This cant be good for the Pats

[feelthepain]

So all the guys they lost in free agency, were traded or just cut over all the Dynasty years are just keeping quiet? lol

I'm sure the ex-players make it known when their new teams play the Pats. Maybe this is also why so many reports are finally making their way to the surface from so many different directions about the extent of cheating the Pats were doing. As for the coaches, they don't have tell the players how they get their information, they just tell the players where to be and when. If you want to live in some little fantasy land where the players didn't know anything then so be it. I believe they knew and they participated.

 

[Phin-o-rama]

You're so right. I think we should stop holding practices and stop gameplanning. The video tape will win the game for you, or in Miami's case the tape recorder.:up:

 

[feelthepain]

You're so right. I think we should stop holding practices and stop gameplanning. The video tape will win the game for you, or in Miami's case the tape recorder.:up:

Yes well you have to find some way to deflect the heat, right? But you just keep trying to displace the blame. It was everyone and everything but the coaching staff, players and owner in NE, that you know for sure!

 

[Brassmonki14120]

If you want to live in some little fantasy land where the players didn't know anything then so be it.

Fantasy land is where they put asterisks next to the Super Bowl Champions name.

They better team won those Championships and no amount of snivelling is going to take that away from them, get over it.

 

[TomBradyWoot]

Yes well you have to find some way to deflect the heat, right? But you just keep trying to displace the blame. It was everyone and everything but the coaching staff, players and owner in NE, that you know for sure!

You guys are just so ignorant you refuse to even read what is written. MRNFLFAN, late again, nor myself have posted that everything the Pats did is okay and Goodell is protecting the NFL and that's fine almighty with us. They got caught after Goodell sent out a memo telling all teams what they were doing is illegal and not to do it, and did it anyways. They deserved to get caught and the punishment. And if you really don't believe losing a first round pick is nothing special, then we'll gladly take our second round pick back from last year for the Wes Welker trade. Look at it as you just giving up your second round pick this year, for absolutely nothing, and then tell me you still believe it isn't a justifiable punishment. Especially with a CB deep class and the Pats hurting there.

We're simply telling you that you're simple minded belief that the Pats are the only team that does it, is just that. I mean I don't know what more you need than for Jimmy Johnson to come out and flat out say he's done the same exact thing and that he also wasn't the only one. Or Herm Edwards to wave to the camera. And why have the Pats done it so well for 3 years, but not the other 4? Or how about this season when they won 17 games AFTER spygate broke. (I didn't even include the first game where the taping was stopped before halftime, couldn't be used, and the Jets obviously knew about it and thus would've changed their defensive signals before the game)

You're all spending your time trying to find conspiracy theories about how the NFL is just hiding the Pats and Kraft and Belichick instead of just taking what Goodell says. That Belichick told him all he knew, he got rid of the stuff after Glazer got hold of a tape, and if Belichick didn't tell him everything he's going to get a huge punishment.

You can say the Pats and Belichick have no integrity all you want I don't see why you feel the need to bash Goodell all the same. He's done a good job overall as commissioner. He inherited what is known to be a pretty bad CBA from the owners standpoint, a league where players and coaches were being arrested every day, and teams were cheating left and right. He's stepped in with a better personal conduct policy, and now he's trying to put out ways in order to help stop the cheating. If you didn't think other teams are cheating in various ways, that should really change your mind. Then again, if you're still blinded by your Pats hate that you think nobody else is doing it, I guess it wouldn't matter you'll still believe Goodell only said that to protect the Pats.

You're so quick to believe the the Pats taped the Super Bowl 36 walkthrough. Why? Because Belichick cheated? Okay, then why take Matt Walsh at his word? Because he lies on his resume but since he's a former gopher who couldn't find another NFL job after being canned by the Pats (and then NFL Europe ended) he's credible all of a sudden?

I'm not saying the Pats didn't tape it, but I'm not saying they did either. God forbid I wait until he speaks to assess guilt. Which is been our major point. You're all just jumping to conclusions based on your beliefs that everything that's going to come out the Pats have done - regardless of the source or if it makes any sense. And if by some chance something comes out that shows what you thought isn't true, you blame Goodell and some conspiracy theory.

 

[Jets81]

I think the best penalty would be to remove championship banners. Also, forfeit their week 1 win over the Jets.

No way man! I don't want a week one forfeit, the seasons over and done and it benefits the Jets on no way. Perfection until it counted the most, karma (and the Giants) showed up and ***** slapped the Patriots in the Super Bowl.

Aside of that, they've already lost a draft pick so the team has payed the price. If anything happens from here on out it should be to Belichick directly imo.

 

[HaRdKoReXXX]

You guys are just so ignorant you refuse to even read what is written. MRNFLFAN, late again, nor myself have posted that everything the Pats did is okay and Goodell is protecting the NFL and that's fine almighty with us. They got caught after Goodell sent out a memo telling all teams what they were doing is illegal and not to do it, and did it anyways. They deserved to get caught and the punishment. And if you really don't believe losing a first round pick is nothing special, then we'll gladly take our second round pick back from last year for the Wes Welker trade. Look at it as you just giving up your second round pick this year, for absolutely nothing, and then tell me you still believe it isn't a justifiable punishment. Especially with a CB deep class and the Pats hurting there.

We're simply telling you that you're simple minded belief that the Pats are the only team that does it, is just that. I mean I don't know what more you need than for Jimmy Johnson to come out and flat out say he's done the same exact thing and that he also wasn't the only one. Or Herm Edwards to wave to the camera. And why have the Pats done it so well for 3 years, but not the other 4? Or how about this season when they won 17 games AFTER spygate broke. (I didn't even include the first game where the taping was stopped before halftime, couldn't be used, and the Jets obviously knew about it and thus would've changed their defensive signals before the game)

You're all spending your time trying to find conspiracy theories about how the NFL is just hiding the Pats and Kraft and Belichick instead of just taking what Goodell says. That Belichick told him all he knew, he got rid of the stuff after Glazer got hold of a tape, and if Belichick didn't tell him everything he's going to get a huge punishment.

You can say the Pats and Belichick have no integrity all you want I don't see why you feel the need to bash Goodell all the same. He's done a good job overall as commissioner. He inherited what is known to be a pretty bad CBA from the owners standpoint, a league where players and coaches were being arrested every day, and teams were cheating left and right. He's stepped in with a better personal conduct policy, and now he's trying to put out ways in order to help stop the cheating. If you didn't think other teams are cheating in various ways, that should really change your mind. Then again, if you're still blinded by your Pats hate that you think nobody else is doing it, I guess it wouldn't matter you'll still believe Goodell only said that to protect the Pats.

You're so quick to believe the the Pats taped the Super Bowl 36 walkthrough. Why? Because Belichick cheated? Okay, then why take Matt Walsh at his word? Because he lies on his resume but since he's a former gopher who couldn't find another NFL job after being canned by the Pats (and then NFL Europe ended) he's credible all of a sudden?

I'm not saying the Pats didn't tape it, but I'm not saying they did either. God forbid I wait until he speaks to assess guilt. Which is been our major point. You're all just jumping to conclusions based on your beliefs that everything that's going to come out the Pats have done - regardless of the source or if it makes any sense. And if by some chance something comes out that shows what you thought isn't true, you blame Goodell and some conspiracy theory.

I got a better idea. How bout you wait until this whole thing is over before you make anymore crybaby rants? :boohoo:

Then if Walsh is a liar who has no more incriminating evidence you can come in here and gloat all you want... about how your team only cheated a lil bit.

 

[Itsdahumidity]

You guys are just so ignorant you refuse to even read what is written. MRNFLFAN, late again, nor myself have posted that everything the Pats did is okay and Goodell is protecting the NFL and that's fine almighty with us. They got caught after Goodell sent out a memo telling all teams what they were doing is illegal and not to do it, and did it anyways. They deserved to get caught and the punishment. And if you really don't believe losing a first round pick is nothing special, then we'll gladly take our second round pick back from last year for the Wes Welker trade. Look at it as you just giving up your second round pick this year, for absolutely nothing, and then tell me you still believe it isn't a justifiable punishment. Especially with a CB deep class and the Pats hurting there.

We're simply telling you that you're simple minded belief that the Pats are the only team that does it, is just that. I mean I don't know what more you need than for Jimmy Johnson to come out and flat out say he's done the same exact thing and that he also wasn't the only one. Or Herm Edwards to wave to the camera. And why have the Pats done it so well for 3 years, but not the other 4? Or how about this season when they won 17 games AFTER spygate broke. (I didn't even include the first game where the taping was stopped before halftime, couldn't be used, and the Jets obviously knew about it and thus would've changed their defensive signals before the game)

You're all spending your time trying to find conspiracy theories about how the NFL is just hiding the Pats and Kraft and Belichick instead of just taking what Goodell says. That Belichick told him all he knew, he got rid of the stuff after Glazer got hold of a tape, and if Belichick didn't tell him everything he's going to get a huge punishment.

You can say the Pats and Belichick have no integrity all you want I don't see why you feel the need to bash Goodell all the same. He's done a good job overall as commissioner. He inherited what is known to be a pretty bad CBA from the owners standpoint, a league where players and coaches were being arrested every day, and teams were cheating left and right. He's stepped in with a better personal conduct policy, and now he's trying to put out ways in order to help stop the cheating. If you didn't think other teams are cheating in various ways, that should really change your mind. Then again, if you're still blinded by your Pats hate that you think nobody else is doing it, I guess it wouldn't matter you'll still believe Goodell only said that to protect the Pats.

You're so quick to believe the the Pats taped the Super Bowl 36 walkthrough. Why? Because Belichick cheated? Okay, then why take Matt Walsh at his word? Because he lies on his resume but since he's a former gopher who couldn't find another NFL job after being canned by the Pats (and then NFL Europe ended) he's credible all of a sudden?

I'm not saying the Pats didn't tape it, but I'm not saying they did either. God forbid I wait until he speaks to assess guilt. Which is been our major point. You're all just jumping to conclusions based on your beliefs that everything that's going to come out the Pats have done - regardless of the source or if it makes any sense. And if by some chance something comes out that shows what you thought isn't true, you blame Goodell and some conspiracy theory.

This article was probably posted since the date is Feb. 26th, but I don't think you read it:

Does Goodell want to know what Walsh has on tape?
"...Goodell had insisted that destroying the evidence in Spygate I before he’d even seen it wasn’t all that unusual. He sounded like he could move right into management with the LAPD."

"...He says he acted swiftly when the first charges were leveled at Bill Belichick for cheating, although we now have learned he acted so swiftly he fined Belichick four days before the Patriots produced the notes and tapes he sought. How do you punish someone before you know what he did?"

"...Goodell had his minions, including an attorney named Jeff Pash, who should have known better, destroy the evidence while they were in Foxborough, a move Goodell defends as “the right thing to do.†How is destroying evidence the right thing to do?"

http://www.profootballweekly.com/PFW/Commentary/Columns/2008/borges2301.htm


If it walks like a duck, quacks like a duck...

 

[shula_guy]

How do you know Goodell hasn't told the truth and how will we ever know? Maybe you and I don't agree with him destroying the tapes but that doesn't mean he covered anything up.

I myself don't believe he did. I think he asked the Patriots to turn over any more tapes of defensive signals and I believe thats exactly what he recieved.
He met with Belichick who told him his understanding of the rule and that he had always interrupted the rule that way. I think Goodell felt the leagues image had suffered enough already by the leaked tape and wanted to make sure nothing else was leaked so he destroyed them. I think his silence was nothing more than what past commisioners have done. Review the infraction hand down the penality and move on. I think he felt he had told us all we needed to know.
The NFL is big business its franchises are their product and the fans are its customers. I don't know of any other business that airs their dirty laundry in the public. Why do we somehow feel that the NFL would or should?



Tell me what your thoughts are, Do you believe Goodell is covering something up? If you do what do you think he could be covering up?

Honestly I dont know if he has or has not been completly truthful or not. The reason I dont know this is because he deystroyed the evidence that would either justify or condem his actions.

That holds the appearance of him covering something up. I dont know that he is, but I certainly do question why he felt the need to deystroy materials.

If the matter was serious enough to hand out fines and take away draft picks. A reasonable person might consider that there would be questions revolving around exactly what happened, and that person would keep everything well documented to show how and why they came to the conclusions that they came to, and handed out the fines they did.

That IMO is reasonable actions from someone who is not hiding anything, but when someone deystroys evidence, it implies that they are doing something nefarious and have a hidden agenda that they are protecting.

 

[MR NFLFAN]

This article was probably posted since the date is Feb. 26th, but I don't think you read it:

Does Goodell want to know what Walsh has on tape?
"...Goodell had insisted that destroying the evidence in Spygate I before he’d even seen it wasn’t all that unusual. He sounded like he could move right into management with the LAPD."

"...He says he acted swiftly when the first charges were leveled at Bill Belichick for cheating, although we now have learned he acted so swiftly he fined Belichick four days before the Patriots produced the notes and tapes he sought. How do you punish someone before you know what he did?"

"...Goodell had his minions, including an attorney named Jeff Pash, who should have known better, destroy the evidence while they were in Foxborough, a move Goodell defends as “the right thing to do.†How is destroying evidence the right thing to do?"

http://www.profootballweekly.com/PFW/Commentary/Columns/2008/borges2301.htm


If it walks like a duck, quacks like a duck...

"...He says he acted swiftly when the first charges were leveled at Bill Belichick for cheating, although we now have learned he acted so swiftly he fined Belichick four days

before the Patriots produced the notes and tapes he sought. How do you punish someone before you know what he did?"

But he did know what belichick did when he handed down the punishment...Lets Get the facts right.
Right after the jets tape surfaced Goodell met with Belichick. Belichick claimed he misinterrupted the meaning of the rule and that he had always understood the rule that way. That was an admission that he had videotaped since becoming a head coach which the commisioner had stated later in his PC after his meeting with Senator Specter. Therefore he knew that belichick had used video taping all along so the punishment wasn't handed down before he knew what belichick had done. He knew entirely what had been done by belichick at the time of the fines and draft pick penality because Belichick told him. The commisioner also stated if anything arose above and beyond what belichick had told him additional fines would be brought.

IMO the destruction of those tapes was done soley to insure nothing wound up on fox sports again. I think that tape leaking bothered Goodell perhaps as much as belichick's taping of signals did.

 

[Itsdahumidity]

But he did know what belichick did when he handed down the punishment...Lets Get the facts right.
Right after the jets tape surfaced Goodell met with Belichick. Belichick claimed he misinterrupted the meaning of the rule and that he had always understood the rule that way. That was an admission that he had videotaped since becoming a head coach which the commisioner had stated later in his PC after his meeting with Senator Specter. Therefore he knew that belichick had used video taping all along so the punishment wasn't handed down before he knew what belichick had done. He knew entirely what had been done by belichick at the time of the fines and draft pick penality because Belichick told him. The commisioner also stated if anything arose above and beyond what belichick had told him additional fines would be brought.

IMO the destruction of those tapes was done soley to insure nothing wound up on fox sports again. I think that tape leaking bothered Goodell perhaps as much as belichick's taping of signals did.

​

“The words ‘absurd’ and ‘ridiculous’ keep coming to my mind because he says it with a straight face.â€




“Did they know the scope of the wrongdoing before the penalty was imposed?’’ asks Pennsylvania Sen. Arlen Specter. “The answer is no.’’

"NFL commissioner Roger Goodell has changed his story more times than John Kerry changes his mind."

"First, it was nothing. Now it’s quite something. First “we’’ discovered it, then the Jets discovered it. First the Patriots “admitted it.’’ Then he remembered the Jets had a videotape of it before anyone admitted it so that probably made denying it a little difficult, even for Bill Belichick."

http://www.ronborges.com/
​

 

[MR NFLFAN]

“The words ‘absurd’ and ‘ridiculous’ keep coming to my mind because he says it with a straight face.â€




“Did they know the scope of the wrongdoing before the penalty was imposed?’’ asks Pennsylvania Sen. Arlen Specter. “The answer is no.’’

"NFL commissioner Roger Goodell has changed his story more times than John Kerry changes his mind."​

"First, it was nothing. Now it’s quite something. First “we’’ discovered it, then the Jets discovered it. First the Patriots “admitted it.’’ Then he remembered the Jets had a videotape of it before anyone admitted it so that probably made denying it a little difficult, even for Bill Belichick."​

http://www.ronborges.com/​

Scope of wrong doing? Well lets see at the time to present date NE video taped "D" signals which they admitted. Tell me what other evidence has Specter brought forward other than hunches and accusations. Its too bad he didn't persue the assination of President Kennedy with such vigor. Lets get to actual facts. Specter doesn't how the Video tapes were used or even if they were used to gain an advantage. If they were used he doesn't know which teams they were used against or which plays they were used on. At this point I'd be surprised if he could count his nads and come up with the same number twice hell I be surprised if he could find his nads.



You should do a little research on single bullet Arlen before you base all you so called "facts" on him, he's quite a piece of work.

Member of the Warren commision after the Kennedy assination
Inventor of the single gunman theory..... tried to intimidate witnesses who testified they heard 4 gun shots to change their testimony to say they only heard 3 shots. The man has a history of manipulating witnesses and the media to conform to his theories.

You'd be better off quoting stories written by Skip Bayless than
Ron Borges poster child of Blichick haters. Belichick slammed the door in that jackasses face the first week he became HC in NE. Since then he's written nothing but trash about belichick.

Ron Borges :sidelol:

 

[MR NFLFAN]

The Truth about Arlen Specter​

The Single Bullet Theory​

In Dallas Texas on November 22, 1963, two women, Jean Hill and Mary Moorman were standing on the south side of Elm Street in Dealey Plaza as Kennedy's motorcade passed. They were two of the closest eyewitnesses to President Kennedy when he was struck with the fatal head shot. Jean Hill would later be questioned by Warren Commission attorney Arlen Specter. Hill recalled her encounter with Specter with journalist/author Jim Marrs:​

"He kept trying to get me to change my story, particularly regarding the number of shots. He said I had been told how many shots there were and I figured he was talking about what the Secret Service told me right after the assassination. His inflection and attitude was that I knew what I was supposed to be saying, why wouldn't I just say it. I asked him, 'Look, do you want the truth or just what you want me to say?' He said he wanted the truth, so I said, 'The truth is that I heard between four and six shots.' I told him, 'I'm not going to lie for you.' So he starts talking off the record. He told me about my life, my family, and even mentioned that my marriage was in trouble. I said, 'What's the point of interviewing me if you already know everything about me?' He got angrier and finally told me, 'Look, we can even make you look as crazy as Marguerite Oswald [Lee Oswald's mother] and everybody knows how crazy she is. We could have you put in a mental institution if you don't cooperate with us.' ​

http://www.geocities.com/zrrifle99/​

Does that sound like a man who was interested in the truth? If he would try to manipulate a witnesses testimony over the assination of one of America's most beloved Presidents what lengths do you think he go to discredit Commisioner Goodell? It doesn't end with the Kennedy assination either. ​

 

[TomBradyWoot]

I got a better idea. How bout you wait until this whole thing is over before you make anymore crybaby rants? :boohoo:

Then if Walsh is a liar who has no more incriminating evidence you can come in here and gloat all you want... about how your team only cheated a lil bit.

Like the Dolphins did under Jimmy Johnson? No problem.

 

[TomBradyWoot]

This article was probably posted since the date is Feb. 26th, but I don't think you read it:

Does Goodell want to know what Walsh has on tape?
"...Goodell had insisted that destroying the evidence in Spygate I before he’d even seen it wasn’t all that unusual. He sounded like he could move right into management with the LAPD."

"...He says he acted swiftly when the first charges were leveled at Bill Belichick for cheating, although we now have learned he acted so swiftly he fined Belichick four days before the Patriots produced the notes and tapes he sought. How do you punish someone before you know what he did?"

"...Goodell had his minions, including an attorney named Jeff Pash, who should have known better, destroy the evidence while they were in Foxborough, a move Goodell defends as “the right thing to do.†How is destroying evidence the right thing to do?"

http://www.profootballweekly.com/PFW/Commentary/Columns/2008/borges2301.htm


If it walks like a duck, quacks like a duck...

It's also been reported now, that Belichick signed his little contract saying this is what he knew, and this is all he knew, and if anything else came up Goodell was going to punish him further and suspend him for a full year.

So really, he didn't NEED to see the tapes and information to fine Belichick, the organization, and take away the draft pick. That punishment was for being caught doing something the NFL specifically forbade and for what Belichick admitted he had done previously. If those notes and tapes produced by the Pats showed more than what Belichick had signed he admitted to - then Goodell would've suspended Belichick for a year.

So really, he did everything the right way.