McShay's Mock for our 1a selection | Page 5 | FinHeaven - Miami Dolphins Forums

McShay's Mock for our 1a selection

TedSlimmJr said:
Burrow has had one of the best seasons in the history of college football that came completely out of nowhere. I think it's important to look at the why...

As a graduate transfer, he's not going to class. All he's doing is taking a few online classes. He's not balancing a student athlete's workload with football like everybody else is doing. All he does is watch film 6 days a week and preparing like a professional, with the close tutelage of an NFL guy in Joe Brady. That is a tremendous advantage that can't be measured. The only person I've ever even heard touch on this was Kirk Herbstreit.

When you project him to the next level, that advantage is no longer going to apply. It gets a lot more even in terms of preparation. It just makes you a little unsure of the upside with Burrow.
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I didn't even think about all that. It goes along with Burrow being so much older. Cheers.
 
ANUFan said:
I'm no draft expert like some in this draft section.
But the eye ball test tells me that Tua is a lot more of a Pro QB that can make ALL the throws based on reading defensive aligment, down distance, levarage etc.

There are certain types of pro throws i've yet to see Burrow make with a certain level of consistency. Not to mention I'm not sold on his arm talent and making those throws at the pro level that will test that arm.
He's certainly a play maker. No one can take that away from him.

I suppose he's closer to Watson, Jackson in terms of that unique ability to use his legs. But he doesn't have those guys throwing talent and it's not even close.


Overall, Burrow seems to be the type of Qb that needs to be in the right system with coaches that understand his unique skill-sets to maximize.

Whereas, Tua seems to be a QB that can thrive in any system.
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Zero question marks with Burrow for me. He's big time. Burrow made his entire offense better.

Even his ability to scramble is a plus. Many, many drives extended because of his ability to dart straight up field for 10-15 yards and critical first downs.

Tua is super accurate, which is bar none the most important quality in a QB. He brings a lot to the table. But the question marks are there. How many hits are too many? He can't run like Lamar Jackson and he doesn't have the arm strength of Russell Wilson. Certainly leaps and bounds ahead of Baker Mayfield and Kyler Murray though.

Can't discount the immense talent that Bama possesses right now at WR. Arguably the most talented group ever? Ya. They make being a QB a lot easier. If Tua is doing all this at Penn State, Tennessee or Texas, it would really make him irresistible.

He's worth taking a risk on at 3 or 4 and hope he doesn't miss 8 or 9 games every other year. I'm not giving up a first rounder to guarantee landing him though. Maybe he's worth it, maybe we do it. I won't lose any sleep if we do. I'll root as hard for him as anyone.

I'd run a first rounder to Cincy if they considered giving up the first pick though. I'll throw in Houston's 2021 2nd and our 2021 4th.
 
I think this hip thing has been so catastrophic that it will have an impact on Tua's decision-making with respect to his tendency to be the hero and not protect himself so much.

I've seen other QBs be that way as well, and then that sh-t stops when they tear that ACL the first time.

The question always becomes, once they adapt, can they be the same guy that got them to where they were? Some of them are so defined by that ability and hero ball tendency that, no, they really can't. But I don't think that's Tua. In fact, his hero ball stuff might be at the lower end of his total game.
 
Only have two concerns with Tua...both easily correctable through coaching.

First, learning the importance of health and preserving his body. Protect it. When you talk about the smartest quarterbacks that have ever played, you're talking about how they weigh risk vs. reward. The best ones protect themselves and understand the importance of it. Understand every play isn't going to be a touchdown, and you don't have to put it all on your shoulders.

Secondly, decision making in the redzone. Points are at a premium in the NFL. Do not take that FG off the board by forcing a throw on 1st and goal. Give yourself two more chances then take the 3 points if it doesn't work. Although I'll cut him some slack here since he's seen our kickers try to kick.


If he can improve in these two areas, it's honestly pretty scary how good he can be in the NFL. He's unlike anything I've ever seen in so many other areas. It'd be a shame to never be able to see just how good he can be because he never understood the value in throwing the ball away.
 
ckparrothead said:
I think this hip thing has been so catastrophic that it will have an impact on Tua's decision-making with respect to his tendency to be the hero and not protect himself so much.

I've seen other QBs be that way as well, and then that sh-t stops when they tear that ACL the first time.

The question always becomes, once they adapt, can they be the same guy that got them to where they were? Some of them are so defined by that ability and hero ball tendency that, no, they really can't. But I don't think that's Tua. In fact, his hero ball stuff might be at the lower end of his total game.
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From what I have watched he is at his best at the RPO pulling the ball and hitting his guy on a slant or timing route. His anticipation and feel for coverage is where he excels. And his placement of the ball on all three levels is crazy good. He is much more than hero ball like you said, he slides in the pocket and buys time well and I think that would be more encouraged once he is on an NFL roster. He is such a quick decision maker if he gives up the hero ball mentality he will still shred defenses.

Once thing about injuries I would like to add is that in many cases it forces a player to fix mechanical flaws that may put pressure on the injury. I have seen this in baseball a lot once a guy gets arm surgery he works on throwing mechanics to fix what caused the issue in the first place. I have heard Tua is a bit narrow with his stance, does that put extra pressure on his hip (honestly dont know) could having a better base and buttoned up mechanics improve his durability, all questions I am eager to find out more about.

Also please please please send him whoever we draft at QB to a MLB camp to learn to effing slide haha.
 
j-off-her-doll said:
Hell of a post, Slimm. How much of Tua's unwillingness to protect himself can be tied to the college atmosphere? Particularly with Saban, who, great as he is, has a reputation for using his players up (kind of reminds me of Pat Riley's reputation back when he was coaching basketball).

If it weren't for you and Namor saying there's a real chance Tua returns, I wouldn't believe it tbh, but if he does declare, and I'm the team that drafts him, I'd sit him for 2020. Especially for a team like Miami, there's no rush to get him on the field right away, and it'd give me another year to build the OL.
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I think his declaration is largely in Miami's hands. If we tell his representative that he's not getting past us, pretty certain he will say goodbye to Bama and move on to the next chapter. If we don't give him those assurances, I'm not sure anyone else will in the current top 5. Think Namor posted about that top 5 need in a previous post.
 
While it gives me pause that Alabama wonks like Slimm and Namor see a strong possibility he stays at Alabama, I've got some stuff on private that suggests that there are some significant issues pertaining to arcane NCAA bureaucracy that will weigh heavily on the pro-vs-con dynamic...leading him to declare, even if he would prefer to stay all things being equal.
 
"wonks"!!!!...LOL...5 star Brice Young committing to Bama yesterday...sort of tells me Tua will leave school..Don't know if Brice would have committed if they
thought Tua was coming back..but ,who knows...
What the hell is a wonk?
 
QBs aren’t protected once they are outside of the tackle box though in the nfl. And that’s the exact kinda play tuas hip got injured on.
 
ANUFan said:
I'm no draft expert like some in this draft section.
But the eye ball test tells me that Tua is a lot more of a Pro QB that can make ALL the throws based on reading defensive aligment, down distance, levarage etc.

There are certain types of pro throws i've yet to see Burrow make with a certain level of consistency. Not to mention I'm not sold on his arm talent and making those throws at the pro level that will test that arm.
He's certainly a play maker. No one can take that away from him.

I suppose he's closer to Watson, Jackson in terms of that unique ability to use his legs. But he doesn't have those guys throwing talent and it's not even close.


Overall, Burrow seems to be the type of Qb that needs to be in the right system with coaches that understand his unique skill-sets to maximize.

Whereas, Tua seems to be a QB that can thrive in any system.
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Yah I have concerns about Joe playing hero ball running up the middle of the field taking on NFL LB and SS like he does in college to fire up his Offense. Joe will have to beat teams with his arm not his legs, Good luck with that ~ NFL D Coordinators wont fear this guy like they scheme for Wilson, Murray and Murray. I certainly see how his elusiveness against College ballers looks attractive but I don't see it at the next level
We can pretty much much count those runs for first downs that he made look so college Tannehillesque-like out of his game at the next level.

Cinci will take Joe and spend later picks to help him out I dont know about the FA money they have to support him. They will have to play Joe I fear for him. Tua will go to MIA with our first pick he may not see the field in 2020 as we can get Fitz on the cheap then watch how MIA will stack the Oline over the next two years ~ and maneuver those First day picks into more early picks for 2022
 
Tua's hip got injured because of the ankle, period.

He WAS trying to protect the ankle. That's the problem. He lifted off to throw the ball, and the moment he started landing on that problematic ankle, with two guys on his back, he lifted it back off the turf and let it go dead so that the foot/ankle wouldn't be forced to absorb the force. He chose to land on his knee instead. The knee hit the ground and jammed his femur straight backward into the socket, cracking the bone plate.

The lesson Tua needs to learn is more conceptual, about giving yourself up, about throwing the football away. And for a competitor, it may be a harder lesson than many would imagine.
 
ckparrothead said:
Tua's hip got injured because of the ankle, period.

He WAS trying to protect the ankle. That's the problem. He lifted off to throw the ball, and the moment he started landing on that problematic ankle, with two guys on his back, he lifted it back off the turf and let it go dead so that the foot/ankle wouldn't be forced to absorb the force. He chose to land on his knee instead. The knee hit the ground and jammed his femur straight backward into the socket, cracking the bone plate.

The lesson Tua needs to learn is more conceptual, about giving yourself up, about throwing the football away. And for a competitor, it may be a harder lesson than many would imagine.
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Tua should have been left alone to heal against LSU too, but Saban was playing for the POs and the final four.
 
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