Brady was never as good as they say | Page 9 | FinHeaven - Miami Dolphins Forums

Brady was never as good as they say

texasPHINSfan said:
some of you guys are mad jealous.

some like to think its the team, some like to think its the coach. bottom line was the patriots sucked before brady got there, with the SAME team and the SAME coach.

period.

Brady is no Manning, but Brady has 3 things that Manning doesn't.
-a ring
-a ring
-....and another ring.

you don't get that by being Trent Dilfer for 3 years....
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well said ! :cooldude:
 
testtubetimmy said:
In every game I watched Tom Brady play for the last few years, one thing has become increasingly evident.

This guy is not Peyton Manning.

In fact, I'd venture to say he's not a great quarterback at all.




He just has one heck of a team backing him up. And thats why the Patriots are so great. And they get to the superbowl. Because they dont have one or two or even three great players. They have a team of good players who work so well together.

Theres a reason Brady didnt go until the sixth round. He isnt amazing. He just fits perfectly into the system that BB has. The guy has all the time to throw in the world behind that line. He's got recievers who for some reason or another, always catch the god forsaken ball, the defense is tough as nails, and together, the team works. You put Brady behind our line or perhaps any other line in the NFL and I'll tell you what happens. Remember the MNF game when we beat them last year? Remember that HORRENDOUS throw he made that was intercepted at the end of the game? You get pressure on him, rattle him, and he turns into Jay Fiedler.

So where am I going with this? My point is, maybe Feeley and Frerotte arent great quarterbacks either. But maybe the teams who have won the superbowl the last few years havent had amazing quarterbacks, but amazing teams, that could work together. And the teams with quarterbacks we'd die for (Indianapolis, Philly, Atlanta, Minnesota, etc) always come up short. If Frerotte or Feeley fit into the system and our team works together like a well oiled machine, we will stomp our way to the top.

So this saturday, I hope that Saban doesnt go for Alex Smith, a guy I've been supporting for a long time. Because a Franchise QB like Dan Marino is always fun to root for. But how many SB's did we win?

Saban is serious, and I think he realizes that its the team, not the QB, that wins games.
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I disagree very, very much. He's the coolest QB in the pocket in the entire NFL and carried the Patriots offense in 2001 when they had no running game. Tom Brady may not be the most talented QB in the NFL but he's clutch. For some reason he struggles against us though as last season he was a combined 24-47 for 247 yards with 4 TD's and 5 INTS vs us in both games. Like I've always said we would have been going in for the tie at the end of the first game had our field goal kicker not hurt himself in warmups. Tom Brady is the best CLUTCH QB in the league right now and don't even mention Peyton Manning for Clutch. He crumbles like the Buffalo Bills in the Super Bowl whenever he plays NE and in a lot of pressure situations.
 
testtubetimmy said:
In every game I watched Tom Brady play for the last few years, one thing has become increasingly evident.

This guy is not Peyton Manning.

In fact, I'd venture to say he's not a great quarterback at all.




He just has one heck of a team backing him up. And thats why the Patriots are so great. And they get to the superbowl. Because they dont have one or two or even three great players. They have a team of good players who work so well together.

Theres a reason Brady didnt go until the sixth round. He isnt amazing. He just fits perfectly into the system that BB has. The guy has all the time to throw in the world behind that line. He's got recievers who for some reason or another, always catch the god forsaken ball, the defense is tough as nails, and together, the team works. You put Brady behind our line or perhaps any other line in the NFL and I'll tell you what happens. Remember the MNF game when we beat them last year? Remember that HORRENDOUS throw he made that was intercepted at the end of the game? You get pressure on him, rattle him, and he turns into Jay Fiedler.

So where am I going with this? My point is, maybe Feeley and Frerotte arent great quarterbacks either. But maybe the teams who have won the superbowl the last few years havent had amazing quarterbacks, but amazing teams, that could work together. And the teams with quarterbacks we'd die for (Indianapolis, Philly, Atlanta, Minnesota, etc) always come up short. If Frerotte or Feeley fit into the system and our team works together like a well oiled machine, we will stomp our way to the top.

So this saturday, I hope that Saban doesnt go for Alex Smith, a guy I've been supporting for a long time. Because a Franchise QB like Dan Marino is always fun to root for. But how many SB's did we win?

Saban is serious, and I think he realizes that its the team, not the QB, that wins games.
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:shakeno:

I see what you are saying, and I started believing it when the Ravens won the Superbowl with Dillhole at QB. But Brady is great. He throws an accurate ball, makes great decisions, has superb leadership and cool under pressure, has a strong arm too (not just accurate). So what else do you want in a QB to say he's great? True, he probably does not throw as well with his left hand, but he has learned to adapt to cover that weakness!:confused:

I'm not even a Brady fan, in fact I'm very jealous. But I'd make a case that Montana benefitted from the Walsh system and throwing to Rice (but I will not do that because I know Montana was great too) before I'd say that Brady wasn't as good as people think. I'm sure the team thing is at play, but Brady did a lot to contribute to those teams, not just Bellicheck. Trust me, they would not have won 3 bowls with Fiedler!
 
dolfanmark said:
Brady makes every throw when he needs to make them. I'd rather have that than a guy who throws 35 TD passes every year, but disappears in the playoffs.
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We all would.:)
 
F150&Dolfan said:
I disagree very, very much. He's the coolest QB in the pocket in the entire NFL and carried the Patriots offense in 2001 when they had no running game. Tom Brady may not be the most talented QB in the NFL but he's clutch. For some reason he struggles against us though as last season he was a combined 24-47 for 247 yards with 4 TD's and 5 INTS vs us in both games. Like I've always said we would have been going in for the tie at the end of the first game had our field goal kicker not hurt himself in warmups. Tom Brady is the best CLUTCH QB in the league right now and don't even mention Peyton Manning for Clutch. He crumbles like the Buffalo Bills in the Super Bowl whenever he plays NE and in a lot of pressure situations.
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Actually his running game was better than you throught that year, but his OL is fantastic, he gets all kinds of time to throw, behind our OL last year he would have made as many mistakes as AJ, the monday nighter showed that.
He's a good QB in a good system. If he wasn't a good QB he couldn't run that system so effectively, and I agree, he's not great, when he tried to take over and the pats tried to throw more the year after their first sb, you saw the results, he needs a decent RB behind him, and that OL to keep doing what they do. If our OL improves I really expect AJ to improve too, more time to throw with his arm will give us way more completions and better decisions. The best decisions are made when you have more than 2 seconds to make them.
 
merlin00069 said:
As would i. He gets it done under pressure. Period. That alone merits him being a "great QB". I know he's not Peyton Manning, and id still take Manning any day of the week and twice on sundays but Brady is pretty darn good.
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Although, we have not seen Manning operate at the same level without a good RB. The second superbowl for the Pats was done very much through the air first, with a very average running game. Edgerin James hasalways helped Manning's play action game. Too bad Marino never had one.
 
He's more the result of great coaching than of the system. He might not have been the best QB coming out of college or in his first few years but the guy can make some amazing throws (including four to our team on monday night ;)). He's not Peyton Manning, he's not Brett Favre, he's not Donovan McNabb, and despite all the stupid comparisons he's not Joe Montana. He is, however, a winner and a good player.
 
popularwar said:
He's more the result of great coaching than of the system. He might not have been the best QB coming out of college or in his first few years but the guy can make some amazing throws (including four to our team on monday night ;)). He's not Peyton Manning, he's not Brett Favre, he's not Donovan McNabb, and despite all the stupid comparisons he's not Joe Montana. He is, however, a winner and a good player.
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exactly. which was all i was trying to say. good player. not god. thank you.
 
Ok then. Since 3 SBs. 2 MVPs. With Longest winning streak in history dont seem to make a QB great. What does? By your logic there must only be.....1 maybe 2 great QBs.

I dont think anyone thinks hes god but you need to give him his due. Just bc hes not a 1st round stud draft pick and throws 70 yards on his knees ( we all know how handy that is) the guy has done more than any other QB has done since Montana.

I dont care what the system is...no system beats teams in todays NFL the way this team has without a GREAT QB.
 
Tom Brady is a great player. Troy Aikman was considered a great player during his time and I think his team was far superior to Brady's team, as were Montana's 9ers. Before this year his starting RB was Antowain Smith, and while the Pat's WR core is deep, it lacks a true number 1 IMO. I don't think an arguement can be made that Brady is the best player on the Patriots and the most important, so saying that the Phins can get by with average Qb play is a stretch IMO. Aj was not average last season at all, he was inconsistent and at his best he was average but he was more frequently a very poor Qb. Look at the Bills who had a stud rb, 2 very good wr's, an improved OL, and a great defense, but they could not get to the playoffs because Bledsoe was average.
 
You know....I've read all nine pages of this thread.....and STILL can't figure out what its doing outside of the AFC East forum.....

That said....to argue Tom Brady isn't great is simply foolish.
 
If he plays another 5-7 yrs, and just puts up average numbers he is a lock for the hall of fame. 3 rings alone puts him close, and the fact he is undefeated in the playoffs is just crazy. Like it or not QBs get the credit for such stats.
I really don't know what you are using as a base for saying he is not a super QB, but QBs that know how to win in the clutch and prove it time after time, are doing what they are paid to do. Brady throws alot of quick 3 steps routes and always knows exactly how much time he has, and seems to always know exactly where to go with the ball, no matter how you disguise your coverage. He is as smart, (whether it be good coaching or good QBing doesn't matter) as he needs to be, and can make all the throws. Add to that his post season winning percentage and you have to be smoking something to say he is not great. I am not saying he is Marino, but if you are trying to compare Feeley to him you really need to see someone. Feeley could be on a team with weapons like the Colts have and still not throw as many touchdowns for his team as for his opponents.
I hate Brady with a passion, but it is because he always wins the close ones, not because he is overrated.....at least that is the way I see it.
 
You can make a strong case for either side..

Great team surrounding, great system, bad arm strength, low yards per game, etc

OR

Great accuracy, 4th quarter composure, 2 Superbowls, smarts, low INT to pass attempt ratio, etc.

Tee, I agree with you, that he doesn't look like he's doing anything out of this world when you watch a game BUT you can't argue with the results.

We'll learn a lot about Tom Brady this year when he doesn't have his best buddy in the whole wide world on the sideline...
 
Not 2, but 3 SuperBowls.....my QB can suffer from lepracy, have two left arms, and suffer from amnesia...but as long as he gets me those rings i can care less what people think of him. Tom Brady is a top 4 QB regardless of athletic ability

1.Manning
2.McNabb
3.Culpepper
4.Brady
 
SkapePhin said:
He is clutch, end of story.

And No QB achieves "Greatness" without a good supporting cast.. Joe Montana doesnt become JOE MONTANA if he spends his career in a Cardinals uniform..
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Speaking of Joe Montana if what the original poster said were true then I guess you could take Montana off the list of greatest QB's of all time then too. :shakeno:

:rolleyes:
 
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