4 playoff wins in 2 years doesn't change those facts.

 

[nyjunc]

The Eagles were 2-4 in the previous 6 games before facing the Jets, and the Giants were 1-5 in their previous 6 games before facing the Jets. Not exactly what I would call the hottest teams in the league. With the playoffs on the line, the Jets lost all 3 games and 2 of the 3 were considered bad teams and most thought the 3rd would miss the playoffs. Facing those bad teams had a different outcome than facing a good team that laid down.

It is not the truth. The Jets only have 3 more playoff apps and only won 7 more games than the Dolphins did over that span. The Jets barely qualified for a playoffs several times while Miami missed at 9-7 (x2) and 10-6. How can they be considered one of the best over a decade when they are so close to a team that has been as bad as Miami? 4 playoff wins in 2 years doesn't change those facts.

Vick had just come back the week before and they ended up winning their last 4 w/ him. Philly against us was the most impressive team I saw all year.

The Giants got hot, the Giants wouldn't lose another game. We gave it to them, that Victor Cruz TD at the end of the 1st half changed both of our seasons. We dominated play top that point and would have likely been up at least 10-3 at the half but instead we went down 10-7 and never really recovered.

since when did 6-2=? since 2001:

NYJ: 2001, 2002, 2004, 2006, 2009, 2010
Mia: 2001, 2008

we have 4 more apps and SIX more playoff wins.

We wont he required # of games in particular seasons. Our 9 win '02 team was better than our 10 win '01 team or your 10 win '03 team. You guys were basically eliminated after your 2 game losing streak late in '03 before beating bad teams the last 2 weeks to make the record look better. You were out of the race in october in 2005 before winning a bunch of meaningless games to end the year. those were the only 2 years you werre "close" even though you weren't either time. We also could have made it in '08 and last year but missed by a game each time. We earned our playoff apps and you earned yours, you also earned the but whoopings you got when you actually made it.

 

[The New Guy]

Vick had just come back the week before and they ended up winning their last 4 w/ him. Philly against us was the most impressive team I saw all year.

The Giants got hot, the Giants wouldn't lose another game. We gave it to them, that Victor Cruz TD at the end of the 1st half changed both of our seasons. We dominated play top that point and would have likely been up at least 10-3 at the half but instead we went down 10-7 and never really recovered.

since when did 6-2=? since 2001:

NYJ: 2001, 2002, 2004, 2006, 2009, 2010
Mia: 2001, 2008

we have 4 more apps and SIX more playoff wins.

We wont he required # of games in particular seasons. Our 9 win '02 team was better than our 10 win '01 team or your 10 win '03 team. You guys were basically eliminated after your 2 game losing streak late in '03 before beating bad teams the last 2 weeks to make the record look better. You were out of the race in october in 2005 before winning a bunch of meaningless games to end the year. those were the only 2 years you werre "close" even though you weren't either time. We also could have made it in '08 and last year but missed by a game each time. We earned our playoff apps and you earned yours, you also earned the but whoopings you got when you actually made it.

The same Vick that led the Eagles to 1-5 start? Even if you want to uplift an average Eagles team, the Jets still lost to Mia. Playing bad teams to end the season is very different than playing teams that rest the starters and have no desire to win.

The stats are from 2000 to 2011.

NYJ: 2001 ( made it with a last minute FG), 2002, (Thanks to Miami choking, the Jets made it at 9-7) 2004, (Clinch becasue of a Buff loss) 2006, 2009 (made it only because Indy resting starters), 2010

Mia: 2000, 2001, 2008

Only 3 more playoff Apps and 7 more wins from 2000 to 2011. One of the best teams in the last decade wouldn't be so close to a team that has been as bad as Miami.

We have already been over the required amount of games argument. The Jets needed help several times to get in and got it, while Miami needed help several times and didn't get it. The Jets have not been one of the best teams in the league the last decade, and they were not elite from 2009 / 2010. They are proving it with their last 2 seasons and will continue to prove it until they make some changes.

 

[nyjunc]

The same Vick that led the Eagles to 1-5 start? Even if you want to uplift an average Eagles team, the Jets still lost to Mia. Playing bad teams to end the season is very different than playing teams that rest the starters and have no desire to win.

The stats are from 2000 to 2011.

NYJ: 2001 ( made it with a last minute FG), 2002, (Thanks to Miami choking, the Jets made it at 9-7) 2004, (Clinch becasue of a Buff loss) 2006, 2009 (made it only because Indy resting starters), 2010

Mia: 2000, 2001, 2008

Only 3 more playoff Apps and 7 more wins from 2000 to 2011. One of the best teams in the last decade wouldn't be so close to a team that has been as bad as Miami.

We have already been over the required amount of games argument. The Jets needed help several times to get in and got it, while Miami needed help several times and didn't get it. The Jets have not been one of the best teams in the league the last decade, and they were not elite from 2009 / 2010. They are proving it with their last 2 seasons and will continue to prove it until they make some changes.

yep the same one that led Philyl to 8-3 the year before. You know teams can get better as seasons move along, right? Philly was playing outstanding football late in the year.

I see a ton of excuses so I guess we can say both of your div titles were b/c the Jets choked, right? we were 9-4 in '00 and 8-3 in '08 and we finished 9-7 both years so I can apply that same lac of logic to tyr to take credit away from Miami.

Even adding your ONE playoff win in 2000 we still had FIVE more than you. No matter what way you slice it we have been MUCH better than Miami and one of the best teams in the AFC in the last decade.

you had 2 fake contending seasons ('03, '05), we had chances that we missed out on in '00, '08 and '11 so using your what if logic that's 3 more potential playoff apps. The bottom line is we made 5 more playoff apps and won 6 more playoff games since 2001. No matter how many excuses you make it won't change the facts.

 

[The New Guy]

yep the same one that led Philyl to 8-3 the year before. You know teams can get better as seasons move along, right? Philly was playing outstanding football late in the year.

I see a ton of excuses so I guess we can say both of your div titles were b/c the Jets choked, right? we were 9-4 in '00 and 8-3 in '08 and we finished 9-7 both years so I can apply that same lac of logic to tyr to take credit away from Miami.

Even adding your ONE playoff win in 2000 we still had FIVE more than you. No matter what way you slice it we have been MUCH better than Miami and one of the best teams in the AFC in the last decade.

you had 2 fake contending seasons ('03, '05), we had chances that we missed out on in '00, '08 and '11 so using your what if logic that's 3 more potential playoff apps. The bottom line is we made 5 more playoff apps and won 6 more playoff games since 2001. No matter how many excuses you make it won't change the facts.

I'm not the one trying to make the argument that my teams has been 1 of the best in the AFC over a decade.

The 00 Jets never had a better record the last 7 games of the season. Miami was up a game from week 12 on. Going into week 17 Miami didn't need to rely on another team losing (that they did not play) to win the division. The 02 Jets were 2 games behind Miami with 2 games left to play. The Jets had nothing to do with Miami losing the final 2 games. The 08 Jets were tied at 9-5 with a game against each other still left. Miami had everything to do with the Jets loss in week 17. That was not the case with the 02 Jets.

I'm not trying to change the facts. The facts are the Jets only have 3 more playoff apps and 7 more regular season wins and 1 less division title than Miami from 2000 to 2011. The Jets went into the final week of the season not knowing if they would make the playoffs or not 8 times in that time span. The other 4 times, they were eliminated long before the final week. That is not one of the best teams in the AFC over that time span.

 

[nyjunc]

I'm not the one trying to make the argument that my teams has been 1 of the best in the AFC over a decade.

The 00 Jets never had a better record the last 7 games of the season. Miami was up a game from week 12 on. Going into week 17 Miami didn't need to rely on another team losing (that they did not play) to win the division. The 02 Jets were 2 games behind Miami with 2 games left to play. The Jets had nothing to do with Miami losing the final 2 games. The 08 Jets were tied at 9-5 with a game against each other still left. Miami had everything to do with the Jets loss in week 17. That was not the case with the 02 Jets.

I'm not trying to change the facts. The facts are the Jets only have 3 more playoff apps and 7 more regular season wins and 1 less division title than Miami from 2000 to 2011. The Jets went into the final week of the season not knowing if they would make the playoffs or not 8 times in that time span. The other 4 times, they were eliminated long before the final week. That is not one of the best teams in the AFC over that time span.

You aren't trying b/c there isn't anything to back you up unlike the facts that support the Jets. 5th in playoff apps, 4th in playoff wins- clearly one of the best teams in the conf.

The '00 Jets were 6-1, 9-4. Their collapse allowed Miami to win the division.

The only time we relied on a team losing in order to clinch a spot was 2002 and that happened only b/c we started 1-4, 2-5 b/c we had a million injuries.

The jets were done in week 17 of '08, Miami had nothing to do w/ it. we could have played UM and still lost.

The facts are the Jets have 5 more playoff apps since 2001 and 6 more playoff wins. Compare yourself w/ Buffalo as it's much closer.

Miami 2 playoff apps, 0 playoff wins
Buffalo 0 playoff apps, 0 playoff wins

MUCH closer.