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boomer - how do grade this years hurricane crop - any sleepers? also how do you grade gore and parrish if they come out? -thanx for the input




"license to kill gophers by the govt. of the united nations... to kill, you must know your enemy, and in this case my enemy is a varmint... they're like the vietcong - varmintcong!"
 
BSQX4 said:
Simon, congratulations on the "ask Boomer" site. Your vast knowledge is always informative and without bias. Sorry if you've done this already but have you listed your top 10 prospects coming out this year? Anyways, Happiest Holidays and I'm thrilled that you and your wife will have first Christmas together with your brand new baby. May all blessings come your way.

Thanks mate...very kind of you to say so.

I will knock a top 10 out in the next day or so if that's OK. I have to sit down and re-evaluate. It's really difficult because I don't see a #1 talent. And you always need a starting point. I think up until the Virginia Tech game Antrel Rolle would be my number one. But the Hokies highlighted some real deficiencies in #6's game - his lack of top end speed for one. In fact some scouts see him falling a lot more than you might think. I'm not sure I see that - him falling too far - but what one guy thinks can be very different to what another guy thinks.

I think essentially I am struggling to find a starting point for the top 10. I like Leinart, but is he the best player? Is he even coming out? I like the running back class a lot, but again, I don't even know in my own mind who I like the best....my feelings change on that almost daily. I like Bray Edwards but he's not the best overall player and neither is Mike Williams. Ferguson is a stud, but #1? And will he declare? Heath Miller? Same situation. The ends are tremendous - James, Spears, Kiwanuku, Pollack....is there a 1 in there? Derrick Johnson is a heck of a player, but he can be schemed against and his inability to shed blocks and his utter dedication to making every play can leave him overpursuing or caught up in trash. The corners are strong, but again.....and Thomas Davis is the best safety, but again he's not the best player.

It's a toughie. A real toughie.

Happy Holidays to you and thanks again for the kind sentiments.
 
Boomer said:
Hey Mark....Mike Vick. OK first off I saw him quite a bit as a Hokie and was thoroughly blown away with his talent. He has clearly worked very hard as a passer since he came to the NFL but he's a long way off being the finished product.

To my mind he is the best player at QB in the NFL but he isn't the best QB in the NFL. I hope that makes sense. He has an ability to run the like of which no-one has ever seen and that ability would make about 95% of starting tailbacks in the league jealous. He has more speed than anyone I think I have ever seen. The way he can split defenders with his pace is staggering. And I KNOW FOR A FACT that no-one will want to be playing Atlanta come the playoffs because he is the one player that can take over a game and win it. I know Peyton and Brady and Favre can dictate games like few others before them, but the dual threat ability that #7 has makes his simply lethal.

Going back to my initial point about him being the best player but not the best QB.....what I mean is that he doesn't have the passing ability of a Manning or a Pennington, but he has the TOTAL package that sets him aside.

To your questions.....

1. 10 yards or less - He has become much better in this short range area. He doesn't try and throw the skin off the ball as much, he has developed more touch, more of a catcheable ball and works through his checks better than he did. He has struggled to pick up this new offense that Gregg Knapp has installed because he still - and I think always will have - the look deep/take off nature. I hope they don't knock that out of him. I think there is a sense of the Falcons wanting to find a happy medium between keeping him on a leash and making sure he doesn't get hurt and allowing him to do what comes naturally, which is just to play sandlot ball. His delivery in the short range is still quite pronounced, and at times you almost feel that he is torn between doing what his coaches want and just getting back to that sandlot kid. There is still room for improvement here, but he is learning to throw balls to suit situations. To that end, watch the Denver game earlier this season. He was flushed from the pocket. He looked round, rolled to his right and suddenly spotted Alge Crumpler in the left flat. But coming into his vision also was Al Wilson. 2 years ago, he would have tried to beat Wilson or thrown it almost through him. This time, he just flipped it nonchlantly over him, perfectly in stride.

2. Passing 10+ - It's the stronger area of the two. The deeper he goes, the better he goes - very few QB's you can say that about. He can make every throw on a rope. When he played as a rookie against Miami at PPS, he was the sandlot passer but at times he let his arm get the better of him. Now he seems to have that under control. This season he has regressed in some areas because of the system and his inability at times to mold it to his talents, but the arm and the deep ball is always a thing of beauty. Because of his strength, the deeper ball sometimes still comes out flatter than any QB in the game. Watch a Peyton deep ball and a Vick deep ball. There is maybe 10-15 yards worth of vertical difference. It's staggering.

3. Field Vision - It's great. His vision and the escapability that that brings, the mobility, is stunning. He has eyes in the back of his head. But like I said earlier, I still see a player that wants to be a sandlot QB but has to try and be an NFL QB. I'm not sold that turning him fully to the side of being an NFL passer is quite right. If I was Mora Jr and Knapp, I would tailor an offense so dynamic around him that they would be unstoppable. But they rightly know that if he gets hurt then they are up the creek without a paddle. So at times he can appear hesitant almost as if he thinks that he HAS to do what the team wants. You of course don't want him to run every down. A QB must work his progressions, find his receivers, etc etc. But there never has been a passer like him and he is very special. There is not one passer in NFL history who could rip off a 70 yard gain, beating 5/6 players and then come back and throw a 70 yard rope in stride. He sees the lanes as a passer and as a runner, he CREATES the lanes. He doesn't always need to see a running lane to make yardage.

4. Arm strength - Special. Can make all the throws. Difficult to compare to George or Elway. But it's at least as good as those. I think probably it's better than any of the above, but who knows. And of course, you don't want a QB who throws it too hard or continually overthrows. He can fit balls in where he wants and can out balls in stride. Michael Bishop of KState probably had a stronger pure arm, but there's a huge difference being a passer or a chucker.

5. Running ability - You would have to think that he would be a starting TB in the NFL if he added some bulk and wasn't a QB. There's no compliment higher than that. He makes arguably the best previous mobile QB, Randall Cunningham look like Dan Marino mobility wise. Frightening. The speed, the ability to get to the edge and turn up the field is as good as any tailback in the game today.

6. Speed - Well he looks as fast as any player in football. His 40 times at Virginia Tech were in the 4.24 region. He may not be the fastest on the track, but I can't think of a faster player on the field than Vick regardless of position. He is revolutionary.

7. Ranking - To my mind the top 3 QB's in the game are Peyton, Favre and Brady. Vick would probably be next. And that's an amazing compliment when you consider how raw he still is as a QUARTERBACK and all that entails. I think pound for pound he's the best PLAYER in the NFL. I think he needs an offense that suits his needs more. If that happens, he could be the best in the game.

8. Trade Value - Untradeable. Seriously. There is nothing that you could trade him for. Not only because his talent makes him untradeable but because of his contract, what he means to the CITY OF ATLANTA, etc etc etc. Arthur Blank would be killed if he ever traded him.

As for people on this site who think he is overrated, they can't be watching the games. As I said, the guy has revolutionised football. Even if his arm and his throwing is out, he can still kill you on the ground. As good as Peyton, Brady, Brett, Pennington etc are, NONE of them can say that. None.

Sorry to keep repeating myself, but NO-ONE will want to play Vick and the Falcons in the playoffs. I fully expect them to be the NFC's representative in Jacksonville.

Hope that's what you were after.
Boomer.

WOW!!!!!

Hey Boomer....Just like Dan you are the MAN!!! :allhail:

I was at every home game in Blacksburg during his AMAZING College days. It was crazy watching him TAKE OVER A GAME. Most people judge players on stats....That is why I think that most people think he is overrated.

When Vick plays his best he is only THROWING the rock 20 times or less. He is a BARRY SANDERS....lost a yard...lost a yard...next play takes it 80+ yards to the house! He will NEVER be a 40+ attempt QB and be GOOD at it. When he only throws the ball 20 times or less.....He will light it up with a COUPLE 40+ yard passes and beat you all day with his LEGS. You gotta love the "VICK FLICK"... :cooldude:

Best Game Example.... :eek:
7 of 11 for 150 yards 2 TDS / 8 rushes for 110 yards 1 TD....
He is a PLAYMAKER not a STAT PADDER. He may never have a 400 or 500 yard game passing...BUT KNOW that he will have a TON of 150/100....GAMES! He has more Big plays on LESS ATTEMPTS than a MANNING, FARVE or BRADY could even dream about. :roflmao:

I got to meet him a couple times from a freind that played ball for them. He was super nice and down to earth. MY pride and joy is a banner that I made with "Beamer Ball" & "ESPN & ESPN 2 logos" on it. I had a sign company so the banner is SWEET. My buddy got the ENTIRE team & coaches to sign it. Then I got some girls to take it to the gameday crew after a game and they signed it too. :evil: It was hanging in the corner of the ENDZONE when the GAMEDAY crew came to town. I had a hard time getting it back....lol...The ESPN crew thought it was one of their banners.....They never would have made it out of BLACKSBURG with MY BANNER! :roflmao:

YEAH I LOVE THE HOKIES.. :tongue:

GO HOKIES!!!
GO PHINS!!!
 
Glad that was what you were looking for Mark.

He is a fun guy to watch.
 
jay ray said:
eli manning is da most over rated player in da draft

Is your life really so full, are you really so busy that you can't take the extra second it would take to spell out the word "the?"
 
morning Boomer and congrats on the early christmas presant your wife gave you.

"if" saban becomes the coach and knowing he doesn't have that large pool of talent to go out and recruit but only a limited amount of draft picks (a FA or 2) to work with and begin to plug holes needed on the team....do you see him (or is it even viable) trade out of the 2nd or 3rd pick (stock-piling a few extra) and taking "one" player that COULD help (or improve) in 3 or 4 area's right-a-way (given that an OLman or DT may take one or two years to develope)....the Running game...Blocking in the back field/picking up blitzes...recieving....LOW Mileage...un-selfish and seemingly a smart player. IMHO that would be Ronnie Brown...tb/fb.
Also...just ranting....somehow later pick up Jason Cambell....there is a 4year chemistry already with R. Brown and he seems a very coachable young man with a hugh UP-SIDE. I know we need a LT..DT..Center but we must start somewhere.and look to the NOW as well as the FUTURE. JMVHO
 
d-day said:
boomer - how do grade this years hurricane crop - any sleepers? also how do you grade gore and parrish if they come out? -thanx for the input

It's not as good at the top end, but there are some decent middle level players and a couple of sleepers.

Of course there is Antrell Rolle who will be a 1st rounder, and he would have been joined by Eric Winston had he not suffered the injury. Look for TE Kevin Everett to be up around the top 65 picks, although his shoulder injury may keep him out of the Peach Bowl and the Senior Bowl. The underclassmen that have said that they are contemplating coming out are Frank Gore who should go day 1. Also linebacker Roger McIntosh and cornerback Kelly Jennings are also considering the next level as each has asked the NFL advisory committee to evaluate their draft potential. Add WR Roscoe Parrish to that list as he is also in the process of finding out his status. All 3 would do with staying, especially Parrish. Orien Harris would be a 1st rounder but he has indicated very strongly that he is staying. Santonio Thomas is a day 2 DT who hasn't been invited to the Combine.

The sleeper of the group is probably FB Talib Humphrey who is rising fast, but who ridiculously, hasn't been invited to the Combine. G Chris Myers is also a prospect for day 2. Brock Berlin has had a very good year, but his lack of height, inconsistency and his inability to see the passing lanes makes him a very marginal prospect.

Overall when you consider how strong they usually are, this is a substandard year, but Rolle, Everett, Humphrey and Gore should all be contributing on day 1 of next season and Thomas and Myers should be on a roster.
 
jay ray said:
eli manning is da most over rated player in da draft

Errr....Eli Manning was last year's draft. As for the most overrated player in this year's draft......Michael Munoz. I've never thought he was that good a player and he can't stay healthy.
 
WelcomeBack said:
Hey Boomer.....is there any possibility of Greag Threat entering the Draft...and if so..what is his stock in your opinion?

No possibility whatsoever. He makes a lot of picks, but he seems an awful tackler. He also seems to freelance a little too much for my liking. He'd have to mature a hell of a lot to develop into that sort of a player. Upside is there, but there's a LONG way to go.
 
BY THE WAY.....thanks ahead of time for your answer and Happy Holidays to You and YOURS

also i do not think either is a product of " the system" as some seem to be
 
my2cents said:
morning Boomer and congrats on the early christmas presant your wife gave you.

"if" saban becomes the coach and knowing he doesn't have that large pool of talent to go out and recruit but only a limited amount of draft picks (a FA or 2) to work with and begin to plug holes needed on the team....do you see him (or is it even viable) trade out of the 2nd or 3rd pick (stock-piling a few extra) and taking "one" player that COULD help (or improve) in 3 or 4 area's right-a-way (given that an OLman or DT may take one or two years to develope)....the Running game...Blocking in the back field/picking up blitzes...recieving....LOW Mileage...un-selfish and seemingly a smart player. IMHO that would be Ronnie Brown...tb/fb.
Also...just ranting....somehow later pick up Jason Cambell....there is a 4year chemistry already with R. Brown and he seems a very coachable young man with a hugh UP-SIDE. I know we need a LT..DT..Center but we must start somewhere.and look to the NOW as well as the FUTURE. JMVHO

Morning mate.....thanks!

I absolutely see him trading down. I can't envisage he sees a player there worth the #2/3 pick. Ronnie Brown would be a real option. He's a heck of a player and a perect fit for Saban's team. Campbell will probably go too high for us. Plus, I think Feeley is proving his worth for next season. With a franchise back, he's only going to get better. The quick OL and DL fixes will come via FA if need be.
 
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