Concern over Ireland finishing the year

[Shouright]

so once again, you ignore what i am asking. Do you think Dion Jordan is a bust and will never amount to anything close to JT? If you and others were honest, and not speaking politically because of just hatred for the man because he asked about momma being a prostitute.

I'm saying we don't know what he or the other players on the list are going to be, and so you can hardly post a list of that sort as a testament to Ireland's prowess.

 

[JayCee]

This. It is like Wannstache drafting Fletcher when he has Madison and Surtain on the roster. Wasted pick when there are so many holes elsewhere.

Man why did you bring this up?? This is the pick we should've taken on Drew Brees. I remember like it was yesterday. But ofcourse, we had Jay Fiedler.

 

[Gonzo]

What Ireland is responsible for..

We are one of the best pass-rushing teams in football. #4 to be exact. Including the #5 leader in the NFL in sacks "Olivier Vernon"
We have three of the league’s top 16 defensive tackles.
We have allowed the third-fewest passing touchdowns in the NFL (12).
Only one WR has caught a TD.. ALL ****ING YEAR..
#9 Scoring Defense
#3 in INT..
A QB who has a passer rating of 87, 6 Td's to 4 Picks, and Over 1300 Yards in The last 5 Games.
Group Of Players's that's THE LEAST PENALIZE ON OFFENSE IN THE LEAGUE..
Top 10 IN PLAYS OF +20 AND +40 YARDS.
Top 10 In Passing Yardage
Top 10 In Completion Percentage
Two WR's that's going to eclipse the 1,000 Yard Mark Each..
#2 Opponents Passer Rating

Signed Grimes, Drafted Carroll, Drafted Clay, Jimmy, Matthews, Hartline, Signed Wallace, Drafted Vernon and Odrick, both having Pro-Bowl Type seasons. Finally found us a QB who's Ranked #7 according to pro-football focus. Signed Patterson. Drafted Clemons top 5 safety in coverage.

With a young QB, and Young head coach at the helm this team has lost the most amount of games by the fewest amount of points.

Salary cap in good shape for the next three years.

Still have our first 4 picks in this draft.

The 9th Youngest team in the league..

But the NOISE just won't stop..God I so hope we continue to win so you hater can eat so much crow, when this young team he has assembled finally learns how to win. Especially games, Like Carolina, and New England. I guess only time will tell..In life there's always a who's right and who was proven to be wrong..We shall see..

Tell me more.

 

[phishxhead]

um, no, he is not avg. He continuously burns CB's long and short. Great route runner. great big play guy on 3rd down. Great tip toer on the sideline.

please dont you get crazy. Hartline would be snagged up by 4/5ths of the league if he were on the market.

He is a good #2 wide receiver that does some things well which is my definition of an average starting WR.

 

[DDTDON]

You people need to realize he is not going to be fired before the end of the season. I doubt he even gets fired. These Fireland threads need to ****ing stop already....

 

[Gonzo]

I could argue with you all day no problem on why he doesnt suck azz. But I wont convince you. So whats the diff. People who hated Ireland will always hate Ireland no matter what he does good. People who make arguements against him deny all the good.

That's kind of how discussions work, right? People have different opinions and discuss their viewpoints. I could make a blanket statement like "you deny all the bad" too I suppose, but I don't think that's the case.

Anyways, where have I denied all the good? He has made some very good moves. Grimes, Wake, etc. Hell, I'll even give him credit for attempting to bring in a legitimate star receiver, though that has yet to pan out. And he FINALLY addressed THE MOST IMPORTANT POSITION IN FOOTBALL (sorry, it's not LT). I give him a lot of credit for that. He certainly understands the game more than the dummies we had before him (I seem to remember having these discussions when they were on the brink of being fired too). Unfortunately, he's also made some horrible ones. I believe you have been a big critic of the offensive line. Who built that line? Who drafted Martin (you were no doubt against that draft pick, right?)? Who kept one of the dirtiest players in the NFL with multiple on and off the field issues? Who drafted a thug for a center who is rumored to have been running guns and is close friends with an alleged murdering thug? Who has been fine with John "Ben &" Jerry despite constant weight issues? Who brought in Clabo (I don't mark him off much for that though because nobody saw a decline of the magnitude we have in that turd)? And who created almost no depth behind all of them?

He's constantly a reactive GM. He only addresses a position when it's a huge need outside of the DL, which is for some reason the only unit he's proactive with. He's also completely failed to add depth to any position outside of the defensive line. I had a hard time telling if you were posting that list of players in support of firing or keeping Ireland, because it could really go either way. But we could go back and forth on what each of consider talent, and we have many times in the past, so let's skip it and move on to one of the main reasons I think he needs to be fired:

It is abundantly clear that he and Philbin simply cannot work together. Ireland drafts players and signs free agents that may be talented, but simply do not fit the scheme Philbin and Co. are implementing, and he doesn't give a ****. He's going to continue drafting and signing whoever the hell he wants. I want a GM and coach that can work together and build a winning team. We do not have that. One or both of them need to go, and I'm willing to bet it's Ireland.

 

[LandShark13]

He's constantly a reactive GM. He only addresses a position when it's a huge need outside of the DL, which is for some reason the only unit he's proactive with. He's also completely failed to add depth to any position outside of the defensive line. I had a hard time telling if you were posting that list of players in support of firing or keeping Ireland, because it could really go either way. But we could go back and forth on what each of consider talent, and we have many times in the past, so let's skip it and move on to one of the main reasons I think he needs to be fired:

All someone has to do is go back to the last offseason to see this simply is not true. We did not accumulate as much cap room as we had and still have simply by being reactionary. That was clearly something that was in the works for several years and even after all the signings he left us in good shape for the next several years. Clearly a proactive move.

It is abundantly clear that he and Philbin simply cannot work together. Ireland drafts players and signs free agents that may be talented, but simply do not fit the scheme Philbin and Co. are implementing, and he doesn't give a ****. He's going to continue drafting and signing whoever the hell he wants. I want a GM and coach that can work together and build a winning team. We do not have that. One or both of them need to go, and I'm willing to bet it's Ireland.

Curious on your opinion on this. Who has irish drafted that doesn't fit Philbins system? Everything I have seen tells me Philbin has a hand in all player acquisitions. Also please explain how they can't work together and provide links because you seem to be breaking a story I must have missed.

 

[finfan54]

I'm saying we don't know what he or the other players on the list are going to be, and so you can hardly post a list of that sort as a testament to Ireland's prowess.

and you cant say he sucks.

 

[finfan54]

That's kind of how discussions work, right? People have different opinions and discuss their viewpoints. I could make a blanket statement like "you deny all the bad" too I suppose, but I don't think that's the case.

Anyways, where have I denied all the good? He has made some very good moves. Grimes, Wake, etc. Hell, I'll even give him credit for attempting to bring in a legitimate star receiver, though that has yet to pan out. And he FINALLY addressed THE MOST IMPORTANT POSITION IN FOOTBALL (sorry, it's not LT). I give him a lot of credit for that. He certainly understands the game more than the dummies we had before him (I seem to remember having these discussions when they were on the brink of being fired too). Unfortunately, he's also made some horrible ones. I believe you have been a big critic of the offensive line. Who built that line? Who drafted Martin (you were no doubt against that draft pick, right?)? Who kept one of the dirtiest players in the NFL with multiple on and off the field issues? Who drafted a thug for a center who is rumored to have been running guns and is close friends with an alleged murdering thug? Who has been fine with John "Ben &" Jerry despite constant weight issues? Who brought in Clabo (I don't mark him off much for that though because nobody saw a decline of the magnitude we have in that turd)? And who created almost no depth behind all of them?

He's constantly a reactive GM. He only addresses a position when it's a huge need outside of the DL, which is for some reason the only unit he's proactive with. He's also completely failed to add depth to any position outside of the defensive line. I had a hard time telling if you were posting that list of players in support of firing or keeping Ireland, because it could really go either way. But we could go back and forth on what each of consider talent, and we have many times in the past, so let's skip it and move on to one of the main reasons I think he needs to be fired:

It is abundantly clear that he and Philbin simply cannot work together. Ireland drafts players and signs free agents that may be talented, but simply do not fit the scheme Philbin and Co. are implementing, and he doesn't give a ****. He's going to continue drafting and signing whoever the hell he wants. I want a GM and coach that can work together and build a winning team. We do not have that. One or both of them need to go, and I'm willing to bet it's Ireland.

I dont know that he and philbin and he cannot work together. How do you know that? That is one of my end all reasons for letting Ireland go. I just dont know that yet. How do you? I havent heard one bad word uttered by Philbin or any body language that suggests that. No maybe there are dissagreements, but saying they cant work together is very strong assumption.

 

[Gonzo]

I dont know that he and philbin and he cannot work together. How do you know that? That is one of my end all reasons for letting Ireland go. I just dont know that yet. How do you? I havent heard one bad word uttered by Philbin or any body language that suggests that. No maybe there are dissagreements, but saying they cant work together is very strong assumption.

A couple of reasons. One is the fact I mentioned before, that Ireland drafts and signs players that don't fit the schemes they run. Second comes from a discussion he had with us web nerds in which he states he can't force the coaches to play the players he drafts, with some very obvious frustration. It was clear that they aren't on the same page. You really expect a coach to come out and speak out against the GM publicly? Hell, I was surprised Ireland said what he did to us.

 

[Gonzo]

Curious on your opinion on this. Who has irish drafted that doesn't fit Philbins system? Everything I have seen tells me Philbin has a hand in all player acquisitions. Also please explain how they can't work together and provide links because you seem to be breaking a story I must have missed.

Jordan, Dallas Thomas, and Egnew are a few off the top of my head. You want a link to my opinion? Link

 

[finfan54]

All this discussion has led me to think is that

1. There is a lot of hatred for Ireland for whatever reason
2. There is alot to be determined yet and it all comes down to Tannehill in the end. Our success relies on RT making progress. To me, he is but with a ton more upside should we land a big TE, rebuild the Oline, and our FA and young draft picks blossom next year like I think they can. It is showing in many instances.

my biggest worry is that we end up with someone who is not prepared day one to do this job or will have to start some "new attitude" that all is really needed is stay the course and go one more year where they all get to prove it in 3 years or your gone! Thats just how I see it. Its fair. Its a league wide acceptance that someone needs 3 years to make their team in their image, ect. ect.

That way, next year, there are no excuses and the preperation can begin early to make the big change again. But not in midstream IMO. There is too much talent getting used to the system now. And I do not believe next year we will fail. That is where my convictions lie. Its not so much about Ireland as it is the whole package.

 

[Gonzo]

All this discussion has led me to think is that

1. There is a lot of hatred for Ireland for whatever reason
2. There is alot to be determined yet and it all comes down to Tannehill in the end. Our success relies on RT making progress. To me, he is but with a ton more upside should we land a big TE, rebuild the Oline, and our FA and young draft picks blossom next year like I think they can. It is showing in many instances.

my biggest worry is that we end up with someone who is not prepared day one to do this job or will have to start some "new attitude" that all is really needed is stay the course and go one more year where they all get to prove it in 3 years or your gone! Thats just how I see it. Its fair. Its a league wide acceptance that someone needs 3 years to make their team in their image, ect. ect.

That way, next year, there are no excuses and the preperation can begin early to make the big change again. But not in midstream IMO. There is too much talent getting used to the system now. And I do not believe next year we will fail. That is where my convictions lie. Its not so much about Ireland as it is the whole package.

Again, I don't "hate" Ireland. I just don't think he's the right man for the job. A decent scout (except for O-line), but that's about it. And it always seems to be "next year."

 

[finfan54]

A couple of reasons. One is the fact I mentioned before, that Ireland drafts and signs players that don't fit the schemes they run. Second comes from a discussion he had with us web nerds in which he states he can't force the coaches to play the players he drafts, with some very obvious frustration. It was clear that they aren't on the same page. You really expect a coach to come out and speak out against the GM publicly? Hell, I was surprised Ireland said what he did to us.

The only blurb I heard was that there was dissagreement on playing the rookies earlier and with more PT. I dont know this for sure but that is my assumption. But I dont think this would have mattered when we lost to Buffalo and the Ravens.

That is more on coaches IMO. Sherman went far too long without the use of TE's knowing our Oline sucked and the use of shotgun way too much with that happening is the reason we lost some of these games. He had two very capable blocking TE's and he wasnt using them. Now he does.

 

[finfan54]

Again, I don't "hate" Ireland. I just don't think he's the right man for the job. A decent scout (except for O-line), but that's about it. And it always seems to be "next year."

The hate part is just an overall observation from alot of people on Finheaven.

I am very willing to listen to anyone who can convince me at this point that a new GM will make things better. I think Ireland has done a pretty good job if you consider the rest of the league. One more year unless Philbin and Ross think they can move forward with a GM who will fit. Thats the bottom line because none of us on here would really have any clue who that guy might be. There is too much unkown.