The 2006 Boston Red Sox Thread

[GreenMonster]

Let Murphy play before you kill him. He's had 1 MLB game under his belt, who knows what he can do. People killed Melky Cabrera after a weekend (me included) and now look at what he's doing. Baseball is a funny game. Plus Murphy might be the Marlins' CFer next year (as rumors had been going around).

The other guys you named I'd stay way away from them. Soriano is a very good hitter, a top hitter, but the other guys like Carlos Lee, Shannon Stewart, Cliff Floyd? No thank you, I'll stick with Wily Mo and Murphy.

Difference is all those guys will cost a ton of cash that we will be much, much better spent on pitching help.. For the 12 million it will take to sign Carlos Lee or Soriano I will take Willy Mo and 7-9 million dollars in pitching...

 

[Ray Finkle]

Difference is all those guys will cost a ton of cash that we will be much, much better spent on pitching help.. For the 12 million it will take to sign Carlos Lee or Soriano I will take Willy Mo and 7-9 million dollars in pitching...

Oh I agree. Plus the Sox don't want to spend money on Mr. DL, Nixon yet they would spend money on older guys like Stewart and Floyd who are always hurt too?

Could you picture Carlos Lee in RF at Fenway for a year? Ouch.

 

[FinsNYanksFan13]

I agree, especially when you've got the wallets the Red Sox have. And lord forbid they have a spot for a guy like David Murphy to take when he comes up for good.

Seriously, there are tons of power-hitting OFs coming up in this FA market, marquee guys like Carlos Lee and Alfonso Soriano to solid vets like Shannon Stewart and Cliff Floyd to under-the-radar guys like David Dellucci and Jose Guillen.

Here's how I see it, at the trade deadline this year there were tons of outfielders available to be had (Lee, Abreu, Soriano, ect.) and there was NO PITCHING. Why, because teams aren't going to part with even a 4th or 5th starter because pitching is so hard to find. 4th and 5th starters are the difference between making and not making the playoffs, not outfiedlers who strike out a lot and have power!

 

[FaninPatsyLand]

The Sox made the right move.. and anyone who wouldn't trade a back end of the rotation guy (who wasn't particularly helpful in the postseason either, see game 3 of the '04 ALCS) for someone with Wily Mo's potential is absolutely crazy.

If Arroyo is getting bombed in the Triple AAA National League, his numbers would be worse than Jason Johnson in the AL.

And I thought that Arroyo's second half performance, combined with Wily Mo's production this year put to rest any thoughts that the Reds got the better end of this deal. Why the hell does this debate keep popping up?

 

[GreenMonster]

Here's how I see it, at the trade deadline this year there were tons of outfielders available to be had (Lee, Abreu, Soriano, ect.) and there was NO PITCHING. Why, because teams aren't going to part with even a 4th or 5th starter because pitching is so hard to find. 4th and 5th starters are the difference between making and not making the playoffs, not outfiedlers who strike out a lot and have power!

I agree, but the Sox made this move because Willy Mo is young, has 3 years of arbritration left ( I think maybe 2), and won't be making that much.. For the money that we can save by having Willy Mo patrol the outfield as opposed to Carlos Lee or any other mentioned player for the next couple of years we can find another 4th starter + a new reliever.. Sounds good to me..

 

[FaninPatsyLand]

Also, I'm not willing to concede that Arroyo is better than Kyle Snyder.

Snyder for the most part has been quite impressive since the Sox picked him up off waivers.

If we give this kid an entire year in Boston, I think there's a very good chance that he could be flat out better than Bronson.

 

[Ray Finkle]

Here's how I see it, at the trade deadline this year there were tons of outfielders available to be had (Lee, Abreu, Soriano, ect.) and there was NO PITCHING. Why, because teams aren't going to part with even a 4th or 5th starter because pitching is so hard to find. 4th and 5th starters are the difference between making and not making the playoffs, not outfiedlers who strike out a lot and have power!

The reason why those OFers were available is because they either had bad contracts (Abreu) or were in their last year of their contracts (Soriano or Lee).

However the only power hitting OFs that got traded were Abreu and Lee while Greg Maddux, Jeremy Affeld, Denny Bautista, Oliver Perez, Lidle, Kip Wells, Chacon, and Kyle Loshe. Roy Oswalt, Barry Zito, John Smoltz and Jason Scdmit were all on the block too. So I don't know what you're talking about because there were tons of 4th or 5th starters traded and even an ace/2 pitcher.

 

[FinsNYanksFan13]

The reason why those OFers were available is because they either had bad contracts (Abreu) or were in their last year of their contracts (Soriano or Lee).

However the only power hitting OFs that got traded were Abreu and Lee while Greg Maddux, Jeremy Affeld, Denny Bautista, Oliver Perez, Lidle, Kip Wells, Chacon, and Kyle Loshe. Roy Oswalt, Barry Zito, John Smoltz and Jason Scdmit were all on the block too. So I don't know what you're talking about because there were tons of 4th or 5th starters traded and even an ace/2 pitcher.

Well Oswalt, Zito, Schidmt, and Smoltz didn't go anywhere and were probably on the market because their GM's were hoping to get blown away (which they obviously weren't). Maddux was traded out of respect to him from the Cubs. They wanted him to pitch what may be his last year for a contender. Loshe, Chacon, Wells, and Perez were all 4th and 5th starters who just obviously weren't cutting it at that role already. So why would you trade for them if your in a pennant race? Does that answer your question? If your going to call Chacon, Perez, Lidle, ect. pitching available, then your must not watch much baseball. When I say pitching available, I mean guys who can have an impact on a pennant race (David Cone when the Yankees traded for him). You name all these top names who you claim were available but didn't get traded and all I can say back to you is this, if they could have been had, they would have been had, simple as that. I think Arroyo in a pennant race would be good for a team as a fourth starter. None of the guys above I would say the same about unless they just happened to catch lightining in a bottle like the Yankees did last year with Chacon!

 

[Ray Finkle]

Well Oswalt, Zito, Schidmt, and Smoltz didn't go anywhere and were probably on the market because their GM's were hoping to get blown away (which they obviously weren't). Maddux was traded out of respect to him from the Cubs. They wanted him to pitch what may be his last year for a contender. Loshe, Chacon, Wells, and Perez were all 4th and 5th starters who just obviously weren't cutting it at that role already. So why would you trade for them if your in a pennant race? Does that answer your question? If your going to call Chacon, Perez, Lidle, ect. pitching available, then your must not watch much baseball. When I say pitching available, I mean guys who can have an impact on a pennant race (David Cone when the Yankees traded for him). You name all these top names who you claim were available but didn't get traded and all I can say back to you is this, if they could have been had, they would have been had, simple as that. I think Arroyo in a pennant race would be good for a team as a fourth starter. None of the guys above I would say the same about unless they just happened to catch lightining in a bottle like the Yankees did last year with Chacon!

See you didn't say guys that make an impact on a pennant race. You just said more power hitting OFers were traded than 4th or 5th starters, which isn't true, whether the guy is a big name or makes an impact is moot for what you said. Plus how many big names get traded and don't make an impact? Carlos Lee anyone?

Who cares why Maddux got traded, the fact is he got traded. If Abreu didn't have a bad contract and Philly wanted to get rid of him, he wouldn't be a Yankee. So that's a bad example.

Why kill me about names I named that didn't get traded when you named Soriano who didn't get traded himself.

Also you say the Yankees caught lightning in a bottle with Chacon, so why say the teams this year trying to get a Loshe or Perez can't try and catch lightning in a bottle, and thus aren't available pitchers? Obviously they didn't but you can't kill the team for trying. The fact is more pitchers were traded than power hitting OFers. Whether they're big names, good or bad or made an impact isn't relevant.

Anyway this Arroyo debate is getting old. All non Sox fans and Sox haters will say the Sox shouldn't have traded the guy, and also overrating him in the process. While Sox fans who have seen the guy pitch for 3 plus years and seen Wily Mo play this year are happy with the deal. Again at the time Arroyo was traded he was 7th on the pitching rotation depth chart, and possibly 8th when Lester was called up.

 

[Alex44]

This isnt exactly news or anything but I thought it was interesting and hope Lester recovers

Sanchez thinks of Lester: Anibal Sanchez has kept Jon Lester, his former teammate in the Minor Leagues, in his thoughts the past couple of days.
Lester, 22, a rookie with the Red Sox, was diagnosed with a form of lymphoma and will start treatment this week.
Sanchez and Lester were teammates at Double-A Portland of the Eastern League last year.
"I feel bad because he's a good player and it's just terrible when a young player with good talent has something happen like that," Sanchez said. "I'm really, really sad for Jon. I know it's serious."
Sanchez, who was traded to Florida during the offseason, spoke with Lester when the Red Sox traveled to Miami for an Interleague series June 30-July 2 this year. "Last time I talked with him, we both played in Miami and I got to talk with my old friends from the Red Sox," Sanchez said.

 

[Alex44]

See you didn't say guys that make an impact on a pennant race. You just said more power hitting OFers were traded than 4th or 5th starters, which isn't true, whether the guy is a big name or makes an impact is moot for what you said. Plus how many big names get traded and don't make an impact? Carlos Lee anyone?

Who cares why Maddux got traded, the fact is he got traded. If Abreu didn't have a bad contract and Philly wanted to get rid of him, he wouldn't be a Yankee. So that's a bad example.

Why kill me about names I named that didn't get traded when you named Soriano who didn't get traded himself.

Also you say the Yankees caught lightning in a bottle with Chacon, so why say the teams this year trying to get a Loshe or Perez can't try and catch lightning in a bottle, and thus aren't available pitchers? Obviously they didn't but you can't kill the team for trying. The fact is more pitchers were traded than power hitting OFers. Whether they're big names, good or bad or made an impact isn't relevant.

Anyway this Arroyo debate is getting old. All non Sox fans and Sox haters will say the Sox shouldn't have traded the guy, and also overrating him in the process. While Sox fans who have seen the guy pitch for 3 plus years and seen Wily Mo play this year are happy with the deal. Again at the time Arroyo was traded he was 7th on the pitching rotation depth chart, and possibly 8th when Lester was called up.

Kind of like non Sox or Marlins fans dont understand the Beckett trade and assume we got screwed out of a great pitcher, when in fact IMO the deal has been pretty even so far maybe even better for us (depending on how well Beckett rebounds from this year)

 

[Ray Finkle]

Kind of like non Sox or Marlins fans dont understand the Beckett trade and assume we got screwed out of a great pitcher, when in fact IMO the deal has been pretty even so far maybe even better for us (depending on how well Beckett rebounds from this year)

Oh I agree I said at the time that if Hanley ever lives up to his potential it will be an even deal for both teams. I've seen Hanley and Sanchez enough in the minors to know what kind of players they were before the trade went down.

I mean I obviously wish I still had Hanley on my team but when you get a chance to get a 26 year old stud pitcher you give up a stud SS prospect for him.

The funny thing is people kill the Sox for both the Arroyo trade and Beckett trade yet are hypocritical in saying you can't trade a 4th starter (Arroyo) for a young OFer (Pena) because you can never have enough pitching but when the Sox go out and trade for a future ace/solid #2 when on his game (Beckett) for prospects (Hanley and Sanchez) they kill the Sox saying how could you trade the (possibly) next Miguel Tejeda? THEN they kill the Sox for not trading any of their prospects for players that wouldn't be a factor in this years playoff race, yet again kill the Sox for giving up prospects for Beckett.

It just seems like people kill the Sox for no reason but just because they don't like them.

 

[Alex44]

Oh I agree I said at the time that if Hanley ever lives up to his potential it will be an even deal for both teams. I've seen Hanley and Sanchez enough in the minors to know what kind of players they were before the trade went down.

I mean I obviously wish I still had Hanley on my team but when you get a chance to get a 26 year old stud pitcher you give up a stud SS prospect for him.

The funny thing is people kill the Sox for both the Arroyo trade and Beckett trade yet are hypocritical in saying you can't trade a 4th starter (Arroyo) for a young OFer (Pena) because you can never have enough pitching but when the Sox go out and trade for a future ace/solid #2 when on his game (Beckett) for prospects (Hanley and Sanchez) they kill the Sox saying how could you trade the (possibly) next Miguel Tejeda? THEN they kill the Sox for not trading any of their prospects for players that wouldn't be a factor in this years playoff race, yet again kill the Sox for giving up prospects for Beckett.

It just seems like people kill the Sox for no reason but just because they don't like them.

Well Anibal is 6-2 so far and has pitched great nearly every game

Hanley has been amazing, going to be a great player. He's got the average up near .280 now, 44 steals, 38 (I think) doubles, 9 triples, 13 home runs. Definitly glad to have him

Seems like an even deal so far, that works for both teams now and in the future

 

[FinsNYanksFan13]

Well Anibal is 6-2 so far and has pitched great nearly every game

Hanley has been amazing, going to be a great player. He's got the average up near .280 now, 44 steals, 38 (I think) doubles, 9 triples, 13 home runs. Definitly glad to have him

Seems like an even deal so far, that works for both teams now and in the future

I think what Mike Lowell has done for the Red Sox makes it more of an even deal then Beckett does. While Lowell's bat has faded, he's given the Red Sox plenty more then they expected with the lumber and has been better then they could have imagined with the glove. I mean Lowell's defense is ridiculous. If your looking at this deal just at what Beckett is doing compared to what the Marlins got in return, I think the Marlins are winning this deal so far. I think Lowell is what makes the deal close to even this season. We'll see what happens in the future and if Beckett figures it out but right now this deal is looking a lot better for the Marlins then it did when the deal was made!

 

[Ray Finkle]

At least some good news in Sox camp:

Red Sox signed RHP Daniel Bard from UNC, their first-round pick in the 2006 draft.