Dolphins blew it with passing on Herbert

[Mach2]

He also had a head start as Tua was coming off an injury and hasn't had an offseason to workout just rehab. Let's talk next year when they are on a more even playing field.

The problem with that theory, assuming it's valid, is that the thingscat which TT was supposed to be far superior, have nothing to do with physical ability.

Nobody thought Tua's physical prowess was in Herbert's class to begin with.

What does rehab have to do with reading, anticipation, and processing?

I certainly agree that we haven't even gotten past the opening credits of this story line.

I'm just not seeing this particular arguement as a huge difference.

 

[gerblack]

So now its Herbert's fault his team has lost 7 games? Several of which the Chargers held double digit leads. So 7 losses as to 4 losses makes Tua the better QB? Am I understanding this correctly? GTFOH!!!!

Did he stop scoring in second half? Then yes he owns some of the blame.

 

[gerblack]

The problem with that theory, assuming it's valid, is that the thingscat which TT was supposed to be far superior, have nothing to do with physical ability.

Nobody thought Tua's physical prowess was in Herbert's class to begin with.

What does rehab have to do with reading, anticipation, and processing?

I certainly agree that we haven't even gotten past the opening credits of this story line.

I'm just not seeing this particular arguement as a huge difference.

I don't know what does getting used to the speed and more complicated defenses of the NFL and tighter windows of the NFL have to do with reading, anticipation, and processing? I mean people always say the Qbs coming out of college never have to get used to the speed of the NFL or the fact that the DB's don't give you 3-5 yard windows like in college right? Not playing football for a long time due to injury and getting back to full strength definitely would not slow down some of his normal anticipation combined with the other factors right?

 

[Mach2]

I don't know what does getting used to the speed and more complicated defenses of the NFL and tighter windows of the NFL have to do with reading, anticipation, and processing? I mean people always say the Qbs coming out of college never have to get used to the speed of the NFL or the fact that the DB's don't give you 3-5 yard windows like in college right? Not playing football for a long time due to injury and getting back to full strength definitely would not slow down some of his normal anticipation combined with the other factors right?

Yes, but those things are true, to some extent, of any rookie, at most positions.

I didn't say it was irrelevant. I just am not so sure of the true impact.

Since it isn't quantifiable, who can say for sure?

 

[Soxfinatic]

Your history teacher came out, but it should have been an English teacher for better reading comprehension. I said against US he was throwing nothing but screen passes.

But it's fine. You can be like Bills fans who believed Allen jumped 10% completion percentage because he's just so great instead of the team trading for Diggs, same way when guys like Keenan Allen, Mike Williams, and Hunter Henry aren't affecting Herbert's ability to actually play QB instead of throwing it to the open man on his limited reads. When they were covered by us, his stats fell off a cliff so he got a taste of what it's like for Tua every single game where nobody is open.

Maybe next time your math teacher comes out so I don't have to hear about how listing box score numbers count as facts of anything.

Haha, I love the banter. Well said! Not arguing his talent level is better around him, that's for sure. Let's put this to bed. You're response was hilarious!

 

[Kamelion4291]

Fun fact: Chargers are the 2nd worst 4th quarter scoring team in the NFL.

I wonder why...

 

[ToondaGoat]

Newsflash: When you're up by 17+ points, the only way the other team can come back is if your offense stops scoring. I don't need to hear about the unfortunate events that happened at the very end of the game to lose. I'm talking about the large amount of plays before that which never happened because Herbert is a front runner, same as in college.

I'm not saying that's him forever, but it's a legitimate flaw that people pretend doesn't exist and it's annoying.

Or teams make comebacks because coaches begin to get conservative and call games to not lose, rather than secure the win. You also keep talking about Herbert not going through his reads, which isnt true. He is throwing tds to multiple UDFA'S (3 to be exact). His game vs Mia, he was taking what they gave him and coaches were conservative and Allen criticized the coaching not Herbert. CHARGERS coaches were shook by that exotic amoeba cover 0 defense. Miami was doing things vs Herbert they haven't put on tape all year.

Against Mia Herbert still had 14 completions to WRs/TEs.

Same number Tua had vs an inferior vanilla defense. Every comeback opportunity Chargers have had, his team has let him down, with the only exception being probably Mia. Who knows what happens if 6'4 Williams doesnt slip and let Howard get the outside leverage for the int.

Herbert, like Tua and every qb to ever play and every player to ever play has his flaws... but it isn't anything to do with being "unclutch"

 

[ToondaGoat]

Fun fact: Chargers are the 2nd worst 4th quarter scoring team in the NFL.

I wonder why...

Because of coaching... it's pretty universally known.

 

[Kamelion4291]

Or teams make comebacks because coaches begin to get conservative and calls games to not lose, rather than secure the win. You also keep talking about Herbert not going through his reads, which isnt true. He is throwing tds to multiple UDFA'S (3 to be exact). His game vs Mia, he was taking what they gave him and coaches were conservative and Allen criticized the coaching not Herbert. CHARGERS coaches were shook by that exotic amoeba cover 0 defense. Miami was doing things vs Herbert they haven't put on tape all year.

Against Mia Herbert still had 14 completions to WRs/TEs.

Same number Tua had vs an inferior vanilla defense. Every comeback opportunity Chargers have had, his team has let him down, with the only exception being probably Mia. Who knows what happens if 6'4 Williams doesnt slip and let Howard get the outside leverage for the int.

Herbert, like Tua and every qb to ever play and every player to ever play has his flaws... but it isn't anything to do with being "unclutch"

I mean, that's not even remotely true. That same defense destroyed Goff not too long ago. We didn't do anything against Herbert that we haven't done to other QBs.

 

[Kamelion4291]

Because of coaching... it's pretty universally known.

See, this type of rationale is why Herbert is going to get a ton of coaches fired throughout his career.

It's all Herbert when the team builds a lead, but all the coaches' and defense's fault that they lose it.

Don't say I didn't warn you.

 

[Soxfinatic]

Man you don't watch Chargers games at all.

Herbert is why they were up 11 vs KC in the 4th. Defense then plays prevent and offense plays conservative. KC needs 2 58 yd kicks to win in OT.

Vs Panthers, with 1:35 left from within own 5 yd line, 0 timeouts he drove them all the way down to Panthers 19th yd line and was a dropped pitch and ladder from Ekler from a walk off td.

Vs Bucs lit up one of the best defenses only to have his defense give up 5 tds to Brady and his rookie rb fumble on Chargers own 5 yd line setting uo quick td for TB before half.

Vs NO lit up another good defense and drove team to win game only to have kicker miss game winner.

Williams lets pass go right through his hands in the endzone for the 4th Herbert td vs same defense that destroyed tua. Williams catches that and its game over. Chargers d also folded against 1 of the worst qbs in lock.

Vs Raiders Williams and Parham in back to back sequences drop game winning tds.

Only game you can even come close to saying Herbert came up short was vs Miami. But again, Williams slips on his route, Howard cuts it outside and gets int. But alot of that game was coaches being unprepared and shook of Miami's amoeba cover 0 defense that was throwing some of the most exotic stunts, disguises and blitzes anyone has seen in past 10 years.

Tua will be fine, he needed a bad game, he needs another one or 2.. to get that taste in his mouth that he didnt get in college. So that he sees NFL isnt easy and doesn't take it for granted. But these weak Herbert takes arent it. It's clear you don't watch Chargers games. Only vs Mia and think thats how he has looked all year.

Even his bad game was nearly 200 yds and 3 total tds.

My guy here is on ! You went on a 5-6 post rampage with actual facts. Nobody will acknowledge it and they will say your facts are wrong and misguided but facts nonetheless! How dare you bring stats into this! How dare you have an opinion other than Tua is better right now than Herbert. How dare you! Just like politics, you'll never change their minds but nice work my friend!

 

[Kamelion4291]

Because of coaching... it's pretty universally known.

Also fun fact: Did you know that Herbert has thrown more passes in the 4th quarter than any other quarter? Kind of goes against that "conservative" narrative, doesn't it?

 

[Soxfinatic]

See, this type of rationale is why Herbert is going to get a ton of coaches fired throughout his career.

It's all Herbert when the team builds a lead, but all the coaches' and defense's fault that they lose it.

Don't say I didn't warn you.

You act as if they are waiting each game for him to implode like Ryan Tannehill would. When you were just waiting on the big turnover or the bad throw. In the NFL, they buckle down from time to time and get stops (unless you're Miami against Denver). The defense for San Diego has been brutal in second halves. This kid has done everything to keep them in games. Again, your opinion is your opinion and we'll see in 3, 4, 5 years but right now...

 

[ToondaGoat]

See, this type of rationale is why Herbert is going to get a ton of coaches fired throughout his career.

It's all Herbert when the team builds a lead, but all the coaches' and defense's fault that they lose it.

Don't say I didn't warn you.

You do realize playing conservative isnt about attempts passing right? Herbert, the big choker is completing 70% of his passes in the 4th, with a 94 passer rating and 4 tds with 2 ints. 1 vs Tampa when his defenses choked away a 17 point lead and vs Mia.

Look i get it for you to feel better about Tua's showing, you have to convince yourself Herbert sucks... this aint it though bro. Every single statline and game tape says otherwise. It's ok that Herbert is having an all time rookie season (if not best ever) that doesnt diminish Tua or what he will become.

 

[BigNastyFish]

Fun fact: Chargers are the 2nd worst 4th quarter scoring team in the NFL.

I wonder why...

Play-calling.

Herbert needs a better OC.