Don't be Surprised . . .

[ronnieb_23]

You need to have a coach to develop drafted players no matter what round they are drafted in. Unless you expect a first round pick to come to the NFL learn absolutely nothing else in their career and develop no other skills then I don't know what to tell you. How many years have we had good coaching with player development while Grier has been in the scouting dept or as GM? Not all Grier's fault as we have churned through some GMs over the years. Ross can accept responsibility for that. Give Allen and Mckenzie a chance to help with the situation. People just want someone to blame to vent about and take out their frustration on.

You also need a good GM/scouting department to get the right players and talented players for the coach.

It goes both ways. If you have one without the other then things don't work how they should. The FO and coaching staff needs to function as a team. Which is probably something Grier understood and given Flores background in scouting both sides can communicate valuable information to each other.

We just have to let it play out and hope it works out.

 

[raving]

I think a great qb is gonna shake free in free agency - Aaron Rodgers....plus $130 million buys Miami 10 to 15 players....draft 10...udfa 3 to 5 and Miami has 5,6,7 players on both sides of the ball that currently are not on roster....

 

[BennySwella]

In addition Josh Rosen has to be counted as part of that draft. If you look at FAs plus the draft Grier has done a fine job. This draft upcoming will be his biggest test. I think that Flores is here now so we're much smarter.

I do look at Josh Rosen as part of that draft. And the way we got fleeced out of 2 picks for a guy who isn't the future is part of the reason Grier sucks as a GM.

A guy whose production up to this point could be mirrored by many. We could have drafted Gardner Minshew with either of the picks we traded for Josh Rosen and still picked up another player.

But no... instead we picked up a glorified project quarterback who isn't ready for the big time and I am supposed to laud this GM with praise. I hope Chris Grier gets a season ending injury... actually I hope he gets a career ending injury like Tua just did. Where is Vontaze Burfict when you need him?

 

[13marino13]

I do look at Josh Rosen as part of that draft. And the way we got fleeced out of 2 picks for a guy who isn't the future is part of the reason Grier sucks as a GM.

A guy whose production up to this point could be mirrored by many. We could have drafted Gardner Minshew with either of the picks we traded for Josh Rosen and still picked up another player.

But no... instead we picked up a glorified project quarterback who isn't ready for the big time and I am supposed to laud this GM with praise. I hope Chris Grier gets a season ending injury... actually I hope he gets a career ending injury like Tua just did. Where is Vontaze Burfict when you need him?

Have you ever considered taking quaaludes? You're gonna blow a gasket man, relax a bit and take it down a notch. For your own self-preservation...

 

[Highzenga]

I like that they want good guys and team first guys and all that but they need to be careful.....that's how you end up with players like Charles Harris......this team needs top talent and in the past Grier have drafted players base on how much he liked the person instead of how much he liked the player.

Haven’t we basically always drafted “good guys?” I get that we need to draft high football IQ players being that our system seems a bit more complex than in the past but this is a physical sport. I want a couple of guys that lay the wood so other teams fear playing us.

 

[Vaark]

LOL, I have no doubt about that. Although I've read the Phins are trying to change the narrative about what happened concerning Jackson between Grier and Ross. Sadly, I couldn't read the Mando article about it. Not subscribed.

https://www.miamiherald.com/sports/spt-columns-blogs/armando-salguero/article237782404.html

 

[ATL_PHIN_FAN]

https://www.miamiherald.com/sports/spt-columns-blogs/armando-salguero/article237782404.html

Thanks Vark, BSQ helped me get to the article using my browser's incognito mode. I finally figured out what that was for! lol

Interesting article, and Mando was emphatic about his take on it. He's not typically a homer, either. It's good information to know.

 

[BennySwella]

Have you ever considered taking quaaludes? You're gonna blow a gasket man, relax a bit and take it down a notch. For your own self-preservation...

Lol. I am actually not stressed at all I just don't want the Dolphins to suck anymore and I am not going to accept mediocrity.

I am fine that you guy are ok with being one of the worst teams in the league, but I know football and I am not just going to accept everything that happens as "God's plan."

Everyone on here is happy with a 3 win team that hasn't done **** for decades. I personally want my team to win.

My favorite basketball team dominated the NBA so I am not starved for a championship but that era of dominance let me know how winners look like and this team is full of losers from the top down. Sorry if you guys don't like it. You don't have to attack my character just because you don't agree but if you can't back up your argument with facts what else can you do I guess.

 

[mwestberry]

Lol. I am actually not stressed at all I just don't want the Dolphins to suck anymore and I am not going to accept mediocrity.

I am fine that you guy are ok with being one of the worst teams in the league, but I know football and I am not just going to accept everything that happens as "God's plan."

Everyone on here is happy with a 3 win team that hasn't done **** for decades. I personally want my team to win.

My favorite basketball team dominated the NBA so I am not starved for a championship but that era of dominance let me know how winners look like and this team is full of losers from the top down. Sorry if you guys don't like it. You don't have to attack my character just because you don't agree but if you can't back up your argument with facts what else can you do I guess.

I'm not sure anyone is attacking your character … but it does look like most folks have read your tired rants over and again and they may be over it ...

You have presented the "problem" many times but I can't recall you posting the answer/solution ... unless "fire Grier" is your end all ... if so that's not really a complete solution ... why not post who would be a better GM? Tell us why you think so ... it could open a dialogue worth reading ...

I can't recall who you would draft (except in retrospect .... why not post a mock draft so we can see how it compares to Griers draft?

Your constant tirade is boring after awhile along with your sarcastic use of "championship" ... why not state why you feel signing a certain player is a dumb move?

Just saying ... since you "know football" and are a self proclaimed "Professional Armchair GM Extraordinaire" show us something that backs it up ... anybody can complain and anybody can look at the past with scrutiny and say we should have or could have ...

Not attacking you my friend just offering an opinion … I could be wrong

 

[13marino13]

Lol. I am actually not stressed at all I just don't want the Dolphins to suck anymore and I am not going to accept mediocrity.

I am fine that you guy are ok with being one of the worst teams in the league, but I know football and I am not just going to accept everything that happens as "God's plan."

Everyone on here is happy with a 3 win team that hasn't done **** for decades. I personally want my team to win.

My favorite basketball team dominated the NBA so I am not starved for a championship but that era of dominance let me know how winners look like and this team is full of losers from the top down. Sorry if you guys don't like it. You don't have to attack my character just because you don't agree but if you can't back up your argument with facts what else can you do I guess.

I'm sure I speak for just about every fan on here, no one is "ok" with being one of the worst teams in the league and we ALL want to win. Most posters realize there is nothing we can do or say that will directly influence team performance. So I don't agree many posters are ok with it. No one is ok with it.
Realizing this fact there are two ways to look at it, the proverbial half-full/half-empty glass fits. Some people choose to argue it from the negative viewpoint which, in our current state, is a much easier argument. It's easier to look at the situation and criticize it because so much has gone wrong and there is plenty of subject matter. Some posters are negative by nature and will always look for the negative and are quick to point it out. The things you point out are quite obvious and in plain view to all. Some posters choose to be optimistic because that's all we have right now and we choose to find and hold on to the few positives in the pile and make no mistake, there are positives to build on. No one is happy about decades of mediocrity, we just choose to continue to hold onto hope for the future, because that's all we can do as fans. The past is in the past.
For you, to suggest we are "ok" with it is a meritless statement, we just choose to be more positive in our approach when interacting with other posters. You receive negative responses because you are promoting negativity, what do you expect? It's like someone not letting go and reminding you every chance they get about a mistake you made 10 years ago. It is what it is, move on. We are all personally vested in our team in our own way, you're entitled to your opinion but to keep pounding the table promoting your negative views and putting down anyone who holds onto hope is getting old, we stink, we get it. We all know we're not a good team right now, you don't need to keep reminding us because there isn't a single thing we can do about it. Am I ok with it? No, I just choose to take a different view of it and express my viewpoint accordingly. You're like a black cloud around here, stop criticizing those who are seeking the positives and are optimistic about our future. You can continue expressing your negative opinions, just be respectful of others when doing it and no one will rain on your parade. You are entitled to that the same as we are.

 

[Snoop]

The decision to keep Grier while letting Gase and Tannenbaum go didn’t really make much sense on the surface. Essentially absolving Grier of blame for the 3 seasons he worked together with the other two men as one collaborative, collective unit where no one guy was fully in charge (this is the description that was given to us by them several times) was misguided. And that doesn’t even touch on the 9-10 years that he was the GM’s most trusted voice in the draft room as scouting director and all it led to was poor draft after poor draft.

I touched on this before but again I feel that there was pressure around the league to keep Grier as the last black GM. As a black man myself I think it’s pretty cool we have so many men of color in the front office and on the coaching staff, however, if say a group like the Fritz Pollard Alliance made some noise behind the scenes to pressure Ross to not only keep but also hand the keys to the kingdom to a fairly average talent evaluator than strictly as a fan of the team that’s disappointing.

 

[Vaark]

I'm sure I speak for just about every fan on here, no one is "ok" with being one of the worst teams in the league and we ALL want to win. Most posters realize there is nothing we can do or say that will directly influence team performance. So I don't agree many posters are ok with it. No one is ok with it.
Realizing this fact there are two ways to look at it, the proverbial half-full/half-empty glass fits. Some people choose to argue it from the negative viewpoint which, in our current state, is a much easier argument. It's easier to look at the situation and criticize it because so much has gone wrong and there is plenty of subject matter. Some posters are negative by nature and will always look for the negative and are quick to point it out. The things you point out are quite obvious and in plain view to all. Some posters choose to be optimistic because that's all we have right now and we choose to find and hold on to the few positives in the pile and make no mistake, there are positives to build on. No one is happy about decades of mediocrity, we just choose to continue to hold onto hope for the future, because that's all we can do as fans. The past is in the past.
For you, to suggest we are "ok" with it is a meritless statement, we just choose to be more positive in our approach when interacting with other posters. You receive negative responses because you are promoting negativity, what do you expect? It's like someone not letting go and reminding you every chance they get about a mistake you made 10 years ago. It is what it is, move on. We are all personally vested in our team in our own way, you're entitled to your opinion but to keep pounding the table promoting your negative views and putting down anyone who holds onto hope is getting old, we stink, we get it. We all know we're not a good team right now, you don't need to keep reminding us because there isn't a single thing we can do about it. Am I ok with it? No, I just choose to take a different view of it and express my viewpoint accordingly. You're like a black cloud around here, stop criticizing those who are seeking the positives and are optimistic about our future. You can continue expressing your negative opinions, just be respectful of others when doing it and no one will rain on your parade. You are entitled to that the same as we are.

The very definition of "fan" is a derivative of "fanatic" which for all intents and purposes means "uncritical love and devotion to...."

True fans of course want to win, but short of that, want to feel good about their team so it's natural to grasp at straws. And to me, to extract what they have out of this mostly ragtag group, justifies feeling good about our coaching staff going forward.

Yes, as fans we are powerless to influence most changes and it's true that while some prefer to see a glass half full, others are wired to see it half or more than that as emptied. It's the just human nature no matter the object of anyone's affection. So while scriptures has every right to be critical and unaccepting of the present product, he is off-base when it comes to taking other "fans" to task for looking for the hopeful lights and hoping they shine bright at the end of a relatively short tunnel.

 

[Vaark]

The decision to keep Grier while letting Gase and Tannenbaum go didn’t really make sense on the surface. Essentially absolving Grier of blame for the 3 seasons he worked together with the other two men as one collaborative, collective unit where no one guy was fully in charge (this is the description that was given to us by them several times) was misguided. And that doesn’t even touch on the 9-10 years that he was the GM’s most trusted voice in the draft room as scouting director and all it led to was poor draft after poor draft.

I touched on this before but again I feel that there was pressure around the league to keep Grier as the last black GM. As a black man myself I think it’s pretty cool we have so many men of color in the front office and on the coaching staff, however, if say a group like the Fritz Pollard Alliance made some noise behind the scenes to pressure Ross to not only keep but also hand the keys to the kingdom to a fairly average talent evaluator than strictly as a fan of the team that’s disappointing.

You may have a point about Greer that resonates. It's one I didn't consider cuz I thought all the blowback Ross received for his political patronage and the resulting unseating on that committee gave him pause about the flack he'd get for firing Greer. But in hindsight, it's not like Goodell never influenced teams "to do the right thing" as evidenced by the unworthy drafting (complete with on site cameras) of Michael Sam as a quid pro quo for Stan Kroenke to move the Rams back to LA. That one was so obvious, I called/predicted the eventual outcome as it was happening.

I would hope Ross recognized something in Grier that he saw in people who achieved in his RE kingdom, but maybe not. If it's a consolation, Marvin Allan and Reggie McKenzie are the real deals who can only serve as positive influences. At the time, I was hoping that as the only black GM, Grier would have attracted the help of Ozzie Newsome which would have been a slam dunk.

Again, as declared in my previous post in this thread, as a fan, I can only hope for the best.

 

[ATL_PHIN_FAN]

The very definition of "fan" is a derivative of "fanatic" which for all intents and purposes means "uncritical love and devotion to...."

True fans of course want to win, but short of that, want to feel good about their team so it's natural to grasp at straws. And to me, to extract what they have out of this mostly ragtag group, justifies feeling good about our coaching staff going forward.

Yes, as fans we are powerless to influence most changes and it's true that while some prefer to see a glass half full, others are wired to see it half or more than that as emptied. It's the just human nature no matter the object of anyone's affection. So while scriptures has every right to be critical and unaccepting of the present product, he is off-base when it comes to taking other "fans" to task for looking for the hopeful lights and hoping they shine bright at the end of a relatively short tunnel.

Suggest we improve our game here for the sake of everyone's enjoyment.

Nitpicking, while ignoring proven abilities or achievements that don't suit an agenda; can be irritating, off-base and disingenuous. Nuff said.

 

[fansinceGWilson]

The decision to keep Grier while letting Gase and Tannenbaum go didn’t really make sense on the surface. Essentially absolving Grier of blame for the 3 seasons he worked together with the other two men as one collaborative, collective unit where no one guy was fully in charge (this is the description that was given to us by them several times) was misguided. And that doesn’t even touch on the 9-10 years that he was the GM’s most trusted voice in the draft room as scouting director and all it led to was poor draft after poor draft.

I touched on this before but again I feel that there was pressure around the league to keep Grier as the last black GM. As a black man myself I think it’s pretty cool we have so many men of color in the front office and on the coaching staff, however, if say a group like the Fritz Pollard Alliance made some noise behind the scenes to pressure Ross to not only keep but also hand the keys to the kingdom to a fairly average talent evaluator than strictly as a fan of the team that’s disappointing.

I really struggle with that. First, the years of Philbin/Gase had one coach (Philbin) who saw no need to give the FO a hint on what he needed - position or fit. Then, Philbin decided which of those draftees he wanted and where he wanted them AND, apparently, with little coaching. Gase . . . we all know. There's a reason a number of players leaving Miami have found good homes on other teams. That doesn't absolve Grier, but it mitigates the blame. 'Collaboration' doesn't mean 'equal say.' I doubt there was a vote on each draft prospect. More likely, a number of people had input. Most here have had input in their jobs, but that doesn't mean equal say.

Baum? For his tenure, many here blamed HIM for the bad drafts. He controlled the draft room and FAs. That didn't mean Grier had NO blame, but there's a reason not all teams dump an entire FO.

Scouting? You're right on Grier. OTOH, I don't think it's coincidence he brought in people highly respected for their knowledge of evaluating talent. Admittedly, no one knows how that will work out.

I'm a fan of Grier in how he's handled salaries/cap/trades. To date, fans have seen a number of players brought in by churn who've appeared to play well. Not all of them, but there's a reason they were available. I'm agnostic on drafting. The 2018 class seems to be a clear improvement over previous years. The 2019 class has no stars, but Wilkins and Deiter are starters (and should mature in year 2), Cox is getting significant snaps, AVG and Gaskins show promise. Needham, Laird, and Williams are clear successes. Ledbetter flashed promise, but, admittedly, is unknown. In the NFL that's called an average draft and a better evaluation can be made next winter.

Again, I'm not praising Grier, but the FO had had a lot of changes and whether those changes work or not is unknown. I think fans should withhold judgement till there is more evidence.