Why Not Haskins?

Discussion in 'NFL Draft Forum' started by finomenal, Apr 17, 2019.

  1. finomenal

    finomenal FinHeaven VIP Finheaven VIP

    Joined:
    Jan 2009
    Messages:
    8,601
    Likes Received:
    3,623
    Trophy Points:
    113
    When I first started looking at QBs in the upcoming draft, Haskins intrigued me. I don't watch college football much, but I saw some of his film. Watching him dominate vs a top ranked Michigan defense was exciting! The more I read about him, I see the primary knocks on him are pocket presence when things break down and his lack of mobility.

    The closer we get to the draft, I'm wondering why the Dolphins shouldn't draft him. The lack of mobility will likely always be an issue, but we've seen QBs play at a high level whether they're mobile or not. The pocket presence knock is a concern, but he only started one season! I think it's understandable that he'd still be a little raw.

    Maybe the Dolphins feel they can clean up the pocket presence issue. I can see a scenario where Jerry Schuplinski (The new QB coach from New England) makes a case, giving a detailed explanation as to how he'd fix the deficiencies.

    Just another example of why the draft is so exciting. Can't wait till next week.
     
  2. Nappy Roots

    Nappy Roots Da Dalphins

    Joined:
    Nov 2004
    Messages:
    15,636
    Likes Received:
    648
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Lack of being able to make off time throws. Lack of mobility within the pocket. Potential lack of work ethic?? How many NFL throws did he make last year, in comparison to lets say, Drew Lock? I said a month ago that I wouldn't draft Haskins in the top half of the first. That is taking in the fact that the league over drafts QB. Too many read flags for me.
     
    ckparrothead and finomenal like this.
  3. TraderJoe

    TraderJoe FinHeaven VIP

    Joined:
    Jan 2007
    Messages:
    752
    Likes Received:
    379
    Trophy Points:
    63
    I agree with Nappy.

    He is intriguing but he is rumored to be dropping down draft boards for the reasons Nappy mentioned.

    Some have also argued that he played with great talent which helped his stats as well as many of his throws were very short and the receivers turned them into big gains further helping the stat line.

    The funny thing about the work ethic concerns is that he was rumored to have a very good one but then apparently showed up at the combine looking soft and then worse at his pro day.
     
  4. nick1

    nick1 I am Groot Moderator Finheaven VIP Donator

    Joined:
    Jan 2004
    Messages:
    25,919
    Likes Received:
    5,783
    Trophy Points:
    113
    He made much more then Lock lets be real. Lock is so damned inaccurate. I wouldn't take lock in the top 20
     
    rickd13 and finomenal like this.
  5. Danny

    Danny Finheaven VIP Finheaven VIP

    Joined:
    Apr 2003
    Messages:
    26,798
    Likes Received:
    17,146
    Trophy Points:
    113
    There are concerns there. I still say build both lines and get our QB in 2020.
     
  6. russianbear

    russianbear FinHeaven VIP Finheaven VIP

    Joined:
    Sep 2011
    Messages:
    5,185
    Likes Received:
    1,450
    Trophy Points:
    113
    The only reason we shouldn't draft him is if he isn't there at 13, IMO.

    I'm not banging the table to move up and grab him but I don't buy the work ethic talk, and so what if he played on a talented team? His production was outstanding.

    Mobility is nice for a QB to have, but isn't some sort of requirement. There's a long list of QBs who won't beat you with their legs and are still Canton bound.
     
  7. nick1

    nick1 I am Groot Moderator Finheaven VIP Donator

    Joined:
    Jan 2004
    Messages:
    25,919
    Likes Received:
    5,783
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Hes the most accurate QB in the draft. I really don't get the dislike. He has superb ball placement and there's no reason to question his work ethic unless you are convinced not to like him
     
  8. Nappy Roots

    Nappy Roots Da Dalphins

    Joined:
    Nov 2004
    Messages:
    15,636
    Likes Received:
    648
    Trophy Points:
    113
    He does have nice ball placement. However, to say he made more NFL throws than Lock is just false. Haskins completion percentage is inflated because of the offense he was in, that is not debatable. If you put Lock in that offense, his completion percentage would sky rocket. Lock is very much in the Matt Ryan area coming out. Pro style, down the field passing, with less than great talent around him, made him look more inaccurate then he truly was.
     
    nick1 likes this.
  9. Danny

    Danny Finheaven VIP Finheaven VIP

    Joined:
    Apr 2003
    Messages:
    26,798
    Likes Received:
    17,146
    Trophy Points:
    113
    he did look a little fat in the combine and his pro day.......had his hands on his hips 5 minutes into it
     
    nick1 likes this.
  10. finomenal

    finomenal FinHeaven VIP Finheaven VIP

    Joined:
    Jan 2009
    Messages:
    8,601
    Likes Received:
    3,623
    Trophy Points:
    113
    If you don’t feel strongly enough about him to move up, then why draft him at all? If you draft a quarterback in the first round, it’s to be a starter.
     
    Danny likes this.
  11. TedSlimmJr

    TedSlimmJr Hartselle Tigers (15-0) 5-A State Champ

    Joined:
    Jul 2008
    Messages:
    11,143
    Likes Received:
    3,320
    Trophy Points:
    113
    This is just not accurate my friend. Matt Ryan literally had zero skill position talent around him. Zero. Not a single player even draftable. Heck, not even good enough to really get a look in an NFL camp. Nobody. All he had was Gosder Cherilus at one tackle spot and a true freshman Anthony Castonzo at the other tackle spot. Matt Ryan literally led that team to the #2 ranking in the country in November of that year.

    Emanuel Hall, Johnathan Johnson, Albert Okwuegbunam, Kendall Blanton, Damarea Crockett, Larry Rountree, Russell Hansbrough, J'Mon Moore, Paul Adams, Tre'Vour Wallace-Simms, Yasir Durant, etc. I mean the talent at Missouri Drew Lock has is not even comparable. If there's a gripe to be had, it's probably the talent around him wishing they had a winner at the QB position. Even Maty Mauk led Missouri to appearances in the SEC Championship Game in back to back seasons the 2 years before Lock took over.
     
    rickd13 and j-off-her-doll like this.
  12. Birdmond

    Birdmond FinHeaven VIP Finheaven VIP Donator

    Joined:
    Nov 2012
    Messages:
    3,082
    Likes Received:
    1,634
    Trophy Points:
    113
    If Haskins is there at 13 I’m in.
     
    HeavenCent likes this.
  13. Nappy Roots

    Nappy Roots Da Dalphins

    Joined:
    Nov 2004
    Messages:
    15,636
    Likes Received:
    648
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Thats cool Ted. You can name all the players you want. But the offensive line was bad at blocking and outside of Hall, his targets not only struggled to separate, but also catch the ball. Talent means nothing when it plays like ****.

    Matt Ryan played an awful schedule to get to #2. While at #2, he scored 14 against VT. Lost to a bad FSU team. Lost to a bad Maryland team. Then eventually got blown out against VT in the ACC championship game and then squeaked by a bad Michigan St team in the bowl game. Outside of VT the ACC was trash that year.

    Boston Colleges defense was ranked #20 in the country...their offense..#56.
    Missouri under Lock defense was ranked #50 in the country..their offense..#18

    So dont feed the line that Matt Ryan was simply the winner that Lock wasnt.
     
  14. Nappy Roots

    Nappy Roots Da Dalphins

    Joined:
    Nov 2004
    Messages:
    15,636
    Likes Received:
    648
    Trophy Points:
    113
    With those things said, I do think Ryan had less NFL talent and was asked to shoulder the load. I also thought Ryan was a little more polished coming out. But still...
     
  15. ckparrothead

    ckparrothead Premium Member

    Joined:
    May 2002
    Messages:
    50,956
    Likes Received:
    4,574
    Trophy Points:
    113
    I'll put it this way.

    To the extent that I'm game for a look at Dwayne Haskins at 13 overall, it's for the exact same reasons that in the past I've been game for a look at many other QBs in the 1st/2nd round that I considered to be flawed creatures. Essentially, if I've got nobody at the position, I'll always err on the side of taking too many gambles at that position as opposed to taking too few gambles.

    But I don't love Dwayne Haskins. I like him. But I don't love him. I never have.

    He's not mobile. He had really good receivers (fast as hell, coached really well) inflating him. He's a one-year guy. His accuracy goes to sh-t when he can't get his feet pointed. Too often the ball comes off his hand funny with no spin, like a knuckleball. He's heavy-limbed. He rarely, rarely threw the football with legit pro velocity. I saw it happen basically in one half of one game. That's it. He won't have it that easy in the pros. He'll have to drive the ball faster into tighter windows, and what happens when he tries that more consistently?

    He got fat and slow because he couldn't be bothered to train like an athlete, even as he entered a period where he was supposed to work as hard as he could because the NFL were watching. Look at his 2017 tape versus his 2018 tape and then his Combine, and there's a steady trend there. Not a good one. He shows up at his own pro day sucking wind with his hands on his hips literally five minutes into the throwing session.

    If it sounds like I'm being harsh on him, that's because trying to be among the best in the world at quarterbacking is pretty hard. It's one of the hardest things to do in sport. If you're going to do it, I want to be overwhelmed by your weapons and how you can make the game that is really not simple look easy. Frankly, that's not what I get from him.

    If you look at last year's class of QBs you had Baker Mayfield who had everything (IMO), and then three guys who had flaws. The three that had flaws floundered, and it took a guy with as much talent as Baker Mayfield to actually go out there and have success and establish himself as an up-and-coming NFL starter.

    That's how high the bar is. Is that a bar that Dwayne Haskins meets? No.
     
    Last edited: Apr 17, 2019

Share This Page