Davone Bess is a Playmaker | Page 7 | FinHeaven - Miami Dolphins Forums

Davone Bess is a Playmaker

finomenal said:
Why do fans keep making excuses for him? I'll say it again. If Bess is on your team and you depend on him so much, your WRs aren't good enough! He has to break tackles all the time because he doesn't have enough speed and explosion to shake a defender. It's obvious.
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Which is exactly why upgraded our receiving corps as a whole. The man catches everything thrown his way and the part you ignored. Our offense used to move 5 yards at a time, if that. Our upgrades, should help everyone get more open
 
Bess isn't a playmaker in that he isn't gonna turn something small into something big. However, his job is to work underneath and move the chains. He does that - consistently!
 
You have yet to show us why we should just blindly take his stat as a be all, end all. This same WPA stat has Hartline over receivers like AJ Green, Reggie Wayne, Steve Smith, Greg Jennings, Hakeem Nicks, Larry Fitzgerald and Mike Wallace, which is utterly absurd. If we are to take this stat and give it the kind of importance you want us to, we already had a great WR core with Bess and Hartline. We both know thats ridiculous.

Your posts would be much better if you could realize that metrics in football are not the same as metrics in baseball. hey can be somewhat useful and fun to look at, but ultimately its foolish to place a lot of value in them.
 
shouright said:
You shouldn't, and that was never said. The stat is a measure of playmaking, only.
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OK...so Hartline is a better playmaker than AJ Green, Fitzgerald, Jennings, Wallace, ect? That doesnt even sound a little silly to you?
 
WVDolphan said:
So based on that stat Bess is more of a playmaker than AJ Green?
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Bess makes more plays that increase his team's probability of winning than does Green, yes. Whether you want to define that as a "playmaker" is up to you.

Regardless of who Bess is more or less of a playmaker than, the point is that the stats show he's a playmaker. He's among the league leaders in terms of making plays that increase his team's probability of winning.
 
SMH.

It's simply ASTOUNDING to me how Fin Fanatics can GET SO HIGH ON FREEKIN' MEDIOCRE TALENT if that person simply wear's a Dolphin uniform.

Bess a playmaker. Right. That's why he changed so many games last year. That's why he took so many catches that should have gone for 5 yards and turned them into 25 and TDs. That's why he flipped team momentum so many times with talent-driven plays... oh, wait. Bess? I thought you meant someone else...

Gimme a break. Fin Fans can easily look at mediocre on another team and tell EXACTLY what it is.

Too bad they can't look at the Dolphins and tell the same. They just might figure out how a team struggles to get to 7-9 and has over three times as many loosing seasons in a decade than they had their whole existence.

SMH!

You're a better football mind than this, Shouright. Be right, Shouright!

LD
 
tylerdolphin said:
OK...so Hartline is a better playmaker than AJ Green, Fitzgerald, Jennings, Wallace, ect? That doesnt even sound a little silly to you?
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You're welcome to have your own definition of playmaker.
 
Agreed. The angst in this thread comes from the OP's use of the word playmaker. It seems that we only look at a player's stats in a vacuum when it comes to the WR position and focus only on touchdowns scored. I guess this is the unfortunate side effect of fantasy football goggles. Jeff Ireland has done most of his big name signings over the years using the same philosophy, so it shouldn't be surprising to see fans do the same thing.

A football team requires a blended mix of talent that fulfills a variety of roles. Not every RB is a speed back, not every WR is the deep threat. Some RB's exist only to pick up the three yards between the tackles or to pound it into the end zone from 1 yard out. Some WR are possession guys...they exist to find the sticks and make the dependable catch to keep the drive alive. That's what Bess is, and he is one of the best at. These are role players. They aren't judged in trade value (how much do you pay for a kicker in a trade, yet look how important they are), but in how well they perform their role.

If Bess doesn't fit the coaches offense, then trading him makes sense, but if we are just trading to land a low round draft pick, that is foolish. We have never really had an offense capable of testing Bess thoroughly, I for one would like to see what he can do in one.


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shouright said:
Bess makes more plays that increase his team's probability of winning than does Green, yes. Whether you want to define that as a "playmaker" is up to you.

Regardless of who Bess is more or less of a playmaker than, the point is that the stats show he's a playmaker. He's among the league leaders in terms of making plays that increase his team's probability of winning.
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Actually, he dosent. AJ Green is one of the premier WRs in this league. Just the fact you are comparing Bess and Green is laughable.

Have you watched AJ Green play?

This is a joke. Has to be. Trollright
 
volk said:
Agreed. The angst in this thread comes from the OP's use of the word playmaker. It seems that we only look at a player's stats in a vacuum when it comes to the WR position and focus only on touchdowns scored....

A football team requires a blended mix of talent that fulfills a variety of roles....

Some WR are possession guys...they exist to find the sticks and make the dependable catch to keep the drive alive. That's what Bess is, and he is one of the best at.
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Precisely. But if you noticed, I covered that in the original post.
 
shouright said:
You're welcome to have your own definition of playmaker.
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I suppose you are too, but yours is laughable a best. Theres not a single football executive that would agree with you. Of course Im sure you actually think you know something everyone else doesnt, so I doubt that means anything to you. Same thing with the Sparano and Matt Moore debates. You were so convinced you were the smartest guy in the room that you simply werent gonna even try to hear any type of reason other than the stats you present. This isnt baseball. Metrics dont mean a lot.
 
WVDolphan said:
Actually, he dosent. AJ Green is one of the premier WRs in this league. Just the fact you are comparing Bess and Green is laughable.

Have you watched AJ Green play?

This is a joke. Has to be. Trollright
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At this point I'd suggest you move on to greener pastures, then.

---------- Post added at 04:51 PM ---------- Previous post was at 04:50 PM ----------
tylerdolphin said:
I suppose you are too, but yours is laughable a best. Theres not a single football executive that would agree with you. Of course Im sure you actually think you know something everyone else doesnt, so I doubt that means anything to you. Same thing with the Sparano and Matt Moore debates. You were so convinced you were the smartest guy in the room that you simply werent gonna even try to hear any type of reason other than the stats you present. This isnt baseball. Metrics dont mean a lot.
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Like I said, if you can't attack the evidence, attack the witness. If you can't attack the witness, bang on the table.
 
shouright said:
Like I said, if you can't attack the evidence, attack the witness. If you can't attack the witness, bang on the table.
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I attacked your evidence. Id imagine the fact that no executives believe Bess and Hartline are better playmakers than Green and Fitzgerald is good evidence. You demand the impossible. You expect us to take YOUR hand-picked stats and make them say something different. Thats ridiculous. Any evidence thats offered that isnt WPA, youll dismiss. WPA says Bess is a playmaker. Therefore theres no way we can offer an argument that youll consider intelligent or factual. Its incredibly arrogant.
 
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