Spielman Purge- He Has to GO

[Steve S]

The once a month "Spielman has to go" thread from Steve S...

Not true.

The KEY is he did'nt give him that bonus. Instead he got McKintosh for a bargain basement price and a contract that has almost no risk whatsoever for the team.

The key was that this dope of a GM was going to give Mac a huge bonus until he was bailed out by a call from the Raiders. He was more than willing to throw away cap room and draft picks in the present and future to acquire marginal players.

That "underwhelming" left tackle played on a bad leg all year in a system that was designed by a moron for the worst O-line coach in football.

That same "underwhelming" wil be starting and healthy this year.

Is there any historical proof that this guy is anything more than a journeyman LT? Haven't seen it in San Diego or here.


Cut Reggie Howard after we traded Surtain and Will Poole got hurt? That would make a ton of sense. That would leave a rookie and Mario Edwards competing for the #2 corner spot. You want Spielman fired? Listen to your advice.

Read it again, Pay cut or he's gone. He isn't worth what he's making. He's an average to below average corner making starter's money. I can't see how Mario Edwards is going to be worse than a slow, weak corner who has the same lack of ability as Jamar Fletcher and Chris Green.

His contract is not that bad and he is not the reason we had to trade Surtain.

We had to trade Surtain because he was going to be a free agent next year and our salary cap allocation was to heavy on the defensive side of the football.

We had to trade Surtain because of a cap overage due to bad signings like Reggie Howard. Its all connected. In essence the Dolphins chose Howard and Madison to be their future starters by cutting the deals they did last year.

Blaming Reggie Howard for the Surtain trade is absurd.

Giving Howard a 3-4 mil signing bonus to get Madison to take a paycut was absurd. Not keeping your best defensive back was absurd. Drafting and signing small, slow nickel backs in the first round and for a starter's money is absurd.


Wannstedt signed him to that contract restructure. It was also a contract that paid a top 5 running back WELL BELOW market value for a player of Ricky's caliber.

He did'nt quit or get hurt his first two years. What was the contract supposed to say "If Ricky quits the New Orleans Saints owe Miami a first round pick"?

I wasn't talking about the money part of the contract. I'm talking about the deal. It was flat out stupid to offer up 2 first round picks for what a guy does in his first year with the new team. It gives the team no protection in future years and was part of the combined Wanny and Spielman philosophy that its OK to sacrifice whatever you have to in the future to get what you want now. Its not hindsight. Its what I said at the time that these two clowns are willing to give up anything for now. It backfired big time.

We got a third rounder and a starting wide reciever for Ogunleye. What were we supposed to get for Ogunleye? Remember, this is not Madden.

How about a second or a better player? A young All Pro pass rusher is worth more than a possession WR in his late 20's and a third.

Spielman did'nt put together the offense. That was Wannstedt and Chris Foerrster. Spielman did'nt know Ricky was going to retire, Tony Wise would sh|t the bed, Wannstedt would stubbornly stick with Fiedler instead of giving Feeley more snaps in training camp, Boston would get hurt etc.

Yeah, he did a huge role in reshaping the offense and he blew it as much or more than Wanny did. It was his job to bring in better veteran lineman like Woody. He didn't even make the trip to Miami. How sad is that to lose a player to the Lions w/o even a look.

They can make all the excuses they want about this money or that money but being a GM is a results business and RS got no results last year and did more harm to this franchise in one year than any GM I can remember.

Jeno James, D Mac and St Clair was a poor effort, IMO, especially for what we paid. You obviously love the D Mac deal but I think he should have given the Dolphins a refund after the way he played last year and to me the biggest indictment of Spielman was that he was willing to pay an injured player a big bonus (reports were 5-6 mil) before even checking him out. That's bad business and bad scouting. I don't want him anywhere near my front office if I'm Saban.

By the end of the year the "piss poor O-line" was starting to come together and with a real offensive line coach it will come together. Spielman had to clean house on the O-line. Ever wonder why 3 of the guys Spielman got rid of could'nt find a job ANYWHERE else? He had to be right somewhat.

I agree that Spielman made some mistakes. He also had a decent draft when he was allowed to pick his players and Saban kept him..I trust Nick more then you.

Some mistakes??? That's funny. He made more mistakes in one year than good GM's make in seven. You've got extremely low standards if you buy this crap that Spielman is a bright young personnel guy. Maybe he was warped by Wanny's buy now, pay later philosophy but he did more damage when Wanny supposedly wasn't in charge last year than Wanny did as a GM.

Bottom line is that we had 4 bad drafts and 4 mediocre to horrible offseasons in a row with the toxic twins at the helm, whatever their roles were. Its time to flush out the remaining twin and close the book on a bad chapter in Miami history.

Nick doesn't have a lot of faith in Spielman either so get off your high horse.

 

[T.R.U. FIN3]

:eek: Man that is a long post.

 

[T.R.U. FIN3]

How about a second or a better player? A young All Pro pass rusher is worth more than a possession WR in his late 20's and a third

.

Who was Miami supposed to throw the ball to last year then?

 

[A Wing Pilot]

speilman = good scout

Thats it no more no less he takes great notes on pllayers and is good at evaluating raw talent. I ohonestly don't think he should be anything more then a scout.

 

[T.R.U. FIN3]

How do you rate a player playing out of position? (Reggie Howard). He is a good cornerback. This is the year that will make or break him here in Miami.

 

[Noodle Arm]

A "Spielman must go" thread?...it must be that time of the month again. Once again the same thing is being said over and over and over again with nothing new being brought in.

 

[finfan54]

I do not think anyone can honestly be honest about whatever happened last year. Last year was desperation and then Ricky leaves. Our coaching was our biggest problem moreso than anything. I do not think AJ Feeley for a 2nd was good, it should have been a third or fourth but Spielman cannot be blamed for anything beyond last year. If Spielman has a good relationship with Saban and Saban likes his loyalty or whatever, spielman could stay. Saban has to find the guy he likes best. not always easy. You do not get rid of a guy who is working out fine right now just to get another guy for the sake of getting another guy.

 

[LithoMan]

All I got to say, "if" and only "if", we sign Ty Law, You have no one else ot blame, and chant to fire, then the "great" Saban himself. Fine, "if" he is going to blow the team up and rebuild, then blow it up, and dont be wrapping a ton up into Ty. We had one of the best cover corners, in surtain, to "sell" him off for a weak a$$ second rounder, to just turn around and sign Ty. That would be one of the most ******ed moves ever, and be wannyesque. We have had plenty of that. "If" Saban just lets it be and lets the team get exploited, then I'm cool with that. If your going to blow it up, then blow it up.

Next season, JT and Zach are gone. He drafted their replacements, but if all he did is drafted replacements, and traded off Surtain for chump change, to turn around and sign Ty, then this guy is in way over his head.

Blow it up, then blow it up! Dont put on some show, and correct your mistakes, by some desperation signing. Get blasted in the season, and just think of all the cash your going to have to spend on some terrific FA next offseason.

BUT, GD, I want some 3-4 D signings in FA next offseason. I AM EXTREMELY TIRED OF THE WEAK A$$ OVER FRONT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[jtsacksyou]

Yeah, he did a huge role in reshaping the offense and he blew it as much or more than Wanny did. It was his job to bring in better veteran lineman like Woody. He didn't even make the trip to Miami. How sad is that to lose a player to the Lions w/o even a look.

But look what he did to our offense. He made it young and talented. We now have all the peices in place for a great offense. We just need more talent on the O-line. But Our receivers are top notch. Ronnie and RIcky at running back and AJ should develope into a good player. I think he did fine with the offense.

 

[Agua]

You do not get rid of a guy who is working out fine right now just to get another guy for the sake of getting another guy.

Although any rational person would understand that, for some reason these knuckleheads can't.

 

[finfan54]

All I got to say, "if" and only "if", we sign Ty Law, You have no one else ot blame, and chant to fire, then the "great" Saban himself. Fine, "if" he is going to blow the team up and rebuild, then blow it up, and dont be wrapping a ton up into Ty. We had one of the best cover corners, in surtain, to "sell" him off for a weak a$$ second rounder, to just turn around and sign Ty. That would be one of the most ******ed moves ever, and be wannyesque. We have had plenty of that. "If" Saban just lets it be and lets the team get exploited, then I'm cool with that. If your going to blow it up, then blow it up.

Next season, JT and Zach are gone. He drafted their replacements, but if all he did is drafted replacements, and traded off Surtain for chump change, to turn around and sign Ty, then this guy is in way over his head.

Blow it up, then blow it up! Dont put on some show, and correct your mistakes, by some desperation signing. Get blasted in the season, and just think of all the cash your going to have to spend on some terrific FA next offseason.

BUT, GD, I want some 3-4 D signings in FA next offseason. I AM EXTREMELY TIRED OF THE WEAK A$$ OVER FRONT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I dont see us getting Law at all. I dont think Saban is that stupid to sell off Surtain and then pay all that money on Law who has been injured these past years.

Saban, like belechick, do not rely on all pro CB's to run there defense. They rely on great safeties and big LB's who come from all directions and big DT's who can plug the middle.

 

[finfan54]

Although any rational person would understand that, for some reason these knuckleheads can't.

Its just people who think they can affect whatever happens in Dolphinland. sometimes it works, but it has to be something that is rather obvious in order for people to affect what a business will do. Take Enron for example. Its a no brainer. Spielman is not such a no brainer, and Saban knows it. Otherwise, Spielman would have been gone by now.

 

[MDFINFAN]

The key was that this dope of a GM was going to give Mac a huge bonus until he was bailed out by a call from the Raiders. He was more than willing to throw away cap room and draft picks in the present and future to acquire marginal players.

He was going to pay a bonus based on Miami doctor's physical...why blame Speilman for that?

Is there any historical proof that this guy is anything more than a journeyman LT? Haven't seen it in San Diego or here.

Some players take longer to develope than others, do you think Saban would have sign him to a contract where Saban says he won't draft a LT and sign a FA LT. So did Saban get sucker too? So should we get rid of Saban as well?

Read it again, Pay cut or he's gone. He isn't worth what he's making. He's an average to below average corner making starter's money. I can't see how Mario Edwards is going to be worse than a slow, weak corner who has the same lack of ability as Jamar Fletcher and Chris Green.

He was a part of a top ranked secondary, he didn't start, it was his first year in this D, and we didn't really get to make an assessment of his limited role play.

We had to trade Surtain because of a cap overage due to bad signings like Reggie Howard. Its all connected. In essence the Dolphins chose Howard and Madison to be their future starters by cutting the deals they did last year.

Blaming Reggie Howard for the Surtain trade is absurd.

Agreed, Surtain was going to be traded whether Howard was here or not. We simply needed to balance the money between O and D..Patrick allowed that. If we kept Ogun and Pat..We'd be cash strapped galore by now.

I wasn't talking about the money part of the contract. I'm talking about the deal. It was flat out stupid to offer up 2 first round picks for what a guy does in his first year with the new team. It gives the team no protection in future years and was part of the combined Wanny and Spielman philosophy that its OK to sacrifice whatever you have to in the future to get what you want now. Its not hindsight. Its what I said at the time that these two clowns are willing to give up anything for now. It backfired big time.
Try conditional 1st...just in case the RB didn't work out
We got a third rounder and a starting wide reciever for Ogunleye. What were we supposed to get for Ogunleye? Remember, this is not Madden.

How about a second or a better player? A young All Pro pass rusher is worth more than a possession WR in his late 20's and a third.

Spielman did'nt put together the offense. That was Wannstedt and Chris Foerrster. Spielman did'nt know Ricky was going to retire, Tony Wise would sh|t the bed, Wannstedt would stubbornly stick with Fiedler instead of giving Feeley more snaps in training camp, Boston would get hurt etc. ditto

Yeah, he did a huge role in reshaping the offense and he blew it as much or more than Wanny did. It was his job to bring in better veteran lineman like Woody. He didn't even make the trip to Miami. How sad is that to lose a player to the Lions w/o even a look.

So you were willing to overpay Woody, Detroit upped the ante, or do you remember those small details.:shakeno:

They can make all the excuses they want about this money or that money but being a GM is a results business and RS got no results last year and did more harm to this franchise in one year than any GM I can remember.

And you can blame all you want with these ridiculous post, but any real football person knows Rick did the best job under the circumstances, it's always easy to do hindsight...but look at his draft class, one of the better ones we've had in years.

Jeno James, D Mac and St Clair was a poor effort, IMO, especially for what we paid. You obviously love the D Mac deal but I think he should have given the Dolphins a refund after the way he played last year and to me the biggest indictment of Spielman was that he was willing to pay an injured player a big bonus (reports were 5-6 mil) before even checking him out. That's bad business and bad scouting. I don't want him anywhere near my front office if I'm Saban.

By the end of the year the "piss poor O-line" was starting to come together and with a real offensive line coach it will come together. Spielman had to clean house on the O-line. Ever wonder why 3 of the guys Spielman got rid of could'nt find a job ANYWHERE else? He had to be right somewhat.

I agree that Spielman made some mistakes. He also had a decent draft when he was allowed to pick his players and Saban kept him..I trust Nick more then you.

Some mistakes??? That's funny. He made more mistakes in one year than good GM's make in seven. You've got extremely low standards if you buy this crap that Spielman is a bright young personnel guy. Maybe he was warped by Wanny's buy now, pay later philosophy but he did more damage when Wanny supposedly wasn't in charge last year than Wanny did as a GM.

Spielman's first year at GM if he'd continue, would've brought us closer to a championship that Wanny. He started by cleaning out the oL, something that needed to be done, he wanted Woody and Tait, but two other teams decided to overpay, and if we'd matched, we'd be in cap hell right now for real. We'd be Titians SE right now.

Bottom line is that we had 4 bad drafts and 4 mediocre to horrible offseasons in a row with the toxic twins at the helm, whatever their roles were. Its time to flush out the remaining twin and close the book on a bad chapter in Miami history.

Nick doesn't have a lot of faith in Spielman either so get off your high horse.

Nick doesn't know Spielman, it's not about faith, most people want their own ppl, but if Nick sits back and really evaluate, he'll see that Speilman is a valuable talent evaluator, whether he keeps him or not is anyone's call, but Spielman is a good talent man to have in this organizaion...that you need to believe.

 

[Iryman]

Well hell if Ogun for a 3rd and starting WR is a bad trade then saban is worse with a 2rd rd trade for Surtain

 

[Rich22]

<<Nick doesn't know Spielman, it's not about faith, most people want their own ppl, but if Nick sits back and really evaluate, he'll see that Speilman is a valuable talent evaluator, whether he keeps him or not is anyone's call, but Spielman is a good talent man to have in this organizaion...that you need to believe.>>

Nick knows enough football people to get a read on Spielman's abilities. As for his talent evaluation skills - from what I read he is organized - is that a positive enough spin? It's easy to have critique after the fact but that's all we have for now. He has done a sad job IMO. I agree they have some weapons on offense BUT it all starts up front and Miami had the worst Oline last year in the entire NFL! A starting DT falls into your lap and you give up an extra 4th to move up 1 spot to take a guy who couldn't crack the lineup of the worst line in the league? Did he really think the Vikes were going to take Carey? Did he think they were going to trade down far? C'mon!! You sit at that spot and IF Carey is taken so what - you take Wilfork. He got used and as a GM his credibility I'm sure took a bad hit after that. As for this year's draft it was all Saban - I'm sure he got some nice neat notebooks for RS though. He's gone no doubt about it - maybe he can keep a job maintaining Saban's stash of Little Debbies - he could organize the reordering of them.