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Slimm's 2016 Quarterbacks (Underclassman)

Slimm,
I would like to have your input on a qb question i have. I know its ot but maybe it can be stretched to be draft related

The neverending Tannehill long ball debate brought me back to a conversation I had awhile back with a qb college coach at some function

After giving a quick run down on all the specifics he coaches as a qb position coach he said something to the effect "One thing I cannot teach
and I don`t know anybody that can is accuracy. You either have or not. I suppose with long practice one could become more proficient but it can`t be taught"

Slimm, any truth to what he said?? I suppose accuracy could be affected by an ineffective suuporting cast ( O line play, route running deficiency)



Well, from my experience he's right. Accuracy can be improved, but it can't be taught.... in other words, it can't be given to you by someone else. A quarterback can improve his own accuracy to a certain degree, through improved footwork. But it's negligible improvement. It's more of an improvement on consistency than it is an improvement on accuracy. You can't make an inaccurate passer an accurate passer. You're either accurate or you're not.

Similar to how you're either fast or you're not. You can improve your time on a stopwatch through technique, but it's negligible improvement. You can't teach a slow guy to be fast. You're either fast or you're not.

Lastly, you have to get to the true definition of what accuracy is in terms of a quarterback throwing a football. Quite simply, it's the ability to throw the football exactly where you intend to throw it. Period.

It has nothing to do with completion percentage. There's too many variables that affect a statistic like that. For example, WVUBOB can throw 10 perfect passes in a row to a receiver that were dead on target. Every pass was directed exactly at the specific body part you intended for....but the receiver dropped 5 of 'em. Your completion percentage is 50%.

Conversely, TedSlimmJr can throw 10 passes in a row to his receiver that were all over the place, but the receiver made 8 outstanding catches, while 2 of 'em were simply too far off target to even hit the receiver in the hands. My completion percentage is 80%. But who's really the more accurate passer?

That's where the old adage, "There's lies, damn lies, and then there's statistics" comes into play. Statistics can always mean whatever you want 'em to mean. They're simply a compilation of raw data....an end result in numerical form. What they don't tell you is "how" and "why".

Ryan Tannehill struggles to make basic throws that a starting caliber quarterback has to make. He's shown himself to be incapable of making certain throws that require touch. Fades and deep vertical routes. The throws he makes best, and most comfortable making are out routes and comebacks. The exact same throws he was good and not good at coming out of college.

However, this is only a piece of what his issues always were, and continue to be. He has other issues that have nothing to do with art of physically throwing the football. These are things I talked about extensively in regards to Ryan Tannehill prior to his entry into the draft. It is what it is.
 
I'm going to see Paxton Lynch tonight live in stadium. Curious to see how he does against a pretty tough South Florida defense.

Curious to hear your thoughts. I watched the game and really like what I saw. Seems to be very comfortable moving around the pocket and I thought he moved well for such a big kid. Does he come out this year> Any projections on what round? Slimm and Tannenbombs any thoughts on this?
 
Curious to hear your thoughts. I watched the game and really like what I saw. Seems to be very comfortable moving around the pocket and I thought he moved well for such a big kid. Does he come out this year> Any projections on what round? Slimm and Tannenbombs any thoughts on this?


Slimm will take him in the 1st round. I'll grade him somewhere between 15-19 overall to give an early indication.

If he comes out early and declares eligible, its because he knows he's going in the 1st round based on feedback after submitting his paperwork to the advisory committee.
 
I wish I could see the same thing you guys see in Lynch and Goff. To me they are both wild af, i wouldnt draft either. Yes they play tempo, but wild.
 
Slimm will take him in the 1st round. I'll grade him somewhere between 15-19 overall to give an early indication.

If he comes out early and declares eligible, its because he knows he's going in the 1st round based on feedback after submitting his paperwork to the advisory committee.
Pretty sure the Dolphins will have a top 5 pick and my thoughts are if you think the QB you need is going to be the man for your franchise you reach. They reached for Tannehill and its not working out. He'll be a average guy that you need a strong team around in order to win. I'd roll the dice and go with Lynch in the top 5 and see what happens. I am no talent evaluator but I don't think you need to be to see he is a better product than Tannehill was in 2012.
 
I'd love to know Slimm's thoughts specifically relating Jonathan Goff to Paxton Lynch to Connor Cook, as I've been convinced for some time those are the eventual three to shake out at the top of the 2016 class. Personally I could be convinced of going with any of the three depending on what you're looking for in your system and with your franchise situation. All three have significant warts but all three have significant ability.
 
Slimm will take him in the 1st round. I'll grade him somewhere between 15-19 overall to give an early indication.

If he comes out early and declares eligible, its because he knows he's going in the 1st round based on feedback after submitting his paperwork to the advisory committee.

I bump QBs with 1st round grades to the top so I have him #3 overall after Goff and Cook. All 3 can play QB for my team.


But man Joey Bosa, Jalen Ramey, Jaylon Smith, Vernon Hargreaves, Laremy Tunsil, Ronnie Stanley, Laquon Treadwell, Derrick Henry, and Zeke Elliot are really good...
 
I'd love to know Slimm's thoughts specifically relating Jonathan Goff to Paxton Lynch to Connor Cook, as I've been convinced for some time those are the eventual three to shake out at the top of the 2016 class. Personally I could be convinced of going with any of the three depending on what you're looking for in your system and with your franchise situation. All three have significant warts but all three have significant ability.

I know this question was directed towards Slimm, but I have all the as the top 3 players on my board for the whole class. Have them 1. Goff 2. Cook 3. Lynch
 
Carson wentz is the best qb in the draft and now that he is injured we may be able to draft him in 2nd round.
 
I'm not as high on Goff as I was a year ago. He's been asked to make more pro type throws this season, and not always successful. Kind of the opposite of Tannehill in many respects. His touch and field sense are fine. Very competitive, as he demonstrated on the sideline last week against USC.

The ball wobbles and doesn't always get there on intermediate routes. Those wobblers account for many interceptions in traffic.

Too bad Goff isn't an inch or two shorter. He plays taller than his listed height and often appears so gangly it translates to less athleticism than ideal, and not the greatest mechanics. When he doesn't get his body fully into the ball it lessens the velocity and makes his arm appear weaker than I've seen it in previous seasons.

One amusing aspect of Goff's play is that he carries out the play fake to absurd degree on every running play, particularly the jet sweeps. He'll give it such an exaggerated throwing motion even when nobody is running a route in the area where his arm is aiming. Eventually he'll learn to harness that fake when it's more viable and useful. Certainly preferable to quarterbacks who never bother to carry out a fake.
 
I was so close to placing Lynch over Goff. I ultimately gave the edge to Goff because he has a higher floor, but I still have them 1A 1B.

Slimm I wanted to bring up the discussion of higher floor vs higher ceiling specifically pertaining to drafting quarterbacks. This is the one position (and pick) that either gets you fired, or gets you a contract extension.

I think Goff has the higher floor, but wouldn't be shocked if Lynch ends up better.

For me at least, any other position (if you consider two prospects to be this close) I'd take the player with the most upside. But as you know, quarterbacks are a different animal. Thanks, looking forward to your $0.02
 
Holy **** Patrick Mahomes is good.

I'm not sure he's not the best draft eligible quarterback in this draft.
 
Goff looked a lot better against Stanford than against USC, which was the last full Cal game I watched.

I'm still not convinced Goff has enough raw ability to be NFL elite. He really strains to get the ball there on what should be ordinary throws for a top prospect. His windup lengthens and he really has to muscle it.

He reminds me of somebody but I haven't been able to place it yet. Sometimes I struggle because I don't know if I'm thinking of somebody 40 years ago or 5 years ago.

Goff's arm should improve somewhat in the NFL. That's typical. The arm strength improves in the NFL, not college. Matt Ryan didn't have enough arm to be great but it improved just enough as he entered the league to make most of the necessary throws. He always had trouble forcing balls over the middle. They don't get there. Now that he's lost a few percent it's more of an issue. Goff has some of the same saw ability concerns that I had with Matt Ryan. You want everything to be 5 or 10% better but it's not.

Goff might improve his arm and velocity simply by superior mechanics and not throwing so many balls off his back foot. He's like a golfer with a Reverse C finish.

It's weird because I have a comparison for Josh Rosen but he's only a year or so older. I'm not sure that's allowed. Rosen reminds me of a more mobile version of Brad Kaaya.
 
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