Brandon Marshall tells Davone Bess that Bess will have a pro bowl year

[dlockz]

it's not that he's just 'a product of a system' - it's that his production is being maximized in NE's system. i don't think he'd have the same output in another great but dissimilar offense like dallas. he's a great receiver - just not quite as great as that system is making him out to be.

either way i'm happy for him. he never would have developed into the receiver he is now in miami - and we got good compensation for him - even if we did give up said compensation (satele) too soon.

We just should have never drafted Satale lol. I always though Kalil was the better prospect but of course he was drafted before us.
I absolutely hated the 2007 draft with a passion and of course was flamed for it lol.
I agree though at the time it looked like great compensation. Still puzzled why NE was so high on him at time. Outside of Marshall we probably dont have a receiver on our roster that could garner those picks hell Ginn was traded for a 5th. Im hoping Hartline develops and Bess keeps on chugging

 

[BobDole]

We just should have never drafted Satale lol. I always though Kalil was the better prospect but of course he was drafted before us.
I absolutely hated the 2007 draft with a passion and of course was flamed for it lol.
I agree though at the time it looked like great compensation. Still puzzled why NE was so high on him at time. Outside of Marshall we probably dont have a receiver on our roster that could garner those picks hell Ginn was traded for a 5th. Im hoping Hartline develops and Bess keeps on chugging

as did i, as was i. the only picks i didn't hate were satele, soliai, and mauia - and that in no way means i liked them.

just wait and see how having marshall will help those other guys develop. we've actually given henne all the help he needs to succeed this year - now all we can do is wait and see.

 

[dlockz]

as did i, as was i. the only picks i didn't hate were satele, soliai, and mauia - and that in no way means i liked them.

just wait and see how having marshall will help those other guys develop. we've actually given henne all the help he needs to succeed this year - now all we can do is wait and see.

I hated the Mauia pick above all. A man doesnt start but a few games in college and you waste a pick on him. That was my thought process as the time.

 

[BobDole]

I hated the Mauia pick above all. A man doesnt start but a few games in college and you waste a pick on him. That was my thought process as the time.

i just liked his measurables and we needed a FB at the time. i'll take a chance to develop a guy like that with a 6th round pick every day of the week. but i was very wrong and have no problem admitting it.

 

[Pinkboy]

Bill Belichick has tremendous respect for Davone's talent and ability.

When BB was mic'd up for our game in NE last year, he told his defense to make sure Bess is double covered.. telling his team on the sideline that "it's okay if other players beat us, but just DO NOT let Bess beat us."

That's rather telling when it comes from a proven defensive mind like BB... who just so happens to have Welker on his team (who he traded for on the Dolphins).

If Bess came out earlier during the years when we sucked with bad management, and BB didn't have Welker, I am positive BB makes the same move offering a 2nd rounder for Bess.

There was NO ONE on our entire team that Belichick respected and gave attention to more than Davone Bess when he was mic'd up for our game.. NOBODY.

PERIOD.

 

[ckparrothead]

Belichick loves that kind of player. Hence the presence of Welker...who was catching 9.4 balls for 102 yards per game this year.

 

[phintim]

Speaking on BB and changing the topic just for a minute do you ever see Ireland and company every positioning the phins to corral a bunch of 2nd round picks like the Pats have done for the past few years. BB looks like a genuis reagarding accomplishing that in the draft.

 

[damanref10]

Speaking on BB and changing the topic just for a minute do you ever see Ireland and company every positioning the phins to corral a bunch of 2nd round picks like the Pats have done for the past few years. BB looks like a genuis reagarding accomplishing that in the draft.

The Pats built a team that was a superbowl contender year in and year out and suddenly found themselves at a crossroads. They had to decide to ship off some older yet still very talented and productive vets and set themselves up for the future, or ride the team to its end and then totally start over.

They have been masterful in shipping off players and getting gold in return (most notably Seymour for Oaklands 1st rounder). Sacrificing one or two more years of Seymour for an entire 1st rounders career.

We would only do that if we have valuable pieces and were seeming to have our future look dim. Since we have one of the youngest rosters in the NFL, we shouldn't have to stockpile draft picks for a couple of years (i hope).

 

[ckparrothead]

Speaking on BB and changing the topic just for a minute do you ever see Ireland and company every positioning the phins to corral a bunch of 2nd round picks like the Pats have done for the past few years. BB looks like a genuis reagarding accomplishing that in the draft.

God I wish.

 

[ckparrothead]

I have to give this staff credit, they did that with Jason Taylor, and when it looked like they needed to give away a 2nd round pick for Brandon Marshall, they reclaimed another 2nd round pick by trading down.

They've conducted three drafts now and they've technically acquired two extra 2nd round picks (a trade down, and trading Jason Taylor). That's not bad. Not bad at all. I expect something similar to happen next year with the other 2nd rounder they had to give up for Marshall, they'll try and figure a way to replace it.

What I'd like to see them start doing though is trading present picks for future picks that are a round higher. This is an area of pure inefficiency for the NFL. It's an avenue for pure arbitrage, like before currencies were locked in with one another and you could trade dollars for pounds, pounds for rubles, rubles for francs, and francs for dollars, and come out with more dollars on the end than you had at the beginning. That's arbitrage. To me whenever a GM trades away a present 2nd for a future 1st, that is USUALLY pure arbitrage on the part of the guy giving up the 2nd round pick...because it's rare to see an entire draft be so different in talent level from the current one that a present 2nd really is worth a future 1st.

 

[damanref10]

I have to give this staff credit, they did that with Jason Taylor, and when it looked like they needed to give away a 2nd round pick for Brandon Marshall, they reclaimed another 2nd round pick by trading down.

They've conducted three drafts now and they've technically acquired two extra 2nd round picks (a trade down, and trading Jason Taylor). That's not bad. Not bad at all. I expect something similar to happen next year with the other 2nd rounder they had to give up for Marshall, they'll try and figure a way to replace it.

What I'd like to see them start doing though is trading present picks for future picks that are a round higher. This is an area of pure inefficiency for the NFL. It's an avenue for pure arbitrage, like before currencies were locked in with one another and you could trade dollars for pounds, pounds for rubles, rubles for francs, and francs for dollars, and come out with more dollars on the end than you had at the beginning. That's arbitrage. To me whenever a GM trades away a present 2nd for a future 1st, that is USUALLY pure arbitrage on the part of the guy giving up the 2nd round pick...because it's rare to see an entire draft be so different in talent level from the current one that a present 2nd really is worth a future 1st.

Agreed, much like the situation with trading for Brandon Marshall for two second round picks and then dropping down in this years draft (due either to the chargers obsessoin with ryan matthews or us not liking the talent at where we were) and picking up the second rounder, essentially only losing a 2nd rounder to acquire brandon marshall. I loved the move, even if I wasn't so thrilled at the Odrick pick.

 

[phintim]

Agreed, much like the situation with trading for Brandon Marshall for two second round picks and then dropping down in this years draft (due either to the chargers obsessoin with ryan matthews or us not liking the talent at where we were) and picking up the second rounder, essentially only losing a 2nd rounder to acquire brandon marshall. I loved the move, even if I wasn't so thrilled at the Odrick pick.

Logically there was certainly more talent available at the 12th spot compared to the 28th but Ireland almost looked like the cat that swallowed the canary after the draft. IMO That left the impression in my mind that this years draft went as well as he hoped and maybe a bit better.

What I do not like about the past few drafts is Ireland trades away multible lower round picks to move up and around for guys in the 4th and 5th rounds. I assume with a smaller draft board than many teams the phins have more of a need to do this as their potential draftable pool of players shrink rather quickly. An example is Brian Hartline who from all the news I was exposed to would be available later in the draft and appeared a reach in his round he was selected last year. Now he appears to be a very decent selection but that does not take away from the fact that he "probably" would have been around in round 5. I know it is second guessing but its a point. I certainly do not see them trading down the other way in rounds 4 -5 to gain more picks. The argument of not needing to draft more players for your team as your teams talent improves is valid. But drafting a greater number of players increases the odds in rookie players making the team also.

 

[damanref10]

Logically there was certainly more talent available at the 12th spot compared to the 28th but Ireland almost looked like the cat that swallowed the canary after the draft. IMO That left the impression in my mind that this years draft went as well as he hoped and maybe a bit better.

What I do not like about the past few drafts is Ireland trades away multible lower round picks to move up and around for guys in the 4th and 5th rounds. I assume with a smaller draft board than many teams the phins have more of a need to do this as their potential draftable pool of players shrink rather quickly. An example is Brian Hartline who from all the news I was exposed to would be available later in the draft and appeared a reach in his round he was selected last year. Now he appears to be a very decent selection but that does not take away from the fact that he "probably" would have been around in round 5. I know it is second guessing but its a point. I certainly do not see them trading down the other way in rounds 4 -5 to gain more picks. The argument of not needing to draft more players for your team as your teams talent improves is valid. But drafting a greater number of players increases the odds in rookie players making the team also.

I agree that obviously there was more talent at 12 than at 28, but IMO and i guess in his, having two starters instead of one was far more valuable. And maybe hartline wouldn't have made it to us in the 5th, who knows. But so far i think we have put ourselves in position to draft well but don't always do so... turner and white cough cough. but i think our FO is making smart moves and drafting in the trenches which i love.

 

[Pinkboy]

Logically there was certainly more talent available at the 12th spot compared to the 28th but Ireland almost looked like the cat that swallowed the canary after the draft. IMO That left the impression in my mind that this years draft went as well as he hoped and maybe a bit better.

What I do not like about the past few drafts is Ireland trades away multible lower round picks to move up and around for guys in the 4th and 5th rounds. I assume with a smaller draft board than many teams the phins have more of a need to do this as their potential draftable pool of players shrink rather quickly. An example is Brian Hartline who from all the news I was exposed to would be available later in the draft and appeared a reach in his round he was selected last year. Now he appears to be a very decent selection but that does not take away from the fact that he "probably" would have been around in round 5. I know it is second guessing but its a point. I certainly do not see them trading down the other way in rounds 4 -5 to gain more picks. The argument of not needing to draft more players for your team as your teams talent improves is valid. But drafting a greater number of players increases the odds in rookie players making the team also.

That thought process doesn't really sit well when you're talking about a team which has the philosophy of building the 'right' 53, not necessarily the best 53.

What we've heard from this front office over and over and over again is -- what really matters to them is having the right 53, this is strictly what they're looking for... not so much the best 53.

So when you take that into account, and all that goes into that thinking, you can get a better grasp on the method to their madness.

 

[hoops]

if i could get a 2nd round pick for davon bess knowing what i know now and even looking into the future with him i think i'd make the trade...but i would be looking at a slot guy in the draft at some point (jordan shipley last draft...etc)

as for this "right 53...not necessarily the best 53" that's all well and good as long as these guys have some talent...but if you're keeping guys who just aren't as good as some players you either let go or pass by that to me is fools gold...especially for the long term

i understand guys need to have a certain makeup (ie live breathe and eat football) to fit our profile but if you don't have in addition the talent you end up with a bunch of average players and you get average results...

and i'm fresh out of tolerating average results...this is year 3...i'm in show me mode