Who do you want as Head Coach in 2015 ?

[trojanma]

I'd love to see the #s backing that up

Great Question. Tried to go back and look at this a little more closely. Its a harder question than I first realized just because sometimes it is hard to define what is success and what category to put people in. Plus external factors(the overall dysfunction of a team) can bring down a good coach.

I will distill this down a little into three main categories: Pro Coordinator(must have no pro HC experience), College HC, Retread(former Pro HC).

2013-2010
Successful Coordinators that promoted
Chuck Pagano - hard to judge his ability since Arians ran the show in year one and he got a Qb prodigy to fall in his lap.
Bruce Arians
Ron Rivera - this could be debated
Gus Bradley


Coordinators that failed
Chudzinski - unfair
Philbin - at this point he is on this list
Dennis Allen - probably woefully underqualified
Leslie Frazier
Pat Shurmur
Mike Munchak
Hue Jackson
Mike Mularkey - technically a retread.

College Coaches that succeeded
Jim Harbaugh
Pete Carroll - I know he is a retread but for all intensive purposes he is a college coach.
Chip Kelley

Failed
Greg Schiano
Chan Gailey - only technically a college HC. he was a primarily a pro coordinator and once pro HC.
Others before my sample
Saban and Spurrier.

Retreads
Succeeded
Fox
Reid

Failed
Shanahan
Fisher

 

[Tannenbombs]

Great Question. Tried to go back and look at this a little more closely. Its a harder question than I first realized just because sometimes it is hard to define what is success and what category to put people in. Plus external factors(the overall dysfunction of a team) can bring down a good coach.

I will distill this down a little into three main categories: Pro Coordinator(must have no pro HC experience), College HC, Retread(former Pro HC).

2013-2010
Successful Coordinators that promoted
Chuck Pagano - hard to judge his ability since Arians ran the show in year one and he got a Qb prodigy to fall in his lap.
Bruce Arians
Ron Rivera - this could be debated
Gus Bradley


Coordinators that failed
Chudzinski - unfair
Philbin - at this point he is on this list
Dennis Allen - probably woefully underqualified
Leslie Frazier
Pat Shurmur
Mike Munchak
Hue Jackson
Mike Mularkey - technically a retread.

College Coaches that succeeded
Jim Harbaugh
Pete Carroll - I know he is a retread but for all intensive purposes he is a college coach.
Chip Kelley

Failed
Greg Schiano
Chan Gailey - only technically a college HC. he was a primarily a pro coordinator and once pro HC.
Others before my sample
Saban and Spurrier.

Retreads
Succeeded
Fox
Reid

Failed
Shanahan
Fisher

Bruce Arians was the HC at Temple so technically he is a college guy as well

 

[trojanma]

I know but he was much more a Pro Coordinator than college HC. The temple thing was in the 80's so ancient history. I gave him the benefit of the doubt.

 

[Sons Of Shula]

Bruce Arians was the HC at Temple so technically he is a college guy as well

That experience means nothing. Trust me, I'm a Canes fan.

 

[matt11390]

A name that has had success as a college HC and pro coordinator is Butch Davis. He failed as a pro HC in Cleveland but he has a lot of experience.

 

[trojanma]

Its impossible to look at this scientifically. It was a fun exercise, though.
The big issue is that college coaches self select.
Basically any pro coordinator will say yes to HC job. Unless he has been a HC before.
College coaches often turn down pro offers. So probably only the best of the best candidates get through.
Plus so many of the failures come from crappy regimes. Cleveland and Oakland are riddled with failed coaches.

I used to be anti college coaches but Pete Carroll changed my mind. He is such an innovator in the NFL. USC allowed him to grow beyond the defensive genius moniker that he already had back when he was the coach of the NYJ.

Ideally you want hybrids.
Guys that are College HC that have some pro background so that the NFL isn't completely alien to them.
Or Pro Coordinators that have a SUCCESSFULL run as a HC somewhere.

 

[SkapePhin]

Its impossible to look at this scientifically. It was a fun exercise, though.
The big issue is that college coaches self select.
Basically any pro coordinator will say yes to HC job. Unless he has been a HC before.
College coaches often turn down pro offers. So probably only the best of the best candidates get through.
Plus so many of the failures come from crappy regimes. Cleveland and Oakland are riddled with failed coaches.

I used to be anti college coaches but Pete Carroll changed my mind. He is such an innovator in the NFL. USC allowed him to grow beyond the defensive genius moniker that he already had back when he was the coach of the NYJ.

Ideally you want hybrids.
Guys that are College HC that have some pro background so that the NFL isn't completely alien to them.
Or Pro Coordinators that have a SUCCESSFULL run as a HC somewhere.

David Shaw

 

[trojanma]

David Shaw

Yes he is my choice as well.

 

[Highzenga]

Criticism of Harbaugh is laughable. He does nothing but win, and win the right way. He does nothing but develop qb's to the best of their abilities. He's competitive and a former NFL quarterback who demands respect. His teams play physical and are well rounded. 2 NFC championships and a super bowl appearance after taking over a 6-10 team. He's proven at the NFL level.

We do not need any damn trainees in the head coach's office. Look at Philbie's debacle from this week. That's what a trainee looks like.

People criticizing Harbaugh have an axe to grind with his personality. That's not why you don't like a coach. Shula was a hard ass, smart, and he was driven. He won. Sparano was a hard worker but a moron. Philbie is an administrator. Harbaugh has the Shula-like traits. He would be a massive upgrade and anyone thinking otherwise is fooling himself.

Quinn will need training as a head man. Who knows what he can do as a head coach. Harbaugh is an outstanding coach. Beyond all that, this team badly needs a tremendous leader. Harbaugh is that guy. Sumlin has those traits. Malzahn is a schemer who can win different ways and a smart guy. We need a high end coach. Not an unproven coordinator.

I agree 100%. Dolphans would be lucky if Harbaugh was our coach. Also, he's not going to Michigan, he's an NFL guy. I know the raiders are a possibility but we have more talent. I can't believe Dolphin fans are against the possibility of a proven winner to be the coach. Do we have to work with him? I think he could do wonders with T-Hill. Look at Kaepernick, he makes horrible decisions and he went 2 NFC title games.

 

[Highzenga]

The Coach Czar never worked well for us with Wanny or Satan. A case can be made that Parcells was the defacto coach also and look at the on and off field staff he put in as well. Ain't working in St Louis either with Coach Mediocre dictating the decisions through Les Snead his handmaiden.

Much better to give Hickey, who's done a pretty good job considering with what he's had to work, the benefit of the doubt and let him hire the next coach. Harbaugh is a Saban like raving loon and the last guy to whom I want to give the key to the kingdom! Now if Hickey in his wisdom wants to hire and work with him, now that's another story entirely.

LMFAO! You want to leave our beloved franchise in Dennis Hickey's hands? Our 5th choice? No doubt, Hickey seems better than Ireland, but that's not saying much. Raise your standards. Parcells failed because he left all responsibilities to Sparano/Ireland. If he was committed to his job, maybe it would be different. I agree that HC czars rarely work these days, but if Harbaugh says that he wants Tom Gamble, then send Hickey home!

 

[Highzenga]

You fools actually think Dan Qunn is responsible for seattle's defense? Have you forgotten about Gus Bradley? The real genius in Seattle is Pete Carroll. Dan Quinn is to defense; what Joe Philbin is to offense. Let's not make the same mistake twice please.

 

[j-off-her-doll]

You fools actually think Dan Qunn is responsible for seattle's defense? Have you forgotten about Gus Bradley? The real genius in Seattle is Pete Carroll. Dan Quinn is to defense; what Joe Philbin is to offense. Let's not make the same mistake twice please.

I addressed this in an early post, but I agree that it bears consideration. Still, Carroll - based on what I've observed - gets his guys on the same page and lets them coach. You can see this by the difference in Seattle's D from 2012 to 2013 - not just in performance but strategy. In 2012, under Bradley, Seattle used the Over front much more than they did in 2013. So while Carroll is clearly the visionary in that organization, Quinn was given the rope to leave his imprint on that D, and (with the added talent) he improved the unit.

Does that mean he's going to be a great HC? No. But the guy clearly knows how to coach a D.

 

[Sons Of Shula]

You fools actually think Dan Qunn is responsible for seattle's defense? Have you forgotten about Gus Bradley? The real genius in Seattle is Pete Carroll. Dan Quinn is to defense; what Joe Philbin is to offense. Let's not make the same mistake twice please.

A fool would bypass his past success in his other positions with other teams as well. More recently of that with the defense of the Florida Gators.

I also wasn't aware that it was Gus Bradley who coached the Seahawks defense to help Seattle win a Super Bowl. If that's your line of thinking, than you can't be be sold on Harbaugh, whom inherited the talent at San Fran. Sure, Harbaugh helped coach that talent to reach far into the post season and a SB appearance, but you cant have it both ways in trying to rationalize that Dan Quinn had nothing to do with Seattle's defensive dominance. Don't be that idiot in making generalized assumptions.

 

[Tannenbombs]

Dan Quinn > any college coach

And if you're going after a college coach, why am I the only one promoting Jimbo? FSU was in horrible condition when he took over and in 4 years won a national championship. Is 4-0 in bowl games. And has helped develop 4 first round Quarterbacks and has coached under Bobby Bowden and Nick Saban. Jamarcuss Russell and Ponder were no doubt busts. EJ was a reach and isn't a franchise QB or game manager. But the point is that Jamarcus, Ponder and EJ were pretty much developed into as good as players as they were going to become. He also has an offense that will translate to the NFL. Jamarcus Russell was just lazy and addicted to promethazine and codeine. Jimbo maximizes the play of his quarterbacks, is an outstanding leader, and has a vision and knows how to build a culture and a program. He's better at those traits than any college coach in the country. I don't think he will leave but he is more likely to than Shaw or Malzahn.

 

[TheWalrus]

I addressed this in an early post, but I agree that it bears consideration. Still, Carroll - based on what I've observed - gets his guys on the same page and lets them coach. You can see this by the difference in Seattle's D from 2012 to 2013 - not just in performance but strategy. In 2012, under Bradley, Seattle used the Over front much more than they did in 2013. So while Carroll is clearly the visionary in that organization, Quinn was given the rope to leave his imprint on that D, and (with the added talent) he improved the unit.

Does that mean he's going to be a great HC? No. But the guy clearly knows how to coach a D.

Seattle's D is more than just an Over front. They use a combination of various gap techniques (Red Bryant playing a 5 tech, if memory serves, along a front with a three and one tech, or something like that) as part of an Over look, along with some other variations. Bobby Wagner and Kam Chancellor both give them a lot of schematic flexibility in that front seven. Wagner gives Seattle the same nickle/base flexibility that Navarro Bowman gives San Fran while Chancellor is basically an overgrown LeRoy Butler or Steve Atwater and allowed to play that same basic rover position he did so well at Virginia Tech (which isn't something he'd be allowed to do for most teams).

I'm not 100% up to speed on the specific fronts they were favoring last year, though. I read a schematic breakdown on that defense about two years back that went into it in detail. Highly innovative, though I still think it all goes back to Earl Thomas being able to consistently cover sideline to sideline in man free. Once you can play an eight man box consistently against 11 personnel you're really cooking with gas as a defensive coordinator.

Do you have an article handy on what Quinn specifically brought to the table last year? I'd like to read it.

---------- Post added at 08:45 PM ---------- Previous post was at 08:44 PM ----------

Dan Quinn > any college coach

And if you're going after a college coach, why am I the only one promoting Jimbo? FSU was in horrible condition when he took over and in 4 years won a national championship. Is 4-0 in bowl games. And has helped develop 4 first round Quarterbacks and has coached under Bobby Bowden and Nick Saban. Jamarcuss Russell and Ponder were no doubt busts. EJ was a reach and isn't a franchise QB or game manager. But the point is that Jamarcus, Ponder and EJ were pretty much developed into as good as players as they were going to become. He also has an offense that will translate to the NFL. Jamarcus Russell was just lazy and addicted to promethazine and codeine. Jimbo maximizes the play of his quarterbacks, is an outstanding leader, and has a vision and knows how to build a culture and a program. He's better at those traits than any college coach in the country. I don't think he will leave but he is more likely to than Shaw or Malzahn.

Shirley you can't be serious.