What value does Cook have to this team as far as a contract offer?

[Kyndig]

IMO you are missing the fact that there is a high probability 31 year old almost always hurt throughout his career Mostert gets injured again and is not available to us. So our offense can covet speed and we will have Achane but if no Cook and Mostert goes down your RB is now Jeff Wilson for the year with Achane getting some change up RB snaps plus whatever receiving packages McD is actually planning for him. We talk about OL depth all the time, wouldn't we like some RB depth? A proven vet stud like Cook to do the heavy lifting with your old/fragile but fast and explosive vet moving to a change of pace role much better suited to his aging body? Wilson instead of an ankle sprain away from being your starter moved to the #3 role? Achane totally free to be used in whatever package McD likes and not have to depend on a smaller sized rookie to carry say half or more of your traditional RB duties if Cook is not around and Mostert were to go down?

Then add in the fact if McD is as smart as we all think, he is planning on running the damn ball more now to protect Tua's health and really the #1 factor in whether we will compete for a SB this year or not. They have to be planning for more balance and even protective game planning at this point and again, not to beat this dead horse but we need the depth. I really like Mostert and how he plays but you can not depend on him, as a fantasy owner that year after year watched him go to the shelf you just can't. We got the rookie speed playmaker, we have an unspectacular yet reliable steady eddie vet in Wilson, and we do have Mostert, for now, but I think you have to plan as if you don't have Mostert and get another guy so you hopefully always have at least one of them ready to go with the other supporting pieces.

Tua's health is the #1 priority this year and the best way to do that is with the run game. For a team on the verge of really competing and given the makeup of our current RB room I think Cook makes a lot of sense. I hope they can work out the figures. I can tell you our AFC East opponents will not be pleased at all to see Dalvin Cook lining up in our backfield behind Tua with Hill on one side and Waddle on the other and any number of skill guys in the slot (Achane, Berrios, Anderson, etc). Good luck defenses playing the chess match against those pieces all game long.

Meh. He’s a good back, he’s older. 4.53, so not a burner. We have 3 really good backs that are faster with a comparable (although Achane is a rookie) YPC if not even higher. Adding a 4th back, replacing Gaskin I suppose which cook would be an upgrade, but it depends upon how much he costs, how much he has in the tank, and quite frankly how he would fit in here. He’s a decent back and if the FO wants to get him then they would agree with you and your points. if they don’t want to get him, then the reason is because they could use that cap money on something else more impactful to the team in the future or carry it into next year because our running back room is pretty electric as long as Achane pans out and plays the way we think he will. I just don’t see it…

 

[Marino2.0]

I think I can safely say most would agree Edmunds was a mistake and overpay. That's the basis on which I reject that comp.

I'm not questioning Cook's potential value as a whole, in a league wide frame of reference. He may, indeed, be worth is to other teams in their opinions.

I question what he is worth to our team, specifically.

We are never going to see eye to eye on this basic philosophical difference.

But then address the Keion Crossen and Dan Feeney point. We will be paying those two a combined $6.4 million this season. Isn’t Dalvin Cook potentially worth (much) more to the 2023 Dolphins than a backup center and special teams gunner?

And I recognize that you can find bad contracts on every team, but those are contracts we decided we wanted this off-season. Feeney we signed this off-season, and Crossen’s cap hit is zero if we cut him, so we have decided that at least through training camp, we potentially like him at that price tag.

Anyway, I agree that we’re not going to see eye to eye on this any time soon. But hopefully we get the chance to do so eventually. If Dalvin Cook does come to Miami, and he revitalizes our running game the way Tyreek revitalized our passing game, I doubt either of us will care whether he’s making 5 or 8 million per year.

 

[Marino2.0]

Meh. He’s a good back, he’s older. 4.53, so not a burner. We have 3 really good backs that are faster with a comparable (although Achane is a rookie) YPC if not even higher. Adding a 4th back, replacing Gaskin I suppose which cook would be an upgrade, but it depends upon how much he costs, how much he has in the tank, and quite frankly how he would fit in here. He’s a decent back and if the FO wants to get him then they would agree with you and your points. if they don’t want to get him, then the reason is because they could use that cap money on something else more impactful to the team in the future or carry it into next year because our running back room is pretty electric as long as Achane pans out and plays the way we think he will. I just don’t see it…

If anybody else in the league viewed Mostert or Wilson as electric, wouldn’t they have gotten bigger contracts?

Wilson got two years, $6 million with about $2.5 million guaranteed. Mostert got two years, $5.6 million with $2.2 million guaranteed.

They are each getting paid less than Jamaal Williams, Samaje Perine and Alexander Mattison, and only slightly more than Justice Hill and James Robinson—all of whom also signed deals this off-season.

I think if you polled GMs, they would rank our RB situation as bottom 10 in the NFL. Mostert and Wilson are backup quality players.

 

[Mach2]

But then address the Keion Crossen and Dan Feeney point. We will be paying those two a combined $6.4 million this season. Isn’t Dalvin Cook potentially worth (much) more to the 2023 Dolphins than a backup center and special teams gunner?

And I recognize that you can find bad contracts on every team, but those are contracts we decided we wanted this off-season. Feeney we signed this off-season, and Crossen’s cap hit is zero if we cut him, so we have decided that at least through training camp, we potentially like him at that price tag.

Anyway, I agree that we’re not going to see eye to eye on this any time soon. But hopefully we get the chance to do so eventually. If Dalvin Cook does come to Miami, and he revitalizes our running game the way Tyreek revitalized our passing game, I doubt either of us will care whether he’s making 5 or 8 million per year.

What's the higher market value position? Oline or RB? Corner or RB?

Apples and oranges. An average Tackle or Corner is going to be paid more than a very good RB. Not saying it's philosophically right or wrong, but it is what it is.

I think you are correct in the case of Crossen. Barring injury to one of our top guys during TC he won't be on the roster. He is basically a free insurance policy at this point. He could have a 10m dollar contract. If none of it is guaranteed, it's meaningless.

 

[Marino2.0]

What's the higher market value position? Oline or RB? Corner or RB?

Apples and oranges. An average Tackle or Corner is going to be paid more than a very good RB. Not saying it's philosophically right or wrong, but it is what it is.

I think you are correct in the case of Crossen. Barring injury to one of our top guys during TC he won't be on the roster. He is basically a free insurance policy at this point. He could have a 10m dollar contract. If none of it is guaranteed, it's meaningless.

It’s not apples and oranges—it’s a straight comparison of value for the 2023 Dolphins.

You have the choice to spend $6.4 million on Feeney and Crossen while keeping Salvon Ahmed as RB4, or you can give that $6.4 million to Cook instead and fill the backup center and special teams gunner role with veterans on minimum/near-minimum deals. Which would you choose?

OL and CB are more expensive than RB, sure, but backup centers aren’t expensive. Most teams fill the backup center role with a UDFA or veteran on a minimum contract. And special teams gunners/CB6s aren’t expensive, either. Crossen fills the exact same role as Justin Bethel and/or Elijah Campbell, both of whom are on minimum deals. We are very unusual in our insistence on signing special teams players to $2-4 million deals every year.

So what is a better use of $6.4 million?

The point is that value is contextual. We spend equivalent money on a lot of players who have far less impact than Dalvin Cook would, and we do it every year. Whether it’s Cethan Carter and Clay Fejedelem, Keion Crossen and Dan Feeney, or Ced Wilson and Will Fuller, we (like every other team) spend a ton of money that we get very little return on. That’s because you very rarely find “sure things” in free agency or the trade market at reasonable prices.

Dalvin Cook is a 27-year old coming off four consecutive Pro Bowls. He is as close to a sure thing as exists in the NFL. I don’t understand penny pinching between $5M, $7M, $8.5M. At any of those price points, he will be far more impactful than any number of players we are paying the same or more. And it’s not like that price tag is just too rich for our blood at a non-premium position. We gave Chase freaking Edmonds basically the same contract last year.

 

[Kyndig]

If anybody else in the league viewed Mostert or Wilson as electric, wouldn’t they have gotten bigger contracts?

Wilson got two years, $6 million with about $2.5 million guaranteed. Mostert got two years, $5.6 million with $2.2 million guaranteed.

They are each getting paid less than Jamaal Williams, Samaje Perine and Alexander Mattison, and only slightly more than Justice Hill and James Robinson—all of whom also signed deals this off-season.

I think if you polled GMs, they would rank our RB situation as bottom 10 in the NFL. Mostert and Wilson are backup quality players.

Umm…running backs don’t get big contracts except for a handful that have the benefit of a foolish owner or GM. Mostert is one of the fastest guys in the league as is Achane and well of course waddle and Hill. Both of those players, Mostert & Wilson are quality starters with a top end yards per carry. Our running game would’ve been better last year, not with an upgrade of backs, but with calling more running plays.

I‘m telling you right now, injuries aside, Mostert & Achane are the fastest duo in the backfield in nfl already before they even step foot on the field together. And Jeff Wilson runs hard, but if you want to judge a running back By their contract then clearly you don’t understand the league, or at least the value on that position that the league puts on it.

The hell goin on…

 

[Marino2.0]

Umm…running backs don’t get big contracts except for a handful that have the benefit of a foolish owner or GM. Mostert is one of the fastest guys in the league as is Achane and well of course waddle and Hill. Both of those players, Mostert & Wilson are quality starters with a top end yards per carry. Our running game would’ve been better last year, not with an upgrade of backs, but with calling more running plays.

I‘m telling you right now, injuries aside, Mostert & Achane are the fastest duo in the backfield in nfl already before they even step foot on the field together. And Jeff Wilson runs hard, but if you want to judge a running back By their contract then clearly you don’t understand the league, or at least the value on that position that the league puts on it.

The hell goin on…

I just named five completely mediocre running backs who got equivalent deals this exact same off-season. Miles Sanders and David Montgomery both got far more than both Mostert and Wilson combined, also this off-season.

You call Mostert and Wilson “quality starters,” but Mostert was a 30-year old with 9 career starts going into last season. Jeff Wilson had 5 career starts before joining the Dolphins.

Neither player was ever regarded as a starter before the Dolphins, and neither player was desired or paid by any other team after this season.

They are not highly regarded players. They are career backups who fit our system. Nothing more.

 

[Mach2]

I just named five completely mediocre running backs who got equivalent deals this exact same off-season. Miles Sanders and David Montgomery both got far more than both Mostert and Wilson combined, also this off-season.

You call Mostert and Wilson “quality starters,” but Mostert was a 30-year old with 9 career starts going into last season. Jeff Wilson had 5 career starts before joining the Dolphins.

Neither player was ever regarded as a starter before the Dolphins, and neither player was desired or paid by any other team after this season.

They are not highly regarded players. They are career backups who fit our system. Nothing more.

What do you make of the poll numbers?

 

[Dynastybuilder]

There are other factors at play aside from money. Miami is a top contender and his home town team.

Maybe he doesn't get many great offers? I could see him taking a 1 year deal.

 

[Marino2.0]

What do you make of the poll numbers?

I think they demonstrate that a lot of our board doesn’t understand the finances of the NFL and/or the salary cap. Which isn’t surprising, as they are pretty arcane.

Cook is going to sign in the very near future, and it is absolutely, definitely going to be for more than $4-5 million per year.

And it may very well be with the Dolphins. We may even give up a late round pick for the privilege.

 

[Marino2.0]

I think they demonstrate that a lot of our board doesn’t understand the finances of the NFL and/or the salary cap. Which isn’t surprising, as they are pretty arcane.

Cook is going to sign in the very near future, and it is absolutely, definitely going to be for more than $4-5 million per year.

And it may very well be with the Dolphins. We may even give up a late round pick for the privilege.

By the way, if/when that happens, within a few months 90% of the people saying we shouldn’t be paying Cook more than $5 million will be saying he’s the best RB in the AFC and worrying about how we’re going to afford him/replace him in the future.

Nature of the beast. Fans pretty much exclusively overvalue their own team’s players and undervalue players on other teams.

 

[Avigatorx]

What do you make of the poll numbers?

Seems to me people are buying into the Achane hype. I hope they are all right and he is amazing, but im not falling in love with a guy that has 0 nfl starts.

Being successful in college does not always equate to being successful at the NFL level.

 

[DOC ZINGO]

There wasn’t a lot of interest generated for RBs Ekeler, Elliott, Hunt or Fournette, so maybe Miami can get Cook (IF RELEASED) on the cheaper side should they choose to have any interest in him.
Would like to have him on the Phins, we’ll have to see what happens in the next coming days.

 

[Fred Bear]

I like him but so many seem to be enthralled on him.. tomorrow should say

 

[Marino2.0]

Seems to me people are buying into the Achane hype. I hope they are all right and he is amazing, but im not falling in love with a guy that has 0 nfl starts.

Being successful in college does not always equate to being successful at the NFL level.

Ironic if true because I was the board’s biggest Achane fan for months and got a lot of crap about how he’s too small and didn’t fit our need for a three-down back who can excel in short yardage situations.

For what it’s worth, I remain extremely high on Achane. But he’s a 190-pound rookie. I see him getting 6-10 touches per game maximum in the early going, and maybe 12 per game on the very high end if he proves to be a stellar rookie.

I’m obviously just much lower on Mostert and Wilson than most are. I see Mostert as a 31 year old, injury prone backup and Wilson as a third string quality player.