Clarification on Ireland, FA and Draft

[ANUFan]

First and foremost this is NOT in defense of Mr. Ireland at all. If unfortunately, the house needs to be cleaned then J.Ireland needs to be the first to go. Now onto my point: Why is J.Ireland blamed for the teams entire shortcomings? Let me clarify:

I 'm sure most of you would agree it's VERY UNLIKELY that any position via FA or the Draft is selected or brought in SOLEY on J.Irelands own merits. I strongly would think between scouting and position coaches and coordinators and the Head Coach is how the majority of decision are made on players/positions and then someone like J.Ireland pulls the trigger.


The points is this: NO DOUBT J.Ireland is a poor GM at this juncture BUT isn't what's more telling: The people that can and do advise him on those respective player/positions are worst than he is? Specifally because they are the "experts" at their specific talent.

Think about it. Does anyone feel comfortable/Confident with M.Sherman advising/taking/using an Offensive Talent or the O/L coach on Player-X? Aren't these the people that likely told J.Ireland that, "hey that guy can help this team" and that's how someone like Dallas Thomas got drafted?


The buck definitely stops with J.Ireland, But I don't think there are many GMs that are more sound at the X's and O's than those people that are supposed to me experts at it.

 

[Dthrill_08]

Why do Fireland supporters hate the man so much? Last year we were weak in the secondary he drafted Davis and Taylor although, injured doesn't matter he fixed those needs and signed Brent Grimes which is a great pick up.
WR - we signed Wallace and Gibson which btw Gibson is a great pick up.
TE - we signed Keller which got injured but lets blame and bash Ireland for not buying Keller protective gear lol.
Oline- we tried to resign Long he chose to leave. We signed Clabo that he definitely sucked for us this year but he was a pro bowler and I remember correctly many Finhaven members wanted him over the other 2 (forgot their names).
RB - Ok we were all high on Miller but we should of tried to resign Bush which we gave him a decent contract.
Pass rush was weak so we drafted a legit player in Jordan. Man I can't wait till he is healthy.
We cut Dansby and Burnette and saved alot of cap for doing so. We got faster LB. It is debatable which 2 are better.

So now I ask you what has he done so wrong? Let me guess he didn't give us Probowlers at all positions right? No GM will do that, fact most GM's fail to draft great year in and year out. Tell me which GM/Team draft starters or pro bowlers in each round?

We went 3-0 praise the fins. We lose 3 in a row to 2 tough teams and one winnable game against the Bills and the sky is falling. I am as mad as anyone else but man I hate reading such negativity. We could easily be 5-1

 

[mmikel30]

It's not debatable ...we downgraded at linebacker

 

[J. David Wannyheimer]

Why do Fireland supporters hate the man so much?

I don't hate the man at all and in fact I've been called an Ireland apologist as recently as a week or so ago.

But. But. It's very simple.

Year after year, the Miami Dolphins - under general manager Jeff Ireland -- trot out a football team with massive deficiencies at one position or another. Last year we sucked at CB and were absolutely lousy at wide receiver, to the point that throughout the year the team kept signing and cutting guys on a week to week basis to start opposite Brian Hartline. That's on the GM.

This year, we are making a desperation trade for a guy who may or may not be only average in pass blocking because our tackle situation is so dire that our franchise QB is getting brutally murdered on three step drops.

And I don't want to hear one more defense of the Clabo signing. Yup, I thought it was a good signing, and I wanted him over Eric Winston or some of the other guys being mentioned. And I was wrong. I was very wrong. And I'm not being paid millions of dollars to know better. Jeff is.

 

[Dthrill_08]

I don't hate the man at all and in fact I've been called an Ireland apologist as recently as a week or so ago.

But. But. It's very simple.

Year after year, the Miami Dolphins - under general manager Jeff Ireland -- trot out a football team with massive deficiencies at one position or another. Last year we sucked at CB and were absolutely lousy at wide receiver, to the point that throughout the year the team kept signing and cutting guys on a week to week basis to start opposite Brian Hartline. That's on the GM.

This year, we are making a desperation trade for a guy who may or may not be only average in pass blocking because our tackle situation is so dire that our franchise QB is getting brutally murdered on three step drops.

And I don't want to hear one more defense of the Clabo signing. Yup, I thought it was a good signing, and I wanted him over Eric Winston or some of the other guys being mentioned. And I was wrong. I was very wrong. And I'm not being paid millions of dollars to know better. Jeff is.

Thanks I appreciate that. You seem like a reasonable guy so my question is how is Ireland supposed to get a replacement for Clabo 6 weeks into the season. There aren't many FA that are worth a look the other option is trading but most fans are against it.Yes we may bench him and start a different RT maybe Garner or Yeatman but then that is on the Coaches not Ireland.

 

[UFGators]

Because ultimate responsibility for football operations lies in Ireland.

 

[Spesh]

I don't hate the man at all and in fact I've been called an Ireland apologist as recently as a week or so ago.

But. But. It's very simple.

Year after year, the Miami Dolphins - under general manager Jeff Ireland -- trot out a football team with massive deficiencies at one position or another. Last year we sucked at CB and were absolutely lousy at wide receiver, to the point that throughout the year the team kept signing and cutting guys on a week to week basis to start opposite Brian Hartline. That's on the GM.

This year, we are making a desperation trade for a guy who may or may not be only average in pass blocking because our tackle situation is so dire that our franchise QB is getting brutally murdered on three step drops.

And I don't want to hear one more defense of the Clabo signing. Yup, I thought it was a good signing, and I wanted him over Eric Winston or some of the other guys being mentioned. And I was wrong. I was very wrong. And I'm not being paid millions of dollars to know better. Jeff is.

I almost long for the days when we'd simply trot out a team with massive deficiencies.

Year after year we not only trot out a team with deficiencies, we trot them out, have them exposed, still do nothing, have them exposed for a few more weeks, cut them months to late, then make a kneejerk reaction to "fix" the problem.

This has happened damn near every year. Will Allen/Benny Sapp. Bobby Carpenter. Jake Grove/Joe Berger. Marc Colombo. Legedu Naanee. Etc, etc, etc, etc. Year after year we make the same mistakes.

 

[Dr. Phin]

How many times do we have to explain this? There are none so blind as he who will not see...

If you can't figure it out, there is no point in explaining it; as you don't want to understand it...

 

[TheWalrus]

First and foremost this is NOT in defense of Mr. Ireland at all. If unfortunately, the house needs to be cleaned then J.Ireland needs to be the first to go. Now onto my point: Why is J.Ireland blamed for the teams entire shortcomings? Let me clarify:

I 'm sure most of you would agree it's VERY UNLIKELY that any position via FA or the Draft is selected or brought in SOLEY on J.Irelands own merits. I strongly would think between scouting and position coaches and coordinators and the Head Coach is how the majority of decision are made on players/positions and then someone like J.Ireland pulls the trigger.


The points is this: NO DOUBT J.Ireland is a poor GM at this juncture BUT isn't what's more telling: The people that can and do advise him on those respective player/positions are worst than he is? Specifally because they are the "experts" at their specific talent.

Think about it. Does anyone feel comfortable/Confident with M.Sherman advising/taking/using an Offensive Talent or the O/L coach on Player-X? Aren't these the people that likely told J.Ireland that, "hey that guy can help this team" and that's how someone like Dallas Thomas got drafted?


The buck definitely stops with J.Ireland, But I don't think there are many GMs that are more sound at the X's and O's than those people that are supposed to me experts at it.

He's not solely at fault. But who's saying he's solely at fault? If it's me I'm firing all kinds of people. The bodies would be stacked in every room and spilling out into the parking lot. Davie would look like a scene from Escape from New York.

The question to ask you is... do you think another GM would do better with the same people advising him? Because otherwise this whole exercise you're doing isn't worth much.

Now for me, I think the answer is yes, and I'll give you a case study in what I mean. Look at the two major wide receiver acquisitions since Ireland has been GM: trading two 2nd round picks for Brandon Marshall and signing Mike Wallace. Both were mistakes, and both were mistakes in the similar ways.

In the case of Marshall, Ireland's mistake was in trading for a receiver a) before he had a quarterback worth building around, b) who was a malcontent, and c) was stylistically incompatible with the quarterback he did have. Marshall thrives on trust. He doesn't get great separation, but he can make contested catches. That's not Henne. He needs to see it. He's too robotic to throw to a guy who's covered. Also, he's a shrinking violet. He's not the kind of guy who can confront Marshall, who basically walked all over him.

Now Henne and Marshall are gone and here we've got Tannehill, a guy who wants to be a surgeon and tries to play football like one. Who thrives on precision and consistency. So who does Ireland sign? Mike Wallace, a sloppy route runner who's a broken play, run around and make plays kind of receiver. It's not a stylistic match anymore than Henne and Marshall were a stylistic match, which I tried to tell everyone this Spring.

It was an obvious error. And tellingly -- despite the fact that we have an entirely different coaching staff -- it's the same error as the one Ireland already made only three years ago. What does that tell you?

Now you can sit here and try to say it's on Brian Gaine or the pro scouting department in general. But I'd say two things to that. First of all, Jeff Ireland can fire any one of the people who work for him whenever he wants if he thinks he's been given bad advice. He hasn't. Which goes to the second thing, which is that there's a reason one person is given final say over football decisions. It's because that person is in charge. And since 2008 -- by the explicit terms of his contract -- that person has been Jeff Ireland. It's like digging out a wart, you start with him and keep on cutting until you're at something fresh. Only then you start over.

 

[Dthrill_08]

here we've got Tannehill, a guy who wants to be a surgeon and tries to play football like one. Who thrives on precision and consistency. So who does Ireland sign? Mike Wallace,

Mike Wallace was the best WR available in FA. Do you remember who was the 3rd best receiver available? Yea it was Hartline. So what do you suggest we do for our WR problem?

 

[roy_miami]

Mike Wallace was the best WR available in FA. Do you remember who was the 3rd best receiver available? Yea it was Hartline. So what do you suggest we do for our WR problem?

The greatest teams have always been built through free agency, it is known.

 

[Dthrill_08]

The greatest teams have always been built through free agency, it is known.

Yes I know that but another person said that "who does Ireland sign? Mike Wallace" like if he was a bad pick up which in reality he was the best WR.

 

[FSU Truth]

Yes I know that but another person said that "who does Ireland sign? Mike Wallace" like if he was a bad pick up which in reality he was the best WR.

Available....I would argue that Bowe would have been a better pick up....

The Dolphins traded way one of the top 10 guys in the NFL then a year later sign a great complimentary WR and then try to sell everyone on the idea that he's can be the Alpha of the core...come on.

 

[ANUFan]

It was an obvious error. And tellingly -- despite the fact that we have an entirely different coaching staff -- it's the same error as the one Ireland already made only three years ago. What does that tell you?

Now you can sit here and try to say it's on Brian Gaine or the pro scouting department in general. But I'd say two things to that. First of all, Jeff Ireland can fire any one of the people who work for him whenever he wants if he thinks he's been given bad advice. He hasn't. Which goes to the second thing, which is that there's a reason one person is given final say over football decisions. It's because that person is in charge. And since 2008 -- by the explicit terms of his contract -- that person has been Jeff Ireland. It's like digging out a wart, you start with him and keep on cutting until you're at something fresh. Only then you start over.

All fair points! Considering we have just about everything new and are still having some of the same problems can only reasonably be attributed to J.Ireland. I'm just of the opinion that Ireland "rarely" overrides the OC/DC and other coaches on whom "they" think would be great for our system. I could be wrong and a GM does that all the time and pick "his" guy against the input of everyone else. But, I seriously doubt that's how it works.

Hell, when the Dolphins were on Hard Knocks it seemed pretty apparent to me that, yes while J.Ireland has final say, rarely was any decision made without serious Input from the other coaches.

 

[dlockz]

Why do Fireland supporters hate the man so much? Last year we were weak in the secondary he drafted Davis and Taylor although, injured doesn't matter he fixed those needs and signed Brent Grimes which is a great pick up.
WR - we signed Wallace and Gibson which btw Gibson is a great pick up.
TE - we signed Keller which got injured but lets blame and bash Ireland for not buying Keller protective gear lol.
Oline- we tried to resign Long he chose to leave. We signed Clabo that he definitely sucked for us this year but he was a pro bowler and I remember correctly many Finhaven members wanted him over the other 2 (forgot their names).
RB - Ok we were all high on Miller but we should of tried to resign Bush which we gave him a decent contract.
Pass rush was weak so we drafted a legit player in Jordan. Man I can't wait till he is healthy.
We cut Dansby and Burnette and saved alot of cap for doing so. We got faster LB. It is debatable which 2 are better.

So now I ask you what has he done so wrong? Let me guess he didn't give us Probowlers at all positions right? No GM will do that, fact most GM's fail to draft great year in and year out. Tell me which GM/Team draft starters or pro bowlers in each round?

We went 3-0 praise the fins. We lose 3 in a row to 2 tough teams and one winnable game against the Bills and the sky is falling. I am as mad as anyone else but man I hate reading such negativity. We could easily be 5-1

I dont get why not how thinking he is not a good gm makes someone an ireland hater.
Your points

So because we drafted a positon means he fixed those needs? I guess u forgot he created the holes at secondary but drafting guys and them not being here anymore. Davis and Taylor have provided no answer at corner as of yet. We basically have Brent Grimes and that is it .
Wr another hole he created then had to overspend because he couldnt draft the guy or sign him. TE well we have been looking for a TE for years and its not like Keller wasnt already damaged goods. Solid risk signing but we knew it was a rental. RB best point , we have money and Bush would not have hurt our cap.
We also saved nothing cutting Dansby or Burnett we just decided to pay the money later on. Ellerbee based on one good season makes as much as Dansby who is playing better than Ellerbee elsewhere. As for Wheeler , he makes more than Burnett. Faster who knows , younger yes but Im pretty sure they are similar in speed and the replacements are definately not better and in long run not cheaper.

Irelnd has been the GM now for 5 years and , he is the main builder of a team that has had a winning season in 5 years so yes he has to take blame.